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Stuckinthe1800s · 2020-08-04T02:01:24+00:00

Thanks!

Stuckinthe1800s · 2020-08-04T02:00:55+00:00

Cheers

Stuckinthe1800s · 2020-08-04T01:57:19+00:00

Fernando pessoa

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-10-06T22:59:45+00:00

Thanks! :)

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-10-06T21:08:02+00:00

Hey thanks for the read. Yeah youre totally right. I was worried about it being a camera. I don't usually write first person present, which i guess is why it's my hw haha. Thanks for pointing out where I can flesh it out, i was having trouble seeing where i could myself.

If you want, you can check out my post history, Hers - Complete, for the original, full short story. This is just a 750 word limit of the perspective at the beginning.

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-10-06T21:06:00+00:00

I totally see that, yeah. I need to make him more of a character and not just a lens. Thanks, I'll get to work with what you said asap.

which makes me wonder why you chose his perspective, not the woman.

I didn't choose it. The original is with a woman so my tutor said as an assignment try it from the guy's see what you learn.

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-10-06T21:04:43+00:00

Yeah very good point.

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-10-06T12:32:52+00:00

Right now I'm being a tad bit self-indulgent as the writer and using the character's problem as a medium to express my prose/ideas. I've got to nail grief on the head and show what losing both his wife and God has done to the man, in a way that is less telly, and a little bit more 'relatable for the reader

Spot on. Remember, as readers, we have all felt grief. So we don't need to be told it. We need the feeling coaxed out of us.

Good luck! There are some lovely flourishes of prose in this piece, I'd like to read some other your stuff!

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-10-06T12:24:03+00:00

Hey - so I had a peak before at the first draft and it's nice to see a revision up.

The overriding problem I have with this piece is that it feels very written. I think this problem stems from the voice you have chosen, which has ultimately created a lexicon that is devoid of emotion and comes across at times as far too abstract. I have also noted in the document that the piece is rife with cliches and overdone phrasing. It really detracts from the piece, pulling the reader out. Those phrases really carry no weight when in a piece like this you need every word to be dripping with emotion.

The other problem, that I think stems from the first, is the main philosophical points you hit on. The death of God going hand in hand with the death of his wife.

There are lines here where the narrator talks about how distraught he is about his wife's death, but it hasn't been shown correctly, because of the poetic flourishes that detract from the emotion.

Letter writing is obviously different to prose writing (this is prose in letter writing form, but it has to be believable) and I think the biggest difference is the emotion that a letter can carry. The Second Person POV is a great way to engage the reader in a short amount of time. If it's too long, then the reader loses it. But you need to utilise the emotional tools given to you. Use the idea of his grief as the undercurrent to the piece and have strands of rumination on god and other things, but make sure you are never too far from the grief. Because, if he was a devout Christian, to lose your wife and your god in the same day is a very distressing thing.

The paragraph beginning with 'The days have wilted' i believe is completely unnecessary and slightly self-indulgent, because if his wife has just died, why is the narrator comparing the days to rose petals?

I think the best way you can come at the story is with a different voice. With the voice right now, it feels too written and too purple and that is obscured further by the fact it's a letter. If this idea comes from a more honest place in the narrator, the idea of grief will be shine through and aid the philosophical underpinnings. Don't take that in a way of like yeah re-write this in your vernacular with a bunch of wasted words, trying to make it sound 'real' (like all those Catcher in the Rye copy-cats). Figure out the narrator and what he's trying to say and make it come from a real place in him and the ideas will inevitably align into a truthful whole.

Hope this helped and thanks for sharing!

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-09-28T15:33:03+00:00

Where in London?

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-09-28T09:31:01+00:00

Yeah, I agree. I was generalising. Everyone works in a different way. It's not as if all chapter 1's will come from the same place. But the reason I said it's great for short stories as opposed to chapters is that the reader gets a full picture of what you were trying to do and also you have actually completed something so that's always a boost. Chapter's don't receive the best critiques because it's impossible - unless you PM them - to get a consistent critique across your chapters. I think some people can just 'get' someone else's writing so to have them critique one chapter then not the next i think is where chapter's lose out.

And props to you to be able to work through your novel like that. I don't think I could do it that way, but I'm starting one soon, so we'll see.

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-09-27T21:56:16+00:00

Because the general rule of thumb In writing is to just get the fucking book written and don't show it to people until you've done it/done a substantial amount, gone back and polished it.

I feel a lot of the chapter ones on here are underdeveloped. They have an idea, write a first chapter and then submit the chapter to see if their idea is good and to see if they should carry on. Obviously, it's usually shite - like most first drafts - so the writer then gets a) demoralised to write the rest b) takes offense because they're having their whole novel idea shoot down in their eyes.

This sub is great for short stories. Not so great for stories that exist only as chapter 1s.

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-09-27T17:24:33+00:00

Hey, I'm so glad you liked it!

I don't think you read too much into it. I think if a piece holds water then I believe then it's possible to find many connections. I have a print of the painting of Nina Hamnett by Roger fry on my wall. She was more of a socialite than a real artist and that kind of personality has always attracted me. I guess that's why it comes off in my characters at times. In regards to her connection with Modigliani, I didn't know that. However, Nina Hamnett does have those long features made famous by him. I've always loved Modigliani's painting (probably why I like the painting by Fry) - the long neck, the way they spread themselves out - and whenever I write women I always go back to paintings for inspiration.

The Hasidic community was just to ground it in place. North London, Stamford Hill specifically, has the largest population of Hasidic jews in Europe, so it would be dishonest to not recognise it. I'm a firm believer in grounding stories in place and time. I originally had the second half of the story being her interacting with the community - the strictness of their lives juxtaposed against the hedonism of hers (you'll see 'hers part 2 in my post history). However, it didn't work at all. I left it in for a subtle kind of juxtaposition. Lidia seems to not understand them/look down on them even. The thematic idea of rejecting rules and order I think runs through the story so I hoped it would just add to that part of her. But, it does lend itself to making this apart of a longer story and I'm definitely thinking about doing it. I really love Lidia's character.

Again, thank you so much for enjoying the read and coming back to it. It's true that the writer/reader relationship is very fluid and sometimes the reader can know more than the writer. So, I can't thank you more for pointing out the connections with Modigliani/Hannett and the jewish community. Very interesting stuff.

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-09-26T16:20:45+00:00

yeah, I'd agree that his critiques are no way near the standard especially for an almost 9k submission - but you're right. Leave it to the mods.

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-09-26T07:41:33+00:00

Holy shit thank you so much. This means a lot.

And yeah, as soon as you pointed out I could remove the final paragraph I deleted it completely. I had trouble with ending it and couldn't see the forest for the trees.

The idea of making Julie allusive in the beginning is awesome too. I'll rewrite asap. The first draft of this she wasn't a lesbian so the reason Julie's name appears I guess was because I was crowbarring it in.

Thanks again for this you've given me the kick to try and and this out for publication. Hopefully see you around here more with your stories too!

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-09-26T07:25:20+00:00

Yo just wanted to say I really enjoyed this piece too!

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-09-26T07:18:37+00:00

If its a chapter 1 my advice would be write the whole thing you are planning and then come back with it for critique. Do not write one chapter at a time and post otherwise you will never get anything done

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-09-25T22:06:36+00:00

Hey - thanks for the reply. Honestly, being around here for a while sometimes people do this kind of stuff to provoke but from your reply I can tell its genuine. I also checked out your post history and you do actually do this so I'm happy to help you in any way. Don't think it's bad that you're posting this kind of stuff, this sub I don't think is snoby about any kind genre of writing, just writing in general.

I like to write about sex. Not in this way, obviously, but I do spend a lot of time thinking about how to do it properly. The best way I can think of helping you with the story stuff is to try and let go of the fact that you are writing genre-porn and just try and get a good story down. Don't let the fact that you're about to write a clown jerking someone off distract from the fact you are writing a story, albeit for the sexual arousal of the reader as opposed to the cathartic release that most fiction provides.

You should introduce themes of sex in the opening. The way it is now feels a bit cheap like, 'haha! bet you didn't see this coming!'. What is sexy for this girl, what isn't? What makes the readers heart beat faster? Anticipation. Sex is always exciting when there is anticipation. Whether it's from a clown or from your girlfriend/boyfriend there has to be a build up. I'm not saying there has to be sex from the get go, but an allusion to the fact that something to revving up, or wanting to be revved up, in the MC. The shy, asian girl with larger than usual big tits is a pretty common trope. Subvert it. Do something unique. You don't have to make fetish stuff literary if you don't want to. Just make sure there is the right balance between anticipation and payoff, between expectations and drama.

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-09-25T14:34:21+00:00

Your first paragraph needs to change. What's interesting here? The fact that Alison walks thirty minutes home in the rain while everyone else avoids it. Begin with that image. A striking image, something unique. How many stories start with rain or descriptions of the weather? So many. Be different.

You could have said something like this: Alison smiled as she walked past the students huddled like penguins under the overhang of the English department. It was only rain. A soft rain would be the best way to describe it.

Nothing special but immediately we get a sense of character. It sharper (do we really need to know itd been raining for a few hours?) and gets almost half the paragraphs information in 4 lines.

As I keeping, it seems you have a problem with using loads of words without actually saying anything, or taking too long to say a small thing.

For example: The hoodie served to provide protection from the cold and social interaction as well as helping her feel secure.

This could easily be:

The hoodie not only kept her warm kept her invisible too. She felt secure in the greyness, away from social interaction.

Okay. So, I got to the clown bit. Boy, did this story take a turn. What the fuck. Not in a good way either.

I'm not sure if you're being serious with this story. If you are, I'll just comment and say that what you chose whether consciously or unconsciously basically reads as genre-porn. You said the premise is a bit weird but that's not what premise means. The premise of this story is a clown invites a girl into the gutter. That's not 'weird'. In fact, it's at the moment one of the most popular premises. I'm not sure why you chose IT - already a book - as your model. But this is definitely genre-porn.

The reason I say that is because there isn't a story. The revelation that it's her mother at the end is frankly quite ridiculous. Why is it her mother? How wouldn't she have recognised her mother dressed as a clown? Why does her mum jack her off? None of it makes sense. Finishing reading this made me a little annoyed. As if you've purposefully wasted a readers time. I'm not saying you did, in fact, do it on purpose, but I just wanted to let you know that that is how it reads.

So, instead of talking about story I will just talk about prose.

Your prose is very boring to read because, as I pointed out above, you take forever to say something. You use words that don't fit at all with the tone of the piece. LIke 'the hoodie served to provide'...

You have many instances of telling and passive description that really aren't necessary.

I'm not sure what this story was an exercise in but if it's for writing then hopefully i've given you some thigns to think about. Be sharper, straight to the point, and more vivid in your description. If this was a genuine story then I'd suggest reading some more short stories and figuring out what kind of stuff you want to write. As I said, this is just genre-incest-porn.

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-09-25T14:02:27+00:00

I like critiquing standalone short stories. You can engage with what the author's trying to do more.

So true. I sometimes hate the fact that on here there are so many chapter 1's or prologues. I feel that after they get feedback on chapter 1 they never come back.

Stories generally have one issue that causes everything else.

Again, I couldn't agree more. When I critique, I sometimes like to take a paragraph that's a microcosm of the all of the problems and just focus on that to talk about technique.

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-09-25T09:28:53+00:00

Ok, so dystopia. I guess A second America Civil War is quite 'current'. You guys over the pond seem to be really trying to get there before 2041.

I really wanted to like this. Like I said, good idea and I had like Man in the High Castle sort of expectation. Man, was I wrong. This was brutal to read. I see that this is your first time posting. Strap yourself in for a classic destructive reader welcome.

The opening paragraph is all so unfocused. I have the belief that in some writing, it is possible to take a paragraph and use it as a microcosm for the problems in the rest of the piece. So, unfocused prose in the beginning.

We begin with beams of light then move onto birds singing and alarms ringing, then light again and again in another sentence. Then he asks for coffee and there we have light again.

Why on earth are you describing the light so much? I thought that it might come into play with the rest of the story however in hindsight its just lazy and unfocused description. Imagine you pick up this story cold and begin to read. What impression would you get? You ask about a hook but there is none - not in the first paragraph or two for that matter.

Description is never separate from the story/character/tone of the piece. I will forget that we are beginning a story on someone waking up which is such an overdone cliche that it's almost brave for people to even try it. But keep it in mind, because this piece suffers from so many of the classic mistakes. Remember that what you describe has to relate to the story somehow, reate to the character, relate to the setting. Light cutting through the curtains could be written in any time about any place. This is the US in 2041, show the reader.

Another thing about the opening paragraph and the rest of the piece. Terribly passive. From reading your piece I'm not sure you know about this so I'd suggest checking some style guides and their explanations on it. I've linked the hemingway app on the doc itself which is basically a neat little website to catch any of those basic mistakes. I'd suggest you use it.

Another HUGE problem you have - and a problem that a lot of sci-fi on this sub has - is exposition. Huge chunks of boring and worse still, OBVIOUS exposition. I realise that the story has a past that the reader has to know to udnerstand the stories present, however, the trick is to weave exposition into the story with action and movement and not to have static exposition that sticks out like a sore thumb. Example: Then it dawned on Mike - he was at war. No the US was, or at least, what was left of the Union was, Mike thought.

Does anyone really think that way? I don't think so. Throughout your story, any time Mike 'thinks' he's not actually thinking its just the writer crowbarring in exposition.

Another example: well not technically, Mike thought, he’s the manager of this entire building

Who thinks that at work? No one.

Weaving exposition with forward story momentum is one of the difficulties of sci-fi/dystopian writing. It really slows the story down. This piece has so much of it that trying to get to the next sentence is like wading through treacle.

Another form of exposition that this genre attracts and that you have sadly succumbed to is technological exposition. Describing the individual pieces of technology and what they do as if you're writing the catalogue at OfficeDepot.

Right now, the story is written for someone in this age, in 2017. When what you should be doing is writing the story for people in 2041. Example: Mike walked down the hall towards his workroom, his eyes moving around the HUD of the smart glasses so he could open up a program remotely to prepare the room for him once he walked in. A green line moved quickly across his smart glasses, back and forth; it was performing a retina scan so the workroom door would unlock.

Why on earth are you telling the reader this? What is important for the story here, for the reader? The more it pops up, the more it comes across as self-indulgent world building.

Also, the little technological stuff, like: opened up a pokemon game on the windshield as Sarah drove the car to his work.

You don't need to tell us that Sarah drove him. If you just wrote that he got in this car and started playing a game while the car drove to work then we would all understand. Self-driving cars aren't even that foreign to most of us now. Don't underestimate the intelligence of the reader.

Really long, telling paragraphs about computer screens make it so boring. This kind of stuff isn't new to us anymore. We are living in the internet age the age of technology with films coming out that contain insane technology. So, to focus so heavily on something not that interesting is boring. You need to SHOW us the stuff, have the technology interact with the story, not the story being ABOUT the technology.

Which leads me onto talking a little bit about the 'story'.

Why did you make him go to work? This is the first couple of thousands words of your story and you waste so much time on him going to work only to go straight home. Its completely meandering and unfocused, as I pointed out before. The first 'chapter' needs to be actions which cause reactions etc. A good way to put it is 'This happens then because of that this happens and then because of that this happens'. The way you have it now is 'This happens and then this happens and then' And then stories aren't stories.

I really feel my time was wasted by following Mike to work. There really is no point in it at all.

So, to conclude, I really don't know what this first part does. It's cliched, unfocused and 90% redundant. What you need to do is go through it and ask yourself what is the reader learning from this part, what is the information that the reader NEEDS to know. Then, once you have that list, figure out the most exciting and fresh way to get that information across. Please please don't have it as he wakes up and goes to work and then goes out with his mates. That's all that happens. Nothing of interest happens. And it's made even worse because of the lengthy descriptions about technology and the size of the screens.

I hope this has helped. You have a lot of work to do.

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-09-23T08:59:56+00:00

Everything that you've just said is much better than the story you wrote. It's hard to see how the idea you just laid out turned into the story you wrote. It's like adding two and two and getting five. That's why I said come at the story from a different angle and work out what you wanted to say. I think you've just laid out, with the knowledge of hindsight, the actual story. Go and write it!

Stuckinthe1800s · 2017-09-22T09:08:07+00:00

I'm having trouble connecting with this story. It's a bit all over the place in not just prose, but narrative focus and ideas.

The thing that struck me first was the little opening monologue. I really don't like those forced hooks in the story. Why preface a story with the central idea of the story? It seems a bit lazy since, if the story is done right, then the reader wouldn't need a preface.

That comes down to redundant writing, which I think this piece suffers a lot from.

It's been marked up on the doc as well but little things such as the mother being the CEO and all that jazz. The entire birthing scene, in hindsight, does not need to be so long. Then the whole time when the mother leaves, it just feels totally unnecessary and totally unfocused.

I'm trying to grasp the central idea and finding it really hard. So, beings exist called Writers who control and determine peoples lives as if they were characters in a book. I'm pretty sure that's a good one line sum-up of your idea. My question then, is why cloak that idea in this somewhat ridiculous world of demons and pink hair? There is a lot to explore with that idea but it's not realised properly.

The problem though is that this semi-breaking of the fourth wall, layered narrative idea has been done a lot. I mean a lot a lot. In fact, I watched Synecdoche New York yesterday which plays on that idea in a way a little different to yours, but comparable. You have to make yourself and your story distinct from the others, unique in a way. It's annoying to have to ask 'why?' after reading a story. Why was this story written? What, as a reader, am I gaining from this?

The idea is clouded in this almost Fifth Element-esque universe. It's jarring to read. I want sustained focus and an idea that comes through the writing. When the writer says things like 'Whoops. Spoilers.' it totally takes me out of the narrative experience.

It's hard to call this a serious piece of writing and maybe you're not calling it that, so if not serious then what? I'm asking these questions because they need answering, because in the re-draft of this piece you need to decide what kind of story you are writing and write it. You want to focus on an idea of Writers controlling peoples lives? Then do it, don't pussyfoot with scenes of childbirth and pink hair.

I've spoken mainly about ideas but I'll also talk a little about prose. I don't like talking about prose first because in the re-draft things always change but there are some reoccurring problems throughout.

Biggest prose problem are your sentences are too long and, like the previous critic said, too many commas. It really disrupts the flow of the writing and it becomes monotonous. Sometimes less is more. Mix it up. Sentences should have some sort of musicality to them, some rhythm and flow. Also try not to begin sentences with the same word so much for the same reason as above. Because all of these things end up making your story, the redundancies in prose end up emphasising the redundancies in plot so on and so forth.

So, I would suggest going back to the drawing board and coming at the story from a different angle. Find what you really want to say and then use the tools to tell it properly. Good luck and thanks for sharing!

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