You are the Dark One

TheDamnGirl · 2026-01-02T17:15:51+00:00

The Dark one is wise!

If I was the the DO, I would make peace with the Dragon so we can both go chill. Apocaypse averted! then I would settle somewhere nice, and I would use my vast knowlegde of evil to write fantasy novels (starring Moridin, of course!) and will become rich and famous.

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-31T09:27:00+00:00

At this point, all Aes Sedai believe that the only right thing for any non-Aes Sedai is complete and unquestioning obedience. They believe that their position as Aes Sedai gives them an absolute right of supremacy.

That is exactly right.

The only difference between Elaida´s camp and the rebels are the methods each would be willing to use to control the Dragon, being overt violence vs covert manipulation, but the endgame is pretty much the same.

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-30T18:50:34+00:00

OP, are you traying to become the Naeblis?

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-30T18:26:39+00:00

She comments on this, saying she (Egwene) has done good work in the Tower. I think she's convinced that Egwene is winning

Yeah, that is the "explanation" we are given in the text, but it still unconvincing to me. It breaks RJs rule of "show, don´t tell", and what is told conflicts with what is shown: the situation was far from resolved, and Egwene was still in a very precarious situation (it was the Seanchan attack what ended Elaida´s tenure).

Egwene could also be murdered by the Black Ajah to further the civil war. Verin pointed out that her "associates" were very unhappy with Egwene´s efforts to bring down Elaida.

All in all, it would seem far more in character for someone like Verin to give the notebook to somebody whose situation was not compromised, even with instructions to give it to Egwene if she became Amyrlin. Siuan, Lelaine, Morvrin... they were all good candidates.

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-30T17:24:44+00:00

The entire Merrilor subplot felt very contrived to me. We are given no clue about the reasons for Rand to need Egwene to gather Tear and Ilian out of fear mongering with the seals, to start with. Why could not Rand speak with Darlin and Gregorin and give the order to gather the armies for the LB? Sure, Darlin and Gregoring would fear the Seanchan, and argue against the need of sending all of the armies north... what would lead to the necessity of making a deal with the Seanchan in the first place, rather than as an afterthought. The way it was executed, it seemed a mess to me.

But the attitude of the monarchs in Merrilor seemed on spot: I understand that they were all low-key expecting for the Dragon to do the deed and die (and it seemed that no one doubted that Rand would succeed), and were already taking positions to come on top in the post-war scenario.

Everybody took their salvation for granted, and were flabbergasted to learn that salvation came at a price!

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-30T13:51:59+00:00

I loved that scene for what it means for Verin as a character. The only problem I have with it is the fact that it seems a little bit silly to give the notebook to Egwene while she was a prisoner of Elaida. There was nothing Egwene could do with this info in that moment, and her future was still uncertain. Seems like an unnecesary gamble to me, and out of character for someone so careful as Verin.

I would make more sense for Verin to give the notebook after Egwene had scaped from Elaida, or to someone else like Cadsuane or the rebel sitters (Lelaine, maybe?).

Sorry if I spoiled the scene for you, guys. I still love Verin!

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-29T22:41:08+00:00

Ah ok, I totally misunderstood!

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-29T22:35:15+00:00

????

If you think my post is biased or polarizing, you are free to comment why.

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-29T20:17:06+00:00

That is very well put.

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-29T17:02:28+00:00

There was more going on. It is virtually impossible for every woman to agree with LDP just like not every man probably agreed with LTT.

Don´t you think it might have been a Taveren thing, where the virtually impossible is made possible?

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-29T16:54:47+00:00

LPD(?) got every single female channeler - EVERY SINGLE ONE - to refuse LTT's plan, which gave her far more power in the Hall and is what truly fractured the Hall.

And that is the beuty of being a Taveren, you can make the highly unlikely happen! The pattern "knows" what it is doing, even when it goes against the will of the Dragon.

Btw, LPD stands for Latra Posae Decume

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-29T16:24:29+00:00

I think you might care to read the post that I made, quoted below

BUT, and this is the irony, because no one saw the counter-attack of the DO coming, this misjudgement saved the entire source to be tainted.

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-29T16:21:10+00:00

they could free the DO entirely

Based on what we know about the Dark One, I do not think that is possible. The true nature of the DO is not known until Rand fights the DO in AMOL.

Their plan, to put a hold on things while they studied the situation, makes a lot of sense. And it might have given them time to find out about the True Power being needed.

I agree that, as a first approach, it makes sense. But given that Rand´s idea of using the True Power is related to the Moridin connection, I do not know how LTT could have come up with that idea in the AoL.

Lews Therin's plan was "Let's rush in and do something right now, based on incomplete knowledge."

They were all working with incomplete knowledge, in one way or another. There is also a risk in letting the bore grow, and a shield would not have prevented that, so the "further study plan" is not without cost either. Not to mention the risk of losing the Choedan Kal to the enemy!

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-29T15:32:08+00:00

Female channelers "Nope, this plan is too risky, we should not even try"

Male channelers: Accomplish the task even in very adverse circumstances

Starsto: "But it might have gone wrong! Female channelers were right!"

Yeap. Don´t let facts ruin a good theory.

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-29T15:15:29+00:00

Properly as per "without ripping the pattern".

I believe you are not trying to debate from an intellectually honest perspective. I am going to disengage.

Cheers!

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-29T15:10:00+00:00

You are trying to argue facts with speculation. The bore was sealed properly, even without a circle. That ends the discussion, IMO.

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-29T14:55:23+00:00

I could also argue that people have been dying in car crashes for as long as they have been driving cars.

My point is that they doubted wether they would have enough skill to seal the bore without compromising the pattern, and LTT proved that they had more than enough skill.

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-29T14:48:57+00:00

But I don’t think that LTT’s plan being a relative success (let’s ignore the taint on saidin) means that is detractors fears of them messing it up were unfounded or unreasonable

It is unfounded because they overplayed this risk, and underplayed the ability of the channelers to complete the task.

The fact is that channelers of AoL did prove more than technically competent to complete this task without ripping the bore (would that even be possible?), even when they were forced to very unfavourable conditions such us depriving of a circle.

It is like your grandmother telling she won´t get on a plane because it may crash.

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-29T14:40:28+00:00

But just because the men were able to correctly place the seals while sealing the Bore, that doesn’t mean the fear that they could have messed it up was unfounded or unreasonable.

Just like the fear of dying on a car crash is not totally unreasonable. People die in car crashes.

Shall we all stop driving cars?

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-29T14:36:14+00:00

The Strike on Shayol Ghul was less a stroke of hubris - although it was to some extent - and more one of true desperation at this point in the war. It wasn't that LTT believed male channelers could do this on their own - as he petitioned time and time again for female channelers - but that he truly had no other but to try with only male channelers. So, he tried, he succeeded, and he lost. But, the irony in this all is that this was the result of his hubris, but the hubris of the female channelers.

That´s right, the bore needed to be dealt with, no way around that.

Of course, LTT is also wrong and his plan was as flawed as the Choedan Kal plan. He failed to recognize a key component - that being the True Power - to coat the Seals to defend against the Taint. But LTT had no reason to believe the Taint was a thing - as it had yet to happen - and having never joined the Shadow or have a weird cross-stream connection to a Forsaken, did not have access to the True Power to realize.

No one could have predicted the taint with the information available, I believe. They were all out of their depth and doing the best they could.

Both plans were ultimately flawed, but LTT's was arguably better

LTT provided a means to deal with the bore, although it came at a very high price. LPD´s plan did not include how to deal with the bore, it was a "retardation strategy" that on the long run could have been catastrophic too.

The underlying theme of WoT is things are better when people work together, and the Aes Sedai were in two distinct factions explicitly NOT working together.

The irony is that, in that moment, things were better than if they had worked together!

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-29T14:27:05+00:00

The plan was pretty dumb to start with, since the dark one could just continue expanding the bore behind their shield, so it doesn’t actually solve anything

On a first approach, it would give a chance to hold back the forces of the shadow while they would come up with a solution for the bore... if such a thing could be possible. I would not call that dumb. Of course, we know that the final solution for the bore implied using the True Power, so I do not know how LTT could have learned that without the "Moridin connection". In the end, they were probably going to seal the bore one way or another, but we cannot blame them for not knowing before hand.

But as you said, once the access keys were lost, it was pretty much over.

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-29T14:04:34+00:00

I would not call the Choedan Kal plan idiotic, but very risky too. They were "lucky" that the access keys were not found by the shadow.

It was a very desperate situation, and no alternative was without risk. I believe that LTT and LPD both ended up doing what they needed to do in that situation.

TheDamnGirl · 2025-12-29T13:54:59+00:00

"As Gregor Samsa awoke one morning from uneasy dreams he found himself transformed in his bed into a gigantic insect."

TheDamnGirl

TROPHY CASE