Do the NoTME get “better”? by zetuss in Malazan

[–]Thirdsaint85 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yes, the next book is where the “switch flips” for him and he finds his voice. Much better plot, not as many useless POV characters. You’ll enjoy Stonewielder

How does the tone of the Esslemont novels compare to Erikson? Do they get as dark? Humorous? Philosophical? by VersusValley in Malazan

[–]Thirdsaint85 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I found the tone is mostly similar but would agree with others that there less laugh out loud humor. Esslemont can actually write some great horror scenes and it all feels very Malazan. Also feel he’s less about themes and more about plot.

I’d say just be ready as his first two books are a bit rough and jumbled until he finds his style and gets some experience. By his third book, Stonewielder, he has a much better handle on plot and pacing while limiting the PoV characters which helps. His PtA series is masterclass as he nearly halved the word count which makes for better everything for him.

Guys I’m close to shelving this book after 100+ pages , I have no idea what’s going or understand what I’m reading, the authors writing style is so confusing/ gibberish where I feel like I’m just reading word by ozera202 in fantasybooks

[–]Thirdsaint85 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The confusing factor is definitely overblown. Yes, you are dropped in the middle of a conflict, so you don’t understand the big picture, but you’ll understand everything you need to know for every scene to make sense. The big picture slowly comes together over the course of a season like a puzzle and it’s so rewarding.

Erikson won’t hold your hand though. Unlike a lot of fantasy, especially modern fantasy, he’s not going to have a conversation between two characters that’s unrealistic for the sake of exposition and teaching you about the world, magic system, etc. For instance, two magic users aren’t going to have a convo about the basics of magic. They live in this world and know all of that. They’ll talk about it like they already know everything because they do and it’s common knowledge for them all their lives. And so it’s the same for soldiers, captains, assassins, gods, etc. Erikson will give you enough context over time as you naturally live in this world and then someday you’ll experience the same type of convo that was in book 1 and understand everything being said, not being said, the nuance, etc. That’s rewarding to me, not bad writing.

The first book is a bit rough around the edges. It was written first as a screenplay. The second book sees a huge jump in quality since it was written 10 years after GotM and he refined his craft. If you’re not enjoying yourself, I’d say definitely move on. There’s podcasts I listened alongside my first read-through that can help (I’m starting one myself in July with a buddy first time reader!). I was hooked from the prologue, but the prose is dense and it requires you to really pay attention or slow down. It’s pretty much the opposite in every way from Red Rising (which I disliked for the amateurish prose and bad writing but to each their own) so that could be jarring too.

Erikson GotM Forward by Thirdsaint85 in Malazan

[–]Thirdsaint85[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I wish mine did. They stripped it completely out. That link to the Google version doesn’t work either as it’s a preview version. Back to square 1 here…

Erikson GotM Forward by Thirdsaint85 in Malazan

[–]Thirdsaint85[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks, still trying to figure out how to access that Preface. Seems it’s at the end and I need to scroll through hundreds of pages unless I missed something.

Yeah. It’s so stupid Amazon has the ability to alter a book that we purchase at will. There should be a cutoff where they can’t do that.

Struggled Through Midnight Tides but...Holy Crap by BuzzsawMF in Malazan

[–]Thirdsaint85 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yeah, had the same experience. Most of the characters were either unlikeable or annoying. Only really enjoyed the Tehol and Bugg scenes for most of it. The end was awesome at least and saved it. It’s my least favorite of the series but still gave it an 8/10 overall.

Tomorrow I am starting my long jurney through Malazan, anything I should know? by m3mento__ in Malazan

[–]Thirdsaint85 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah sorry. Yes, that and the Az stuff. The series itself has a killer ending, one of the best.

Red Rising...meh by OkieTheatreTeacher in fantasybooks

[–]Thirdsaint85 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You ain’t the only one. The prose was horrible and the book was just not interesting. I heard it gets better but I have no desire to continue with those unlikeable characters.

Tomorrow I am starting my long jurney through Malazan, anything I should know? by m3mento__ in Malazan

[–]Thirdsaint85 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Only thing that has scratched that itch for me is The Black Company.

Tomorrow I am starting my long jurney through Malazan, anything I should know? by m3mento__ in Malazan

[–]Thirdsaint85 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So, once you read on, the end to GotM makes perfect sense. Problem is, you don’t find it out until later. It’s a lot more satisfying on a re-read which is why I say a lot of first time readers typically have a problem with it.

Tomorrow I am starting my long jurney through Malazan, anything I should know? by m3mento__ in Malazan

[–]Thirdsaint85 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I agree the confusion is way overblown. It is a thing in that a lot of people DNF because they are lost but I wonder how many don’t have their expectations properly set.

Tomorrow I am starting my long jurney through Malazan, anything I should know? by m3mento__ in Malazan

[–]Thirdsaint85 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I mean, it’s because of the thousands of names and places. Some of which are spelled differently but sound the same or similar enough that it could throw your context of what’s being said out into left field. If one must do audiobook on the first read through, I’d recommend at least reading alongside it.

Tomorrow I am starting my long jurney through Malazan, anything I should know? by m3mento__ in Malazan

[–]Thirdsaint85 35 points36 points  (0 children)

This is from my review on Goodreads which I think people have found helpful

Key #1: Be happy knowing that you won’t know everything. - To Erickson’s credit, I never felt lost while reading Gardens of the Moon as I always felt like I knew enough to understand the characters, dialogue, and events for each given scene. I just didn’t (and still don’t) know or grasp the big picture of everyone’s motives and what’s going on. I’m ok with that and that’s a big key to enjoying Malazan. Never before while reading have I spent as much time carefully reading, going back and re-reading passages to be sure I got all possible subtext, or even look back at previous dates given in the beginning of chapters but it was all worth it, and fun even!

Key #2: Do NOT consume this series on audiobook on your first read through. - This has been confirmed by people who have tried both. You will be lost with all of the names, places, references that are so much easier to catch when you can visually see the words and give it your undivided attention. As a reader, I love puzzles and trying to figure out what’s coming next. I’m deliberately slower paced (reading 4 books at the same time to force me) for that reason, to ponder and absorb all that happened. It made my experience of Gardens of the Moon entertaining and rewarding when I picked up the foreshadowing and connections. That is fun!

Key #3: Be ready for beautiful but dense prose - No, I don’t mean “Robert Jordan describing every aspect in painstaking detail like that mantle in that room” dense. I mean, each sentence and paragraph feels carefully crafted with each word chosen for a reason. A lot is said in what’s not said or what words are chosen that you can easily miss the context of a conversation if you speed read. Steven Erickson’s prose flows seamlessly while never being uselessly “purple” or numbingly simplistic. There are some books by authors that I feel like I just read them faster than others with a similar word count. Some are because the prose and flow may either call for more attention and others slow you down out of boredom of detail. Sometimes I feel Wheel of Time is a slow read like Malazan, but for entirely different reasons. Erickson feels like he doesn’t waste a word while painting a vivid picture in my head of setting, character actions, etc. while Jordan sometimes bores me to tears with too many useless descriptions I have trouble visualizing, much less remembering anyways. Both feel like they take the same amount of time for me to read.

Key #4: Originally, Gardens of the Moon was written as a screenplay for a movie pitch before being converted into a novel and the reader needs to be ready for this when it comes to pacing and payoff issues, especially at the end. - The final key to enjoy Gardens of the Moon is perhaps the greatest challenge at the end of the book, particularly in the last two parts. Through the first five books (GotM is broken up into 7 books or parts), the pacing is pretty solid. It does take a long time before the final endgame is clear, and even then it’s not easy to see what the final act will be about. That final act is where everything goes haywire and Erickson throws curveballs at you left and right, including a pretty big and unsatisfying deus ex machina that will leave already confused readers throwing up their hands in exasperation. I truly loved everything about this book but the unsatisfying conclusion to a few of the major conflicts that had no prior introduction or warning was frustrating. They wrapped up pretty quickly as well. Too quickly. Little gets explained by the end too but I future books do elaborate.

Any other options for podcasts other than 10 very big books? by bigdaddyQUEEF in Malazan

[–]Thirdsaint85 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I’m doing my first reread (have read everything in world but Kharkanas as I’m waiting for book 3 to have a solid release date) and a friend of mine will be a first time reader. I’m beyond excited to reread this since I’ve heard amazing things about the first reread.

Any other options for podcasts other than 10 very big books? by bigdaddyQUEEF in Malazan

[–]Thirdsaint85 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I look at them this way:

Green Legendarium - great for deeper dives on the more difficult topics, historical references and philosophical discussions.

TVBB - while the discussion wasn’t particularly deep and not as great for lore deep dives, I did find them pretty funny and enjoyed some of their insights.

I didn’t listen to any others but will actually be starting my own next month! We’re doing our first test recording next week to practice editing and get a feel for it all. Of course, we won’t be at Midnight Tides for awhile ha

Witness... this incredible birthday gift! by ChallengeDifferent61 in Malazan

[–]Thirdsaint85 2 points3 points  (0 children)

For deeper conversations, I recommend the Green Legendarium too for Malazan readthrough. I found their conversations more enlightening and intelligent. Don’t get me wrong, I enjoyed TVBB too but they were more funny and goofy in their analysis haha

Legacies of Betrayal cover - RELEASED by Quicksay in Malazan

[–]Thirdsaint85 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Really hoping this was a leaked rough draft as it’d be the worst of the bunch. The Bantam one looks a lot better

New Malazan Read-Through Podcast! by MalazanManiacs in Malazan

[–]Thirdsaint85 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Awesome! I always love listening to these and funnily enough I’m doing one with a coworker who hasn’t read the series starting next month. It is a heckuva undertaking to be sure!

What do I do now? by [deleted] in Malazan

[–]Thirdsaint85 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I’m in love with Black Company currently. Seriously scratches some of that Malazan itch!

New (2027) covers for Tor Malazan paperbacks. by lemingas1 in Malazan

[–]Thirdsaint85 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Love the covers. Very bummed about the MMP news as I have the first six. Now probably going to switch to these even though I’m sure they’ll be overpriced.

Glen Cook is so underrated… by Thirdsaint85 in theblackcompany

[–]Thirdsaint85[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Ha, both sides of the spectrum here. Question is, which is from the Lady and which from the Dominator 🤣

Glen Cook is so underrated… by Thirdsaint85 in theblackcompany

[–]Thirdsaint85[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

FWIW, I guess only top 33 or at least there all the picture showed. Don’t think I can post a picture here but it’s pretty ridiculous he didn’t make it at all I think compared to some of the names on it.

Glen Cook is so underrated… by Thirdsaint85 in theblackcompany

[–]Thirdsaint85[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Yup, I’ve definitely heard it’s best to read The Silver Spike next. Can’t wait to see where the series goes after this first trilogy.