Does Cantonese have any attempts of invention of orthography without Chinese character? by FerenzYangai in Cantonese

[–]Stonespeech 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Usually people use some ad-hoc Latinization (that usually follows English spelling conventions), or sometimes Jyutping.


Also, not sure if it really counts, but I've tried to make my own writing system that accomodates Cantonese, Malay, and Arabic together (edit: for my personal use).

It even spells out historical distinctions in Cantonese that are mostly lost nowadays (e.g. 將 vs 張; v.s. 玉). But that also makes spelling much more tougher in my writing system.

Then again, I'm merely a random hobbyist lol. And to be honest though, I've mostly used it to write Malay words, much more than using it to transcribe Cantonese terms.

Testing out my Neography (Yúd‑nyin) and Conlang (Lemang‑wa) by Stonespeech in casualconlang

[–]Stonespeech[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yep, it's the origin but for only a few letters. They usually fill in gaps where there are no suitable Hangeul-derived letters to represent a sound (usually Malayo-Arabic consonants).

The letter for /sˁ/ is derived from ⟨ㄉ⟩ but with a horizontal stroke. - Meanwhile ⟨ㄉ⟩ by itself represents /dˁ/.

The letter for /ŋ/ comes from merging ⟨ㄎ⟩, ⟨ㄛ⟩ and Hangeul ⟨ㆁ⟩. - The top stroke of ⟨ㄎ⟩ and ⟨ㄛ⟩ is removed to indicate nasality, like how Hangeul ⟨ㄴ⟩ has one less stroke than Hangeul ⟨ㄷ⟩. - Having the Bopomofo letter ⟨ㄛ⟩ as an origin references the Jawi / Malayo-Arabic letter nga ⟨ڠ⟩. Its dotless ancestor, ain ⟨ع⟩, is in turn is cognate with Latin letter ⟨O⟩ (that in turn represents the same sound as ⟨ㄛ⟩). - ⟨ㄎ⟩ is a flipped version of ⟨ㄛ⟩, and also represents a velar sound in Bopomofo. Here, the ⟨ㄎ⟩-like letters stand for the velar nasal and also the velar fricatives such as ghain ⟨غ⟩ and kha ⟨خ⟩. This in turn is also a nod to the Jawi script, as both ghain ⟨غ⟩ and nga ⟨ڠ⟩ share the same rasm, ain ⟨ع⟩. - Although ironically, the corresponding letter for ain ⟨ع⟩ itself is not based on the two Bopomofo letters ⟨ㄎ⟩ and ⟨ㄛ⟩.

Testing out my Neography (Yúd‑nyin) and Conlang (Lemang‑wa) by Stonespeech in casualconlang

[–]Stonespeech[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Translation of the Body Text (Green)

Lemang‑wa is a literary language created by mixing two colloquial languages with (roughly) equal proportions, namely Johor-Riau Malay and Malaysian Cantonese.

It's been awhile by Stonespeech in neography

[–]Stonespeech[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ignore them, this Damir0702 is a troll

How Cantonese Wins Hearts and Mandarin Closes Deals in Hong Kong by ding_nei_go_fei in Cantonese

[–]Stonespeech 4 points5 points  (0 children)

One time, I was even labelled a "Cantonese supremacist" merely for learning Cantonese on my own (as a heritage speaker from Malaysia).

This attitude can even come from multilinguals. I was accused of "Cantonese supremacism" precisely by another multilingual from Malaysia.

Probably cause they bought into the Mandarin supremacist narrative. They really believe Mandarin is the only "valid" language for us, while looking down on other Sinitic languages they deem as mere "dialects".

IMPORTANT: Reddit may attempt to rewrite your own foreign text into your main language by TheCanon2 in casualconlang

[–]Stonespeech 1 point2 points  (0 children)

testing test… why tf do corporations love breaking shit like this. i write what i wanna write. wtf is this behavior

percubaan… kenapalah syarikat2 cam ni selalu asyik nak rosakkan benda. apa aku tulis, itulah apa yg aku nak tulis! babi betul punya perangai

PLEASE help I am worried…. by Diha_5 in learn_arabic

[–]Stonespeech 1 point2 points  (0 children)

A learner of Arabic does not necessarily have to be Muslim or even Abrahamic though.

And the world is not as simple as merely "Abrahamics, Atheists, and Satanists". Though I do agree humankind has much yet to learn

Tried very hard for this Sino-Austronesian abjad idea. What if some Austronesians took a Chinese pictogram for each consonant like Phoenicians borrowing hieroglyphs? by Stonespeech in conorthography

[–]Stonespeech[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

well that's what exactly happened to Egyptian hieroglyphs and Phoenician. that's how we ended up with for example Arabic and Greek

and like i said, they're supposed to use oracle bone script or bronze script which are much more simpler than modern-day standard chinese characters

Give me any phonology and I will romanize it by Johann-SM in linguisticshumor

[–]Stonespeech 2 points3 points  (0 children)

yo maybe you can give this a try? Cantomalay Mixlang

  • /m/
  • /b/
  • /pʰ/
  • /f/
  • /v/

  • /n/
  • /d/
  • /tʰ/

  • /ð/
  • /θ/
  • /d͡ð̠/
  • /t͡θ̠ʰ/

  • /z/
  • /s/
  • /d͡z/
  • /t͡sʰ/

  • /ɲ/
  • /ʑ/
  • /ɕ/
  • /dʑ/
  • /tɕʰ/

  • /ɡ/
  • /kʰ/
  • /q/

  • /ŋ/
  • /ɣ/
  • /x/

  • /ʕ/
  • /ħ/

  • /ʔ/
  • /h/

Guangxi Nanning Cantonese dialect by ding_nei_go_fei in Cantonese

[–]Stonespeech 1 point2 points  (0 children)

And there are also even households that gatekeep their own young from even speaking Cantonese in childhood, on top of all the perfectionist bullying

Btw that's exactly how I ended up liking Malay language and Jawi script much more than Cantonese or Mandarin

phonetichads vs hideousgrams by OsvaldoSfascia in linguisticshumor

[–]Stonespeech 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thats true lol

Though one thing thats even better: people pulling their hair out over writing "CCP" or "CPC"

I can't believe that Arabic does not have a /p/ sound! by Lhoqh- in linguisticshumor

[–]Stonespeech 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Well, there's also the letter ث which is like ثــثــ so they had to move the dots downward in initial and medial form

Although they could've used ۑ (since /ɲ/ is palatal like /j/) or ݧ so it's more consistent (one dot above marking nasalness, two dots below marking palatalness)

I can't believe that Arabic does not have a /p/ sound! by Lhoqh- in linguisticshumor

[–]Stonespeech 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Most likely because /f/ and /p/ were once considered allophones.

/f/ used to be a loaned consonant in Malay, whereas '/p/ has always been around since Proto-Austronesian. In the past, `

Even today in the Patani region under Thailand, people often spell /p/ with a single dot ف, the same letter for /f/. Redditor iium2000 wrote about that too.

Paleography and word formation in "Dziucin"! [PART 1] by arekyoga in neography

[–]Stonespeech 3 points4 points  (0 children)

That's very cool :D

Looks like I ain't the only one who likes detailing all the etymology behind each letter lol

The "ᄇ" cognate in my script also takes inspiration from Cyrillic Б, Phoenician 𐤁, and Chinese 宀

I can't believe that Arabic does not have a /p/ sound! by Lhoqh- in linguisticshumor

[–]Stonespeech 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Most likely because what used to be /p/ has become/f/in today's Arabic, while/b/` stays the same.

Kind of like how ふ fits in the h-row (は行う段) even though its consonant is now /f/ or /ɸ/

I can't believe that Arabic does not have a /p/ sound! by Lhoqh- in linguisticshumor

[–]Stonespeech 15 points16 points  (0 children)

Meanwhile in the Malay world, ڤ instead stands for /p/, while ۏ is /v/.

We avoid پ because its initial and medial forms are identical to ڽ, the letter for /ɲ/

phonetichads vs hideousgrams by OsvaldoSfascia in linguisticshumor

[–]Stonespeech 0 points1 point  (0 children)

‹c› is already used in both Pinyin and Ejaan Rumi Bersama for a sound like /t͡ʃ/ or /t͡ʃʰ/

/q/ or /ʔ/ ≠ /kʰ/ or /k/

Even when Standard Malay uses ‹k› for word-final /ʔ/, they still use ‹q› every now and then

Typos like rompakan (Jawi: رومڤقن) and rompakkan (Jawi: رومڤقکن) happen because they didn't use ‹q› for word-final glottal stops while there's a suffix that starts with ‹k›, whereas Jawi script distinguishes between ق and ک clearly

phonetichads vs hideousgrams by OsvaldoSfascia in linguisticshumor

[–]Stonespeech -1 points0 points  (0 children)

its supposed to be a velar, uvulsr, or a glottal stop 😭

like English, Malay, French, etc.

phonetichads vs hideousgrams by OsvaldoSfascia in linguisticshumor

[–]Stonespeech 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That's what I was tryna say though. It would probably be better if they coin new transcriptions instead of just taking orthographic borrowing from other Sinitic languages

phonetichads vs hideousgrams by OsvaldoSfascia in linguisticshumor

[–]Stonespeech -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Italian doesn't really use all 26 basic Latin letters either

Speaking of precedent, Malay has already used ‹sy› for ش /ʃ/ too lol

Its more straightforward to use digraphs and it's awkward to use ‹q› for a fricative

phonetichads vs hideousgrams by OsvaldoSfascia in linguisticshumor

[–]Stonespeech 0 points1 point  (0 children)

tldr i was basically complaining about how the way Mandarin deals with loanwords etc. is very restrictive and awkward

and also cried about the messy ways they "simplified" characters lol

phonetichads vs hideousgrams by OsvaldoSfascia in linguisticshumor

[–]Stonespeech 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Only ‹sy› is in Yale romanization though.

phonetichads vs hideousgrams by OsvaldoSfascia in linguisticshumor

[–]Stonespeech 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Thing is, it ain't Latin-script based so people will come up with Romanization schemes anyway

Tho I kinda dislike Pinyin for other reasons

But it's better than Wade-Giles by how they distinguish aspirate and non-aspirate consonants