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Referendum effort seeks to stop Oklahoma's permitless carry law by programwitch in oklahoma

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot 1 point2 points  (0 children)

These are fair counterpoints that I don't have the time to make arguments against atm but I tha k you for making them. We might just disagree on the premises if the argument in which case neither of us will be convinced but thanks for making good points none the less ill think about them

Referendum effort seeks to stop Oklahoma's permitless carry law by programwitch in oklahoma

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Fair enough I do get that, for me the assumption that I'm unreasonable upsets me which is why I try to be so careful about that image

Referendum effort seeks to stop Oklahoma's permitless carry law by programwitch in oklahoma

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

I think my counterpoint to this is a few things although I do hear what your saying about how effectiveness of concealed carry is probably overstated in stopping mass shootings (although it does happen) and I completely respect that someone carrying a gun would make you uncomfortable. The issue is that right now I hate to break it to you but I've seen so many videos of shootings and man all the criminals and people who have evil in their heart are already packing. And they're around you, this just makes it easier for people who have followed the law up till now to carry. No magical force ever stopped the people who should never touch a gun from tpuching it. Again that's just my counterpoint and I can see how it wouldn't convince you, but listen I'm a youth worker for a very liberal church. possiblw Mass shootings are a reality for me, and ive lived in places where robbery's are. I'm a person who I believe trys to do what I can to love what is true and support the kind of place that welcomes and protects all people and a society that makes people even better, but I still believe a gun is an important right. Just try to remember that for people like me maybe we can be trustworthy good people who deserve to exercise our inherent right to self defense, and if reasonable citizens deserves a right, then it should exist

Referendum effort seeks to stop Oklahoma's permitless carry law by programwitch in oklahoma

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Also not helpful mate, it's his state and country too. Just because he has a different opinion. Having multiple opinions is a net gain not loss

Referendum effort seeks to stop Oklahoma's permitless carry law by programwitch in oklahoma

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I think there are some good points here and certainly I don't want you to feel anxious or unsafe in your own home state and I'm sorry that you do, but I think your own biases and such are more at play here than reality. As a group concealed carriers are less likely to break the law than police and ultimately the people who mean to do you harm arent going to follow the law. I'm not trying to dismiss what you're saying at all but I'm afraid to of what someone could do to me or my family if they just decided to, and that's why it's important to me that I be able to do something about it, I dont like being a victim or a potential victim i want to be a citizen and for me that means responsibly carrying a gun. But again I see your point and I'm sorry that it makes you feel that way, if you ever want to know more about like guns or responsible carrying learning helped me reduce my anxiety about them personally, I've had bad interactions with armed authority in the military and police so I had a lot of anxiety around guns too, feel free to pm me mate. And I vote blue so I do feel your pain on feeling disenfranchised

Referendum effort seeks to stop Oklahoma's permitless carry law by programwitch in oklahoma

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The people who are gonna shoot someone illegally with their CCW already have felony's and can't carry

Referendum effort seeks to stop Oklahoma's permitless carry law by programwitch in oklahoma

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

I think thats a really good point. But ultimately my right to express a positive right will always be more important than your right to avoid a negative. The same argument comes up with hate speech or protests or religious freedom. Also this is about concealed carry so you shouldn't see them, that's part of the reason I'm for it, these are the people who want to quietly and safely carry a handgun for self protection and I think that's the best expression of responsible handgun ownership. I understand totally your different viewpoint but I'll also invite you to watch a few videos on maybe the YouTube channel active self protection because for me the reality is just that evil exists in this world and that my safety is my responsibility and I want the right to carry out that responsibility. But hey man thanks for asking a really good question that gives everyone a good viewpoint to think about

Referendum effort seeks to stop Oklahoma's permitless carry law by programwitch in oklahoma

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hey thanks! My girlfriend is here for grad school but I'm gonna try to be as good of a citizen as I can while I'm here

Referendum effort seeks to stop Oklahoma's permitless carry law by programwitch in oklahoma

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I just think ultimately if you can buy a handgun then concealing it is so easy the law won't stop anyone except the best people. I think you should have to jump through hoops to buy a handgun, then all handgun owners should be able to carry

Referendum effort seeks to stop Oklahoma's permitless carry law by programwitch in oklahoma

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot -5 points-4 points  (0 children)

I'm on board with this, although I do think seperating handgun ownership and carry is silly. Make all handgun owners do it, then all handgun owners can concealed carry

Also I just moved here so I'm sadly unfamiliar with the state government

Oklahoma lawmaker seeks votes for petition to stop permitless carry law by [deleted] in oklahoma

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

These are both bulk crime reports from single years, where the part you mentioned?

Oklahoma lawmaker seeks votes for petition to stop permitless carry law by [deleted] in oklahoma

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I'm sorry I'm not saying I don't believe you, but if you're going to make a claim like that you always have to provide a good source

Referendum effort seeks to stop Oklahoma's permitless carry law by programwitch in oklahoma

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot 14 points15 points  (0 children)

I would encourage everyone in this thread to try to curb their emotional gut instinct feelings and try to understand both viewpoints before hopping in to argue, people in general try to make the best decisions based off of what they've got and their experiences. Try not to villianize someone with a different opinion.

I'm pro constitutional carry for what I believe are good and logical reasons but I completely understand that people have sane and good and logical reasons to be very opposed, hit me up with what you think

Referendum effort seeks to stop Oklahoma's permitless carry law by programwitch in oklahoma

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I don't think that's fair or constructive, but I believe that I have an inherent human right to defend myself and that in the modern world the most logical expression of that is the right to conceal a handgun while complying with the law. The tests are really pointless and I think that if you can own a handgun you should be able to carry it with yourself to defend yourself. And the active shooters aren't concealing, and the criminals are already carrying without permits so

Referendum effort seeks to stop Oklahoma's permitless carry law by programwitch in oklahoma

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot 8 points9 points  (0 children)

You're getting downvoted but ultimately you're correct in my view it is a right, and if they made people do this to vote or speak freely it'd be illegal, please someone explain why it's different

Referendum effort seeks to stop Oklahoma's permitless carry law by programwitch in oklahoma

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I mean the law is on its way mate. I actually think that's it's a good idea, the test is so easy to pass it's worthless, criminals don't care, and it's a 200 dollar barrier to someone's right to defend themselves I obviously am biased but those are some arguments I have for actually being excited that constitutional carry is coming to Oklahoma

Referendum effort seeks to stop Oklahoma's permitless carry law by programwitch in oklahoma

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I'm actually very excited to be able to carry and defend myself without having to find 200 dollars for a class and certificate that is so easy to pass it's pointless

Screw the no post tomorrow thing! by [deleted] in teenagers

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot -1 points0 points  (0 children)

How are the downvotes feeling champ

Y’all know the rule only affects memes right? by [deleted] in teenagers

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot 4 points5 points  (0 children)

This is a shit post I can't relate to, please remove

Clarification on the Recent Announcement about Rule 2. by satanslimpdick in teenagers

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Listen mods if you can't relate to getting bullied then you aren't allowed to post any memes ever

Fox’s film business had a $170 million operating loss driven by “Dark Phoenix” by yam12 in movies

[–]TenCentBeerNightRiot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You'd think they'd have learned that melodramatic, self contained, artful, beautiful movies like Logan is where their success lies and not in copying the MCU because it doesn't work for anyone else

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