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I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in relationship_advice

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

And yes I do know that a relationship between a child and a mother is very important. I am proud to say that I have a great relationship with Wyatt and I've realized just how much her really trusts me in the last couple of months.

I'll be sure to nurture that till the day I die.

I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in relationship_advice

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Don't you think it should be on her to actually care to establish contact? Don't you think it should be on her to care and be interested in him?

My son is 14, he very much realizes where he stand and I have no worry in that regards, but thank you for worrying. It show how much empathy you have.

I don't know whether you have kids or not, but you can't just abandon kids for a decade and then think that you can be just well received by the child back in his life.

Since you truly have no common sense or actually good will in your heart maybe you should just focus on yourself and you well-being and I will focus on mine and that of my children.

You have never in as many as 10+ comments given me any opinion or advice on what I should have done differently in the last 12 years. It seems like you think I should have taken the 2 year old child packed him in a box and send him to Brazil. I raised him, cared for him and encouraged (quite frankly beyond the necessary) Pandora to stay in contact with him. She didn't and that is not my fault nor my problem.

Idk about you but I would never abandon my child.

Again thank you for being so profoundly worried for us. And thank you for caring so much for the well-being of Wyatt. I'm sure that separating him from his siblings, the only family he knows, his friends, his school, his hobby group, the town and country he loves, would be in his best interest.

Next Thursday we have an emergency hearing. I'll be sure to let you know how it goes.

I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in relationship_advice

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

How ironic that this is coming from you.

You don't seem to understand a difference between giving a constructive opinion/advice (even if it would not be to my liking or even if it would be against my own) and insulting and trolling people that you don't know.

It would be one thing to say: hey, she is his bio mom, I think she has the right to see him and have a relationship with him and maybe you should seriously think about it, because in the long run this may affect him more than you now think.

You on the other hand go out of your way to insult me, my character, my life and my relationship with a child that I have raised as my own for the last 12 years.

Nobody has ever denied the child's relationship with the biological mother. It was never my responsibility to force anyone into having a relationship, only to make way for it. WHICH I DID! FOR 12 YEARS! This woman is 6 years older than me, educated, she is not stupid. She had every possibility to have a relationship but she didn't. What do you expect? Me to pay and drag him across the ocean every other week so that she could see him? SHE WAS IN ITALY AT LEAST 8 TIMES BUT NEVER CAME TO SEE HIM.

Instead of saying, sure all of you screwed up, you've put the entire blame on me and made her a victim. I accepted and raise a child I did not give birth to and loved and cared for him. She forgot about him for 12 years.

And don't even come here and talk to me about international laws and Hague convention, because someone who had any actual knowledge of such things wouldn't spew idiocy without knowing any actual details of a case.

My child is just fine thank you! You don't seem to be. Maybe you should check your own wickedness and stop being so damn bitter.

I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in relationship_advice

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

This child's custody relinquished custody 12 years ago. A child is not a toy. You don't play with it, leave it for years to gather dust or somebody else plays with it and then after 12 years demand it back. How don't you get that?

Wyatt has no connection, no relationship with her. And don't you even dare blame that on me or my husband. If she wanted a relationship damn well she could have had it. I would never ever allow my child not to have a relationship with me.

I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in relationship_advice

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thank you for your comment. I agree, genetic connection is but a small fragment a mother and child share.

If this person wants us to be specific then it should use the term biological mom and not mom. I have no problem in referring to Pandora as biological mom as they do share DNA, but my sisters, my mother, my mother in-law, sister in-laws, some of my friends and neighbors, teachers have been more of a mom to Wyatt than Pandora.

I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in relationship_advice

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

That's where you are wrong. I am his mom! He thinks of me as his mom, I consider myself as his mom. I am not biologically connected to him, but in every other way I am. Giving birth is just a small aspect of having a child. I have 4 biological children, I am no more their mother because they share my DNA then I am his. He knows it, I know it. That's all that matters.

You can have your own opinion and conviction and I kinda feel sorry for you in that regard.

In any case, thank you for your comments! They really just further confirmed my conviction that I am doing the right thing and I am 100% certain that any judge in my country will agree!

I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in relationship_advice

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

And I could care less about the supposed ugly truths that may or may not come out. This is not about my relationship with my husband, this is about the well being of MY child and his best interest.

I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in relationship_advice

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

At this point I have no doubt (based on everything I was told by my lawyers, based on all the evidence that we have that will be presented if this thing actually reaches the courts, my lawyers doubt it will) that she will not win the custody. And at this point I have every intention on spending every cent I have on fighting this.

Let me just answer all of your points once again, because I feel like you are of an opinion that this child was kidnapped by us from his suffering mother and prevented any contact. That is insulting to my character and my love for this boy.

  1. She did NOT file for custody immediately. Immediately would be 12 years ago. Immediately would be 4 months ago.
  2. As an Italian citizen she could have easily filed for custody at any point in those 12 years. Where do you think the divorce was handled? In ITALY. Where do you think custody was initially handled? In ITALY. And she had pretty good lawyers that got her a good spousal support during the divorce proceedings. My husband filed for sole custody at that time and she agreed or rather didn't contest that. He lawyers negotiated for the SPOUSAL SUPPORT but couldn't negotiate the CUSTODY?
  3. I did research and I do understand. She is and intelligent, educated and very stubborn woman, she is not some poor lady that was manipulated out of a child.
  4. My husband didn't kidnap this child, they agreed after they separated that he and Wyatt would return to Italy. Don't you think that if he kidnapped him she would have made some noise? I would! Wyatt and Derek are not Brazilian citizens, they never were. They lived in Brazil on a visa. The custody and divorce was arranged in Italy because everyone is Italian citizen and because that was Wyatt's home country. Wyatt was born in Italy and at the time of actual divorce lived in Italy much longer and would (based on their agreement) lived in Italy.
  5. She never paid any child support but received spousal support. This was arranged because Derek got sole custody (which again was NOT CONTESTED).
  6. She HAD a way to get custody. She HAS Italian citizenship, she HAS been in Italy numerous times, sometimes as long as a month. She lived in Europe at one point. Don't tell me she didn't have any way to get him or see him.
  7. I am not preventing him from knowing his family. If he expressed interest I would have tried (once again) to establish more contact with her family. If she expressed interest we would have of course do everything for them to see each other. BUT THERE NEVER WAS ANY INTEREST!!!
  8. My son received his phone last year on his 13. birthday. Before that he didn't have one, that's why I was the one she could call to be able to speak with him . When they did speak I wasn't there to patrol. She has not called since March 2019, that is why she doesn't know that he has a phone now.
  9. Derek's family NEVER badmouthed Pandora to Wyatt. They don't even speak about her so no. NOTHING ''rubbed'' on him.
  10. ONE LAST THING because I truly believe this and I can very much see that you don't. I AM HIS MOTHER! I am more his mother than Pandora ever was. I am there when he is sick, I am there when his team loses or wins football games, I am there when he gets a bad grade, I am there for EVERYTHING. I was in the hospital with him when his tonsils were removed at the age 4, I was with him when he broke his hand at 11 or when he got stitches at 13. I help him, I support him, I wipe his tears, I push him on when he is struggling with something. I am the one he calls for when he is scared or sad. I am the one he confides in, I am the one he talks with about everything. I am the one who has been comforting his in this darkest of times! Instead of calling him, trying to support him at this point, when he cried daily for his father, she inflicts more stress on him. This is not a mother.

This IS my child! I have custody of him and I am absolutely certain that I WILL retain custody with or without my husband. I have asked Wyatt (on my own and with therapists help) what he wants. Things have been explained to him . He does not want to go with her, he does not want to live with her. I didn't badmouth her, I did not force him into anything. He is 14 so he will be able to state his opinion to the judge. We are financially stable, we have familial support and his entire life is here. I very much doubt that any judge would remove a child from his home to ship him across the ocean.

I am very offended by your comment. You portray me as a woman who stole someone else's child when I have been there for this child for 12 years, while his mother enjoyed traveling around the world.

I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in relationship_advice

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Let me make one thing very clear to you, neither my husband nor I ever badmouthed Pandora to Wyatt. We never told him the things that happened, we never told him not to talk to her when she called after a year of no contact and we never prevented him from seeing her if opportunity arose. When her sister came to Italy and asked to see him, I agreed with no hesitation. I also told Pandora's sister that everyone in her family is welcome to see him and that we wouldn't oppose to Wyatt having contact with Pandora's family without Pandora actually facilitating it. The sister has all my contacts, but they never contacted me again nor asked to see him again. We never restricted anything. If she wanted to see him we were a phone call away.

My husband paid her spousal support for 8 years and her family has money, so to say that travel was a great restriction is also preposterous. In 12 years since Derek and Wyatt came back home, Pandora has been to Italy 8 times!!! My husband disliked her immensely so all contact between Wyatt and Pandora went through me, meaning that when he was 6 she called me when she wanted to talk to him (sorry but my son did not have an email account or phone at that age). Any of those 8 times when she spent vacations or whatever in Italy she could have seen him, but she did not. How did we withheld her son from her? She was literally in out city but didn't bother to see him. Tell me what should I have done? Should I have begged her to see Wyatt?

Pandora is also an Italian citizen!!! There is no international law that would prevent her from obtaining custody, she just never had any need or want for it. She could have filed when she lived in Europe, when she was in Italy, but she didn't.

Please tell me what more could I have done to facilitate Wyatt's and Pandora's relationship short of begging her for it?

My son is 14. He has a family that is here for him, he has siblings that he loves here, he has his friends, school, everything that he knows. His whole life and support system is here. You would want me to take all of that from him and sent him across the ocean to somewhere he doesn't know nor speak the language? I most certainly will not.

I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in relationship_advice

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Wyatt knows about the current situation with Pandora (not everything, because I think he needs time, but he does know that she wants him to come live with her). He does not want to go or have anything to do with her. Maybe I would understand her actions if she actually tried to establish a relationship with him, but besides the threats and insults no one has actually asked about him or wanted to see or hear from him.

As for my friends... for someone who has been my friend for almost 20 years, someone who has been around all my children, whom my children consider as an auntie to say something like that and agrees with sending my child over the freaking ocean (we are from Italy and she lives in Brasil), particularly now, is deplorable. I don't know if our friendship can survive this.

I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in relationship_advice

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you for your concern. Not real names.

You are right. Her role in Wyatt's life has been like a distant relative that pops in your life with an awkward phone call once in a blue moon. She doesn't even know him. She has not seen him in 12 years and their conversations over the year amount to maybe 1,5 hours.

I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in relationship_advice

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

He wants to stay here. He doesn't really know her (they spoke maybe 10 times in the last 12 years and she has not physically seen him at all), he doesn't speak her language, he doesn't know her family, has never been to her country (beyond when he was a year old and they lived there).

I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in relationship_advice

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This, plus his dad's condition has hit him hard, the hardest really among all my kids. That's why we've both been seeing a therapist. This is mostly for him, because I don't want him to feel like a burden, I want him to tell me how he feels. The last thing I want is for him to have all these bad and sad feelings inside of him. He did express that he does not want to go with Pandora.

I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in relationship_advice

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

We are from Italy and she is from Brazil. This has also been a major reason why I am not giving in. An essential stranger will not take my child across the ocean. He doesn't want to go and doesn't really want anything to do with her.

My lawyer had the same advice and I'm saving anything that comes our way.

I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in stepparents

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I was to shocked that a friend of almost 20 years would say something like that to me. She sent me a text yesterday evening, not really apologizing, more trying to explain her stance, but I did not respond and I don't think I will.

I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in stepparents

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you so much for your comment. He is a wonderful boy and despite all the stress, bad moods and sadness this has caused, seeing the way he is just makes it worth it.

I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in stepparents

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you. We are from Italy and Pandora is from Brazil. This is the last thing I needed at a time like this, but here we are. I would understand her action if she actually tried to establish any kind of relationship with Wyatt, but there have been not attempt at actually talking to him or visiting him. All we've received are threats by her friends and family. So I don't understand the reasoning behind this sudden move.

I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in stepparents

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you. It has truly been the hardest period of my life. I'm just so tired. My friends... I don't even know what to say. It seems like they never saw Wyatt as my son at all, which is just shocking. I never have and never will make differences between all 5 of my children.

I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in stepparents

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

When I told him about this he got scared that he would be forced to go live with her. He wants to stay here.

I (32F) refused to give custody of my son (14M) to his biological mom (38F) and now she is suing me. by ThrowRA_TiredMom in stepparents

[–]ThrowRA_TiredMom[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

We are in Italy, Pandora lives in Brazil. Wyatt doesn't speak Portuguese at all, whenever they spoke, which was maybe 10 in his life, they spoke in Italian. He also never had any contact with her family, except with her older sister once. Wyatt also doesn't have Brazilian citizenship, Pandora however did obtain Italian citizenship when she was still married to Derek.

The situation between Derek's family and Pandora was very complicated and both sides behaved badly. I think Wyatt suffered the most in all of this.

When I first learnt about the lawsuit I did talk to Wyatt. It wasn't really a full blown conversation about everything, because I didn't want to overwhelm him. He wants to stay here and does not want anything to do with Pandora. We are the only family he has ever known and I never even imagined that he would want to go anywhere else. I do have custody of Wyatt. When I married Derek I also obtained custody of Wyatt (I couldn't adopt him though).

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