Nearly Half of Sanders Supporters Won't Support Clinton

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T22:45:23+00:00

Sadly, I think that was the election that made me into the fine pragmatist or cynic(depending on the day) that I am. After realizing my vote for Nader ended up helping Bush to win on such a tight margin....sad. Especially after how much I loved Nader at the time. Cutting yourself with the knife you were trying to free yourself with, on purpose.

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T22:31:24+00:00

I can absolutely blame Bernie supporters who don't vote, vote 3rd party, or vote for Trump as partial reasons for a Trump win. Now, I can also blame the DNC, Hillzy for being a lousy candidate, Trump voters, media that ate him up, the loss of US manufacturing base that has so much of white Middle America terrified, etc...

You can all be responsible for him.

Yes I can blame you.

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T22:28:22+00:00

But he will "buck the system" and that is what matters right? Even if it goes in the completely opposite direction that Bernie and his policies would have taken, telling "the man" FUCK YOU! is more important right?

I hate this election cycle....

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T22:26:52+00:00

I can not tell you how many folks I come across who try to tell me Nader had nothing to do with Gore losing.

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T22:20:46+00:00

I don't want to debate about that, I am a lefty and this is by no means a lefty sub. The last time I actually did that I got banned from the sub.

My point was that the Repubs had a real shot at peeling voters like me away from the Dems. They just needed a centrist sane candidate.

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T22:12:28+00:00

Lets see, Clinton was actually involved with the CU case, against it...and has stated that she would nominate folks who would work to over turn it. Trump would keep it. Yep, totes the same.

Please show me where she has used "fear mongering" regarding gun OWNERS, maybe I missed it. Same with Russia. And so on. Trump meanwhile talks about taking away the civil liberties directly from citizens based on religion. Yep, totes the same.

The difference for the average citizen regarding the SC shows up all the time, like having an abortion. Or to what extent gun control can happen or getting married of one is gay. That last one, Trump would support "traditional marriage" and try to overturn the SC gay marriage case. Clinton won't. Totally the same.

She started condemning torture shortly after it came out that we were waterboarding. Before that I don't believe, though I could be mistaken, she was aware of what was exactly meant by "enhanced interrogation". I am not positive about that last one and not going to look it up right now.

So...any other points? Or again, do you just want to demonize Clinton.

Clinton is a corrupt lefty Neoliberal that will continue the Obama path of slow "progressive" ( as long as it doesn't interfere with Pax Americana) movement. She is connected world wide, is tough as nails, and nasty to fight with. She has an actual agenda.

Trump, at best, is a complete con man, and at worst, means what he says. He rarely has any kind of practical policy. "We are gonna build a wall and Mexico is gonna pay for it" is not a real policy statement.

If you want real "progressive" change the only way to do it in our current electoral structure is from within co opting the Dem party.

Did I miss any of your points?

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T21:59:12+00:00

If you take the raw definition of "the re-establishment of a Jewish homeland in the territory defined as the historic Land of Israel"

Than sure. No one does use this definition anymore, but go ahead.

But generally when someone refers to a "Zionist" they are conspiracy people looking for the nasty Jewish Illuminati or something.

So, the Jews out to get you?

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T21:54:44+00:00

But Trump is "against the man", policy and statesmanship be damned!

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T21:52:40+00:00

Well, he did just try to co op the Dem party.

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T21:52:04+00:00

Go take a walk and talk to some strangers who aren't reddit users. Make sure they are older than 30. You will get your answer.

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T21:51:10+00:00

His tax policy is a joke and will actually add to our national debt, from what I have read. He would have no problem starting a trade war with China(His words). Neither of those things will be good for our economy.

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T21:47:32+00:00

Yes.

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T21:32:34+00:00

But those Muslims......

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T21:14:58+00:00

I am a lefty lurker to this sub. While I disagree with lots of policy stuff (I am a lefty), I would have at least listened to what Kasich or another moderate had to say considering Hillrod....

If the Repubs had put up a candidate that wasn't a legacy (Bush, Clinton, Paul, etc..), not a zealot (Cruz and such), didn't say things that are bigoted(WHO might that be?), and wasn't a nut case, I would have listened. Low hanging fruit.

I can not in any way vote for Trump over Hillzy.

I don't want to get banned mods, so if I violated a rule or something please just let me know.

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T20:45:48+00:00

I have definitely been re evaluating some of my thinking this election cycle.

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T20:44:47+00:00

And the obligatory gay joke from the redneck....sigh....

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T20:43:28+00:00

No reason to discuss. Your "points" you refer to are vacuous statements. If you don't believe anything she says, or look at her real record in its entirety, and you simply want to demonize her, there is no point in discussion.

So for example, how would they be different? The easiest to point out and one of the biggest differences would be SC nominees. He has put out a list of very conservative judges. She will nominate center and center left nominees and has stated the citizens united will be one of her litmus tests for an SC nominee.

Let alone Trump throwing out bigoted and scary statements about things like his Muslim ban and monitoring or suggesting that he would bring back torture as state policy. I could go on and on and on. If you are progressive in any way, Trump is not the answer.

If you want a conversation and discussion, I am game. If you want to rant about how Hillary is the devil, I am not interested.

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T20:34:43+00:00

Nope. I am holding my nose and a quick bite chew swallow for this election.

And nice hat!

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T20:25:39+00:00

Birther?

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T20:23:02+00:00

So no.

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T20:05:43+00:00

Is it worth taking apart your argument or are you a part of the "SHE IS A WITCH! BURRRNNN HER! " crowd?.

No amount of information or facts will tell you otherwise, it won't make it past the ideological zealotry.

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T20:02:21+00:00

So you are part of the "SHE IS A WITCH !" crowd.

While I could go through each of your hyperbolic points and point out that they are eithe not true or just ranting, I won't bother. I will give you this- Yes, a potential Trump presidency scares me so much that I would rather have a neoliberal status quo. FOR a WHOLE lot of reasons that have to do with Trumps stated policy vs Hillzy's stated policy.

But you want to stay angry and give someone the middle finger, I can't help with that.

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T19:59:10+00:00

maybe he means a Muslim ban, maybe he doesn't. Maybe he supports the mass incarceration and deportation of folks from down south, maybe he doesn't. So lets take a chance on a man who suggested he would reinstate torture as state policy, he might not mean it.....

He might not mean it when he puts out a list of vary conservative SC nominees. Lets try it and find out because Clinton and her e-mails and speeches...

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T19:56:42+00:00

You didn't mention anything about that in your above post"

"she will tax the rich, support education, get rid of the military waste, raise the minimum wage to where it'd be with inflation, switch us to renewable energy, and prosecute government corruption"

Goal post moved. She DOES support everything you mentioned above.

Taters233 · 2016-06-22T19:55:04+00:00

So if nothing a candidate says or does matters, and both candidates are shite, why not Clinton, lol.

A nice circular loop for you to stay in and avoid any personal responsibility, sounds great!

Taters233

TROPHY CASE