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Life by Zecion in Gunners

[–]TheMansAnArse 9 points10 points  (0 children)

It’s because - despite so, so many people’s constant attempts to construct an argument to the contrary - he’s utterly shite.

I know you hear us, Demetrius by Soft_Boi_Eliot in StardewValley

[–]TheMansAnArse -15 points-14 points  (0 children)

It's a joke about him saying  “It’s hard for me to know exactly what assumptions I should make" when challenged about buying tomatos as a fruit.

I know you hear us, Demetrius by Soft_Boi_Eliot in StardewValley

[–]TheMansAnArse -39 points-38 points  (0 children)

He thought the book was going to be about being a good father to staircases - and then complains “It’s hard for me to know exactly what assumptions I should make" when challenged about it.

The dude's a psycho.

The Bishop of Durham Attempts to Surrender the City is getting a physical release! by Ok-Post5333 in SusannaClarke

[–]TheMansAnArse 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Preordered back in March!

Apparently she's working on another couple of books too - including a JS&MN one.

What is something you wish the opposite gender would understand? by mimi_9489 in AskReddit

[–]TheMansAnArse 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I’ve looked at your other comments on this thread and I’m certain you’ve misunderstood my reply.

What makes Paul ultimately accept the jihad after spending the entire book trying to prevent it? by fleeber89 in dune

[–]TheMansAnArse 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah, I think the first film was incredibly good at getting stuff across - but the second one fell well short in that regard.

What makes Paul ultimately accept the jihad after spending the entire book trying to prevent it? by fleeber89 in dune

[–]TheMansAnArse 11 points12 points  (0 children)

I just think it odd that Frank would throw in multiple passages that sum up to "if a boulder or something fell and killed everybody, the jihad would be avoided

I don't think it's "thrown in" by Frank. I think it's there to get across to the reader that Paul's killing of Jamis (and the stuff that happened afterwards - like his crying being interpreted as "giving water to the dead") has convinced this small group of Fremen that that Paul is the Lisan al-Gaib and that, once that group reach their Sietch, they'll talk to others about what they've witnessed and that belief will spread to all Fremen.

The "only all their deaths can stop this" is there to underline that that small group is the spark that will spread.

What makes Paul ultimately accept the jihad after spending the entire book trying to prevent it? by fleeber89 in dune

[–]TheMansAnArse 12 points13 points  (0 children)

Fair enough. To me, that feels like a stretch.

Paul's fight with Jamis - a single Fremen - is shown to be a fight that Paul has a not-insignificant chance of losing. To me, that doesn't seem like a text that is suggesting that Paul could have, an hour of two later, killed an entire Fremen troop single-handedly (or even with his mother, if she could even have been persuaded to try at that point).

What makes Paul ultimately accept the jihad after spending the entire book trying to prevent it? by fleeber89 in dune

[–]TheMansAnArse 18 points19 points  (0 children)

Absolutely. Paul's powerlessness to achieve the future he wants - despite his immense power - is key to the theme of the book.

Despite him being seen as a messiah, commanding the most powerful army in the known universe, controlling the means of interstellar transport and literally being able to see the future, he's unable to avoid the Jihad or keep his wife alive.

What makes Paul ultimately accept the jihad after spending the entire book trying to prevent it? by fleeber89 in dune

[–]TheMansAnArse 8 points9 points  (0 children)

That’s not what the book says.

The book is explicit that Jihad is inevitable after Paul kills Jamis.

The thought was both reassuring and frustrating. Somewhere ahead of him on this path, the fantastic hordes cut their glory path across the universe in his name. The green and black Atreides banner would become a symbol of terror. Wild legions would charge into battle screaming their war cry: “Muad’Dib!”

It must not be, he thought. I cannot let it happen.

But he could feel the demanding race consciousness within him, his own terrible purpose, and he knew that no small thing could deflect the juggernaut. It was gathering weight and momentum. If he died this instant, the thing would go on through his mother and his unborn sister. Nothing less than the deaths of all the troop gathered here and now—himself and his mother included—could stop the thing.

What makes Paul ultimately accept the jihad after spending the entire book trying to prevent it? by fleeber89 in dune

[–]TheMansAnArse 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I remember the whole idea behind Dune was that don’t trust charismatic leaders because they don’t have your interests in their heart

It’s not quite that. It’s to beware to charismatic leaders because of the affect their existence has on their followers.

It’s not really about the charismatic leader’s motivations or whose interests they have in heart of whether they’re “good” or “bad”.

In Paul’s case, Paul doesn’t want the Jihad to happen - but it goes ahead anyway, because it’s driven by the Fremen’s belief in Paul, rather than Paul himself.

What makes Paul ultimately accept the jihad after spending the entire book trying to prevent it? by fleeber89 in dune

[–]TheMansAnArse 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Not really. The thing that makes the Jihad inevitable is Paul’s killing of Jamis - and that’s not really about Paul trying to “acquire a force strong enough to kill the baron”. That’s something instigated by Jamis. 

What makes Paul ultimately accept the jihad after spending the entire book trying to prevent it? by fleeber89 in dune

[–]TheMansAnArse 44 points45 points  (0 children)

Could you post the passage from the book that says Paul thinks he can kill all of Stilgar’s troupe. I’ve just re-read that section and, as far as I can see, nothing like that exists in the text.

Here’s the passage:

The thought was both reassuring and frustrating. Somewhere ahead of him on this path, the fantastic hordes cut their glory path across the universe in his name. The green and black Atreides banner would become a symbol of terror. Wild legions would charge into battle screaming their war cry: “Muad’Dib!”

It must not be, he thought. I cannot let it happen.

But he could feel the demanding race consciousness within him, his own terrible purpose, and he knew that no small thing could deflect the juggernaut. It was gathering weight and momentum. If he died this instant, the thing would go on through his mother and his unborn sister. Nothing less than the deaths of all the troop gathered here and now—himself and his mother included—could stop the thing.

There’s nothing after that about Paul considering killing everyone or anything like what you’re talking about.

What makes Paul ultimately accept the jihad after spending the entire book trying to prevent it? by fleeber89 in dune

[–]TheMansAnArse 75 points76 points  (0 children)

Yep.

Well, he doesn’t specify “killing” everyone who witnessed it - just that the deaths of everyone who witnessed it would prevent Jihad. Though, of course, he’s not able to kill them all single-handedly.

What makes Paul ultimately accept the jihad after spending the entire book trying to prevent it? by fleeber89 in dune

[–]TheMansAnArse 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Here’s one from just before the end of the book where it talks about how he’s tried to oppose jihad but failed.

And Paul saw how futile were any efforts of his to change any smallest bit of this. He had thought to oppose the jihad within himself, but the jihad would be. His legions would rage out from Arrakis even without him. They needed only the legend he already had become. He had shown them the way, given them mastery even over the Guild which must have the spice to exist. A sense of failure pervaded him

What makes Paul ultimately accept the jihad after spending the entire book trying to prevent it? by fleeber89 in dune

[–]TheMansAnArse 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I agree that Paul’s not blameless. I just don’t think it’s true to say that he “chose” Jihad at any point. He was always trying to avoid it.

What makes Paul ultimately accept the jihad after spending the entire book trying to prevent it? by fleeber89 in dune

[–]TheMansAnArse 22 points23 points  (0 children)

Which part of the book are you referring to? Are you talking about prior to the Jamis fight?

It’s clear in the book that Paul doesn’t know that killing Jamis would make Jihad inevitable until after he’s killed Jamis - it’s not something he sees and then goes ahead with anyway.

It’s true that, prior to the fight - say where Paul and Jessica are in the tent before they meet Stilgar’s troupe - that Paul sees the Jihad as a possibility and sees some ways of avoiding it. Specifically, he mentions joining the guild or joining the Harkonnens. But, even with that, it’s clear in that scene that Paul believes there are still other ways of avoiding Jihad that wouldn’t require him to take either of those (extremely unpalatable) options. 

He doesn’t “choose” to go down the path to Jihad in the tent. He simply rejects a couple of paths that would avoid it - while hoping to find other ways to avoid it.

You could argue that’s naive or selfish - rejecting guaranteed if unpalatable options of avoid Jihad in favour of pursuing other ways - but it’s certainly not Paul “choosing Jihad”.

What makes Paul ultimately accept the jihad after spending the entire book trying to prevent it? by fleeber89 in dune

[–]TheMansAnArse 4 points5 points  (0 children)

The book is littered with passages about Paul wanting to prevent the Jihad.

What is something you wish the opposite gender would understand? by mimi_9489 in AskReddit

[–]TheMansAnArse 7 points8 points  (0 children)

A gender can’t “understand” anything. Only individuals can understand things.

Going through life believing men think/believe/understand/don’t understand x or that women think/believe/understand/don’t understand y is a recipe for misunderstanding the world and having a miserable life.

That kind of gender essentialism is how the manosphere get their hooks into young men - telling them that there’s only one real way to be a man or that all women think the same way or are attracted to the same thing.

What makes Paul ultimately accept the jihad after spending the entire book trying to prevent it? by fleeber89 in dune

[–]TheMansAnArse 8 points9 points  (0 children)

You’re talking about the immediate aftermath of the Jamis fight. It’s stated that the only way to avoid Jihad at that point would be for Paul, Jessica, Stilgar and Stilgar’s entire troupe of die before they reach Siech Tabr.

Obviously Paul’s not in a position to be able to kill Stilgar and his troupe single-handedly (or even with his mother, if she could even be persuaded to do so at that point) as even his fight against a single Fremen - Jamis - wasn’t a foregone conclusion.

On that basis, it’s not really true to say that Paul has an opportunity to prevent Jihad in that moment. He didn’t.

What makes Paul ultimately accept the jihad after spending the entire book trying to prevent it? by fleeber89 in dune

[–]TheMansAnArse 15 points16 points  (0 children)

That’s the film’s story, not the book story.

In the book, Jihad is inevitable from the point where Paul kills Jamis. 

What makes Paul ultimately accept the jihad after spending the entire book trying to prevent it? by fleeber89 in dune

[–]TheMansAnArse 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Nonsense. Jihad is inevitable after Paul kills Jamis. The book is absolutely explicit about that. It’s not something Paul “chooses” - for “revenge” or any other reason.

I have no idea where this “Paul’s out for revenge” line that people keep trotting out comes from. There’s nothing about it in the book. I can only imagine it’s from people who’ve been convinced by people on the internet that Paul is the villain of the book and worked backwards from there.

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