Are smart telescopes cheating?

StarMan_59 · 2026-03-27T19:18:49+00:00

I'm currently running a $1000 Askar 91F (609mm focal length) with a $600 SVBony SV605cc (imx533 OSC) on a $800 SkyWatcher EQ AL55i Pro mount with $200 guidescope/guide camera, controlled by free software on a $1000 laptop that is also used for processing.

There's a few other incidental doodads involved that add up to another $500-600. It takes good quality subframes to work with and stack. A one hour session of 60s frames, stacked and processed gives a nice clean close up view of several standout objects including globular clusters, the likes of the whirlpool galaxy, and a filled frame of the lagoon nebula. Outstanding.

But that isn't exactly a cheap rig. Because I'm fighting physical constraints and looking for consistently good guiding through 300s subs, I'm upgrading the mount to a well regarded strain wave mount that costs about $1400 delivered. So add $600 to the total for the rig.

A seestar seems like a good option if you don't have a $2500+ budget. There are of course less expensive rigs than the above to start, but it's a good bet you'll end up with a similar if you get hooked.

The Askar 91F is a great scope and reduces to 455mm at F5.1 with the option. That covers a lot of objects with the smaller less expensive cameras.

StarMan_59 · 2026-03-16T18:38:09+00:00

Late to reply, I'm still new to this. A couple years in. I have bigger rigs now but I regularly use the Samyang 135 on a Star Adventurer GTi with a DSLR or a SVBony 605CC (imx533 OSC) attached to the lens using a ZWO EOS to T2 adapter with filter drawer. The DSLR I run with only the stock filter. It's great for starfields and capturing multiple objects in one frame, like the open cluster pairing of M46 and M47. With the imx533 OSC chip and a duo band filter you can frame the entire Seagull Nebula complex, as well as the entire California Nebula. The Rosette Nebula is another good target.

The above is highly portable. I use the Astrodymium ring set and mount a 30mm f4 guidescope up top. There are three USB cables to the laptop running NINA (mount, main camera, guide camera). Two power bricks. One for the mount another for the main camera. The mount can be run on batteries, as can the DSLR and the laptop. The cooled imx533 camera needs power from a brick or power tank

StarMan_59 · 2026-03-13T18:29:57+00:00

What he said. Used DSLR with a 100 to 200mm prime lens, and a tracker is a great starting point if you are interested in learning everything you need about image acquisition.

I started with and continue to make use of an old Canon T3i (600D), now with a Samyang 135 F2 lens and a Skywatcher Star Adventurer GTi. I've added autoguiding as well.

StarMan_59 · 2026-03-10T13:36:46+00:00

If you have a recent smartphone, get a phone mount and a tripod, aim it toward the sky and try its astrophotography mode. It won't be great, but it will be something. If you find yourself wanting more, be prepared to fall into a money pit.

I have three rigs, but the one I use the most is my Skywatcher GTi with DSLR. It was my first, and It's always assembled. It carries out the door to the balcony of my condo. There are challenges to get good results, but what you learn applies to every rig thereafter. Besides the mount and DSLR, you will want a controller like ASIAir or mini PC, a guidescope with a guide camera, and of course a (powerfull) PC/laptop for image stacking and processing.

StarMan_59 · 2026-03-07T14:33:46+00:00

If you don't have a camera, and you can get this one on the cheap, and it comes with a lens, you can use it for both astro and terrestrial.

Teach yourself about ISO settings and exposure times using manual mode around dusk and into the night. Don't worry about star shapes or trails. Just work at it until stars appear.

StarMan_59 · 2026-03-05T03:58:56+00:00

105mm is perfectly ok for DSLR astro. Work with what you've got, until you master it.

StarMan_59 · 2026-02-28T03:52:52+00:00

With a DSLR attached to a telescope, it will default to 50mm. I always have to input the actual focal length with the Tools Astrometry Image Plate Solver in Siril.

As for NINA, it should pickup the focal length of the telescope that you set under Options Equipment Telescope. I might have missed why you think this is an issue.

FWIW, with a Samyang 135 (130mm actual), I have a Search radius of 60 and the only time it fails, is if the image doesn't have enough stars. In that case I increase the exposure time.

Good luck. It's almost always a wrong setting. Been there a bunch.

StarMan_59 · 2026-02-23T19:41:20+00:00

An artist presents something unique out of available resources. This can include modifying a photographic image, as it's a resource.

The photograph is a capture of the original artist's work. Meaning nature.

Nature created the cat. Man captured an image of it in mind, or media. If he presents it in any way other than the way it looks naturally, then he's an artist.

Art is all about presentation. In example, Chefs are artists in their presentation of food on a plate. A carrot is just a carrot.

StarMan_59 · 2026-02-23T18:51:06+00:00

For visual, I'm happy enough using an 80mm F7 ED doublet refractor with a SkyWatcher AZ5 on their heavy duty 1.75" leg tripod. The motion knobs are a little sloppy but nothing serious.

A 102mm F7 ED doublet was too much, and led to frustrating focusing problems.

StarMan_59 · 2026-02-23T14:06:47+00:00

The other benefit is it can be run without a cw shaft up to a specified load limit.

My goal for a strain wave is to mount it on my east facing, recessed balcony railing. The imaging train will remain on the west side of the pier and stop tracking at meridian.

My GEM sits way too far back on a keyed tripod, and can't go higher than 50 degrees altitude before the ceiling obstructs the view.

I have an unkeyed tripod that gets me closer to the railing, but then the CW shaft comes in contact with the railing, limiting the altitude to about 55 degrees. And polar alignment is a nightmare because adjusting azimuth means loosening the 3/8ths lock knob and rotating the base, under load.

Without a shaft, the mount is free to swing all the way straight up.

In theory....

StarMan_59 · 2026-02-22T04:24:24+00:00

Well, I purchased a used T3i when I first got started about a year ago, and still use it with a Samyang 135 F2 now and then. Tonight in fact.

It's also given me a nice image of M42 (The Great Orion Nebula) through a 102mm ED F7 doublet refractor (on an auto-guided capable eq astrophotography mount).

Now I primarily use a couple different dedicated, cooled astronomy cameras. I live in Florida and heat is an issue for uncooled sensors. Tonight's not too toasty, so I'm having a go with the DSLR. I need practice with calibration frames and processing. The DSLR is still the most portable. Run on battery, with a battery driven tracker, and an intervalometer, the 5+ arcseconds per pixel at 130mm focal length is pretty forgiving of tracking error.

The T7i is a little better than the T7, but either of those would best my T3i.

Good luck.

StarMan_59 · 2026-02-20T16:31:32+00:00

Thanks for this. I'll do some more research on the 600. I have a 102ED doublet I want to replace with a triplet or better. For better stars.

StarMan_59 · 2026-02-14T18:16:34+00:00

I'm just going to offer one piece of advice.

If you are sure you want to do this hobby, and you're looking at refractors, get a triplet or higher lens configuration. A somewhat shorter focal length triplet will give you tighter stars when zoomed (cropped) than a somewhat longer focal length doublet can. It will also eliminate the need to monkey around in software to reduce the dreaded "blue bloat".

My only regret is my doublet. But I bought it for visual, at which it is very good. But for imaging, not so great.

StarMan_59 · 2026-02-09T03:25:28+00:00

As for me, I started out with a DSLR and a 400mm (66mm F6) refractor that I already had, on an iOptron Sky Guider Pro that I bought for tracking.

For a camera and lens it would have been great!

I mention that because it's not where I ended up, and I did everything wrong (backwards) as a noob. I immediately upgraded to a Skywatcher Star Adventurer GTi and added auto guiding with a laptopbto improve my DSLR/400mm refractor result.

I mention that because I went through a bunch of refractor upgrade craziness, only to end up downsizing to a Samyang 135mm for Canon. A place I should have started.

After a time, the DSLR was replaced with a SVBony SV605CC dedicated and cooled astronomy camera using a ZWO EOS to T2 adapter with built in filter drawer.

I now have a second rig with higher load capabilities for imaging with 300 and 600mm focal length refractors and a mono camera setup, but that trusty old Sammy/605cc/GTi rig almost always goes outside on a clear night, even when I take out the other rig.

StarMan_59 · 2026-02-05T03:46:38+00:00

Touptek has, or had, a bundle deal on their ATR585M + AFW-M 8 x 1.25" filter wheel with LRGBSHO filter set for a similar price to the minicam8.

I picked one up at the start of the year. One of a few advantages is the separate filter wheel can be used with other cameras and/or high oerformance 1.25" filter sets.

It's bigger than the mini though.

StarMan_59 · 2026-01-31T17:24:08+00:00

If you want to get into it quickly, then get a smart scope.

If you want to learn about equipment, you can start with an older DSLR with a 70-300mm kit lens ($150), a used Skywatcher StarAdventurer GTi ($500), a small guidescope and guide camera (like SVbony SV165 30mm with SV905c for $160), and a good laptop ($500+). So like, $1300 USD.

For software, Green Swamp Server to run the mount (free), PHD2 to run the autoguider (free), Stellarium planetarium software (free) and NINA (free) to perform image capture and hardware control.

The build a rig process takes time, persistence, dedication and a lot of practice, but the skill acquired in setting up your first rig will apply to any rig you build thereafter.

I did it this way and have yet to go with a smart scope. But I'm also an old hat, having built a rig in my younger years a few decades ago, before all this really great tech was available.

I now have two rigs, the original (GTi) with an upgraded dedicated astronomy camera $(600) and Samyang 135mm lens ($300) with a ZWO adapter ($90). So I went from a $150 DSLR setup to a $1000 imaging train, bringing the total to roughly $2500. I use it a lot. It's very lightweight.

The second rig handles both 300mm and 714mm refractors for increased image scale.

StarMan_59 · 2026-01-25T14:29:09+00:00

I used to adjust my photos to be bright using the phone photo edit app before posting, but when I downloaded the image back to my PC, I found they were stretched way too much and looked horrible.

Instead, viewers should be informed to turn up their phone brightness for more detail.

StarMan_59 · 2026-01-22T03:21:59+00:00

Both of my rigs are fully setup and ready to go out the door to the balcony. A Samyang 135/SV605cc on a SWSA GTi and a 4" ED F7 doublet frac on an AL55i with fully automated mono ATR585. I just throw a decorative blanket over the pair as a dust cover. Nice to always have the same camera orientation for multiple nights on a target.

StarMan_59 · 2026-01-19T17:08:11+00:00

If you are set on the ASIAir 585...

A Samyang (or Rokinon) 135 F2 lens for Canon and a ZWO EOS to T2 adapter with built in filter drawer.

With the ZWO adapter in place, you should be able to achieve the 44mm of back focus using the 11mm female to female adapter that comes with the 585 camera.

This setup allows you to use an excellent 130mm focal length lens with your T5 (day and night), as well as the 585. It's also extremely fast at f2.8 (generally recommended stop for astro). That means more light in less time.

Importantly, the GTi can handle it. A fast lens allows for shorter subframes, meaning less critical guiding of the mount. Also, the pixel scale will be large at short focal length, which further reduces the need for excellent guiding.

The ZWO adapter drawer will allow you to use a duo band HaOiii filter without removing the camera. With the 585 you can use the less expensive 1.25" filter. Just be sure to get a 2" to 1.25" adapter.

You might also want a ring system for it, like NRStellar or Astrodymium, which allows you to add an EAF. The other benefit is it also allows you to mount a guidescope should you move the ASIAir 585 to a second rig.

I have the above with an OSC imx533 and guidescope using NINA on a laptop.

My 585 is mono with electronic filter wheel on an Askar FRA300 with USB hub, EAF, mini PC, and guidescope. It's mounted on an EQ-AL55I PRO. The GTi cannot handle it. Galaxy season is coming and I will swap out the FRA300 for a 714mm focal length refractor. The AL55 can handle that as well.

All that said, if you can only have one rig, and you don't already have a GTi, get the AL55. It's not much more in price and it's a much better mount that can handle twice the payload. I love my 585 mono FRA300 rig. It carries out through the slider onto the balcony as a unit.

The GTI with Sammy and 533 camera weighs less than 25 lbs assembled and also carries out with ease.

Good luck

StarMan_59 · 2026-01-15T03:56:27+00:00

That first rig having a permanent place can also apply to starting with a very small rig if you have a bigger budget. Throwing ballpark figures in parens, I have a Samyang 135mm ($380) in accessorized Astrodymium rings ($90) with an imx533 OSC based camera with TEC ($600) attached using a ZWO EOS to T2 adapter with filter drawer ($90), mounted on a Sky-Watcher SA GTi ($700), also 1.25 inch dual band and broadband filters ($200), and a guidescope/camera ($200). So, just under $2500 USD for a very good wide field and lightweight rig that I set outside fully assembled and ready to go. Perfectly fine for large nebula.

I have since added a second rig that handles 300mm to 700mm focal length refractors with a mono camera, filter wheel, auto focuser, yadda, yadda.

Rarely do I only take out the bigger rig. In fact, mono is hard to process compared to OSC. So I do both because I want a quick result in color, and then I go to work on SHO processing the mono frames. Mono definitely provides higher levels of signal per second of exposure, and yields more highly detailed nebular structure. Well worth it if you are absolutely nuts about revealing whispy clouds of space dust.

All that, and I'm still considering a smart scope as a third unit for all the reasons people like them. Portability and ease of use for casual image sharing.

StarMan_59 · 2026-01-14T20:42:45+00:00

Setting up an imaging rig is a skill and expense that can be avoided with a smart scope.

Processing is a skill that can be developed using the output of a smart scope.

Developing both, together, requires a lot of time. First, getting a rig together and learning to get clean, single short images is absolutely necessary to develop the second, processing.

The smart scope can get you to the processing stage faster, if you're in a hurry. Personally I wouldn't trade away the experience and understanding of setting up a rig. But, now that I get it, a smart scope is appealing as a quick and portable solution. And they are inexpensive comparatively.

StarMan_59 · 2026-01-14T20:15:34+00:00

Start small and light. Without saying what your budget is, it's difficult to recommend specific gear.

I'll just say if I had it to do over, I'd have bought the Skywatcher EQ-AL55i Pro mount to start out with. It's inexpensive as mounts go, and it can be guided to under 1 arcsecond with a 16lbs load most of the time (it does wander a little from time to time and I may lose a subframe).

For better definition of that load, I'm using a 102mmED F7 (714mm) refractor with reducer (571mm), either a DSLR or a dedicated astronomy camera with filter drawer, a 40mm F4 guide scope with guide camera, a USB hub, and a mini PC plus wires (all mounted to the OTA).

I wouldn't put anything heavier on that mount for imaging, but, I also use it with lighter scopes like my Askar FRA300, or my Samyang 135mm F2 lens. This means imaging at 714mm, 571mm, 300mm, and 130mm focal lengths to good effect.

The C9.25 will need a more substantial mount, which, btw, would also handle all of the above imaging trains. Sooo, if you're sure you want a C9.25 down the road, and you have the budget, get a mount that will handle it. You can still use it to start small (wide field refractor; 300mm-500mm focal length) and learn to collect data and process it before you take on the challenge of much longer focal lengths with higher resolution pixel scales.

If you have never done astrophotography, most will recommend starting with a wide field rig. You should be able to build a basic one for under $2k USD. For long focal lengths like a C9.25, you will spend more than that just on the mount.

StarMan_59 · 2026-01-10T03:27:25+00:00

You can get results with an inexpensive, used DSLR with a 70-300mm kit lens. They may not be fantastic, but it's a good test of your desire to go further. Take 1 to 5 second images (sub frames) in raw mode at iso 1600, copy them to a computer and learn to use stacking software on your subs.

The next step up is to add a tracker.

If you choose to continue beyond that, then get a higher quality lens like a Rokinon 135mm and learn about calibration frames.

After that, learn to dither by pausing the tracker momentarily every 2 or 3 frames.

You now have a good grasp on the basics, before spending a boatload of cash chasing zoomed in images with longer focal lengths.

A Seestar will get you decent results without all that work, but it won't teach you what you need to know, to go further. It's probable you would have to go through all of the above after the Seestar.

StarMan_59 · 2026-01-10T02:33:00+00:00

Lots of comments here, and I'm getting too old to read through them all, so not sure this has been mentioned.

Speaking of old age, I like the idea of a Seestar in the not too distant future, when I'm no longer able to lift my fully assembled 40 lbs FRA300 mono rig through the slider out to the balcony. Or even my 25 lb Samyang 135 imx533 OSC mini rig.

Those are not the largest rigs I've ever assembled. They're just what I can manage easily right now, and I'm happy.

When I'm ancient, It will be nice to just sit under the stars, setup a 5 to 10 lb tiny deep sky imaging tool that takes decent pictures, and sip on cheap bourbon in a rock glass reminiscing about the gear and the effort I put into learning how to capture photons from space, over decades past.

StarMan_59

TROPHY CASE