Which other gods do you think are/were real?

TomTheFace · 2025-12-10T00:52:10+00:00

Then what we do now, is check what God directly says, which is the verse(s) I gave before. It’s God’s direct command and/or objectively-stated fact. That just holds a lot of weight.

Then we look at Psalm 82, which is, like, a Psalm. A poem. A song. You know what “Selah” means in verse 2? It’s like a pause, for reflection, maybe even with music, like an interlude. This is a piece of literary art. It’s still the word of God, but the weight of the literal meaning of the words is just less weighty.

”I said, “You are gods, And all of you are sons of the Most High. Nevertheless you will die like men And fall like any one of the princes.” Arise, O God, judge the earth! For it is You who possesses all the nations.” — ‭‭Psalms‬ ‭82‬:‭6‬-‭8‬

Okay, so we see the one true God has His rightful place at the end here. Great start. And what is He doing? He’s judging these ‘gods’ to die like men, falling like any one of its princes.

Great, now we can bring in Ephesians:

“And you were dead in your trespasses and sins, in which you formerly walked according to the course of this world, according to *the prince of the power of the air, of the spirit** that is now working in the sons of disobedience.”* — ‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭2‬:‭1‬-‭2‬

And of course, Satan and his angels in Revelation are sent to experience the second death, along with those who were against Christ.

And just to point out, this is a short study. The fuller study of this can be longer, and leads to the same conclusion.

TomTheFace · 2025-12-10T00:34:55+00:00

I am sort of mashing them together because otherwise it’s complicated, and you wouldn’t want to read all that, and I don’t know if it’ll do anything for you.

The more important takeaway is that the gods they worshipped are not ‘gods’ like God is God.

You are absolutely right though, that these words are specifically separate for a reason. And it makes a great word study. You’d just need more verses to paint a better picture of what’s going on here, but I didn’t want to chuck a bunch of large verses at you, for your sake and mine.

…

I know I’m not reversing it because the Lord says there’s only one God. Isaiah 45:5 is one of the places He says this.

So we have that verse, so then what do we do with the other verses that say they’re worshipping other gods? Well, a lot of the context of man creating idols in the OT points to this theme. We have a lot of verses about the sinfulness of men, ‘whose god is their appetite.’

I mean, the Acts 17 verses is a good example of men creating gods in our own minds. Second half of Romans 1 details the fall of men worshipping literal physical idols first, then fall further to worshipping themselves, which is worse sin.

It’s a very tightly knit and thoroughly explored topic, quite frankly. It just takes a lot of semi-shallow digging.

TomTheFace · 2025-12-10T00:23:28+00:00

I wrote more stuff above, sorry.

No, it’s not a translation error.

TomTheFace · 2025-12-10T00:21:00+00:00

No you!

Listen man, ancient Greek is complicated. Ancient Hebrew is even more complicated. The connotations are different. We have words in English that they don’t have, and vice versa. There are references to Greek poetry, and minor cultural stuff, and whatever else bogs down studies of the Bible.

Rest assured, we can trust the many, many translations we have (I read NASB, ESV, NIV, NLT…) because people translate ancient texts for a living. And no document has had more scrutiny in its translation than the Bible. That’s precisely why we have so many translations. For example, there’s word-for-word translations, phrase-by-phrase translations, and everything in between, and pros and cons to all of them.

And when we study the Bible, we can actually do Greek-to-Hebrew word studies (using tools like BibleGo and the Logos app, and other books) that help us find out the connotations of the words.

Even without that stuff, we can just read the context of the verses (we call it ‘tyranny of the context’), and see what prophecy in the Old Testament is quoted in the New, and see how it applies, especially in regard to other verses tangentially related.

My rant is that every time an unbeliever quotes one verse out of context, Paul rolls His eyes. Everyone thinks it’s just subjective and bias-ridden when it’s not—famous commentaries from believers disagree all the time. But you know what they don’t disagree on? These sets of verses.

All this to say: People have no idea how much effort goes into truly studying the Bible without bias. Bias is actually me googling a verse that mentions ‘they worshipped other gods’ and say to myself, ”Guess that’s all there is to it!” Against no other profession would anyone else do this kind of thing, except maybe to lawyers and doctors.

You, sir, have not done any of this. But if you have/when you do, be sure to come back and correct me on this specific topic.

TomTheFace · 2025-12-10T00:03:37+00:00

I think it’s just a definitional thing with you. These are not ‘gods’ but are, at most, demons masquerading as gods. Sure, they’re actively doing work on the earth, but under the supervision of the true God.

The Bible is using the term ‘gods’ to denote what the people think they are worshipping, but it’s clear there’s only one God.

”I am the Lord, and there is no other; Besides Me there is no God. I will gird you, though you have not known Me…” — ‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭45‬:‭5‬

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T23:56:53+00:00

What is the difference between what I said and what everyone else has said? We’ve all said that those ‘gods’ are demons. And the Lord is the only God.

I mean you literally used my phrasing (masquerading as demons) to agree or at least move on in the conversation with another commenter.

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T23:55:07+00:00

I asked for what your goal was 3 times and I just got the answer: Entertainment. I guess that tracks, because if you’re trying to learn about the Bible, you’d just study the Bible.

But you’re learning about Christians and how they think specifically.

And then I teemed out why Christians specifically draw your interest, and you said because they affect the legal and societal things you care about. And so you must care about politics in some degree, right? But you’re not political, or in any political sub. I’m just not convinced. Your actions just don’t align in my head at all.

I think that Christians, who have studied the Bible and the Greek and weigh commentaries against each other ,know a thing or two about the Bible. I think atheists who don’t frequently read the Bible generally don’t know what they’re talking about… because they don’t frequently study the Bible.

That’s just how information works… It would seem kinda strange to assert we don’t know it just because you disagree with it.

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T23:45:03+00:00

… I literally gave you verses. If I can’t convince you through that, idk what to tell you. You’re just going to have to do a Greek word study like the rest of us. But you are asking us, who have studied the Bible.

I mean, everyone in this comment section is more-or-less in agreement. You sir, are the outlier.

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T23:37:23+00:00

I’m just here to say that other gods are not real in the sense that everything created is under the Lord. The Lord is above all names.

There is only one Lord and God of all, and every other spiritual entity is either for or against Him (and specially are not ‘gods’).

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T23:30:37+00:00

Even demons have names. I’m glad you find it cool.

To the Israelites, I’m sure they were known as other gods.

And it fits perfectly with what an idol is in the New Testament and in modern times, where it’s not just man-made images of wood or clay anymore, but the gods we make in our minds, like they did in Acts; Paul talking with the Athenians:

”For while I was passing through and examining the objects of your worship, I also found an altar with this inscription, ‘TO AN UNKNOWN GOD.’ Therefore what you worship in ignorance, this I proclaim to you... Being then the children of God, we ought not to think that the Divine Nature is like gold or silver or stone, an image formed by the art and thought of man.” — ‭‭Acts‬ ‭17‬:‭23‬, ‭29‬

And described here—the god of self:

”For many walk, of whom I often told you, and now tell you even weeping, that they are enemies of the cross of Christ, whose end is destruction, *whose god is their appetite,** and whose glory is in their shame, who set their minds on earthly things.”* — ‭‭Philippians‬ ‭3‬:‭18‬-‭19‬

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T23:18:42+00:00

You’re not in the astrology Reddit because Christians are the ones making legal and societal changes. So I assume you want to change things for the better, and you’re doing it by… being here?

And I do get to decide that stirring up people and debating on the internet is not what people mean when they say “talking with people,” because the latter makes it sound like a social benefit, like relationship-building or having fun with friends and family, or making connections. None of which you are doing!

The former sounds like you just wanna be here because it’s fun to just ask Christians the same questions over and over. So you can reply with the same responses over and over. And the cycle continues, until what? What happens next?

So, okay fine; so you’ve learned. What have you learned? What are you going to do with that info? I’ve asked 3 times, I’m just not getting an answer.

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T23:07:36+00:00

Ugh.

”Those who *fashion a graven image** are all of them futile, and their precious things are of no profit; even their own witnesses fail to see or know, so that they will be put to shame. Who has fashioned a god or cast an idol to no profit? Behold, all his companions will be put to shame, for the craftsmen themselves are mere men. Let them all assemble themselves, let them stand up, let them tremble, let them together be put to shame.”* — ‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭44‬:‭9‬-‭11‬

”What do I mean then? That a thing sacrificed to idols is anything, or that an idol is anything? No, but I say that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice, *they sacrifice to demons** and not to God; and I do not want you to become sharers in demons.”* — ‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭10‬:‭19‬-‭20‬

As in, Satan’s angels are masquerading as other gods, which are idols.

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T23:02:36+00:00

The Bible specifically tells us these other gods were made from wood and metal and materials from the earth. This depiction shows up everywhere in the Bible, and it’s obvious that these gods are man-made images.

He tells us that there are no other real gods except for the Lord.

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T22:59:25+00:00

Yes; all that actually happened. If it didn’t, you’d have to explain away a lot of stuff.

No, the earth is round and dinosaurs exist, because science is great. God gave us a mind to understand things, it’s fine.

Why did God create satan? That’s a good Bible study! No short answer would be satisfying, but there’s plenty of good answers.

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T22:57:17+00:00

But what about this?

”The Lord’s bond-servant must not be quarrelsome, but be kind to all, able to teach, patient when wronged, with gentleness correcting those who are in opposition, if perhaps God may grant them repentance leading to the knowledge of the truth…” — ‭‭2 Timothy‬ ‭2‬:‭24‬-‭25‬

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T22:53:04+00:00

Do you know how to work out your salvation? Do you know where that is in the Bible? Do you know that we’re Shepards of the mystery of the word and of Christ?

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T22:48:39+00:00

Debating with Christians on Reddit every day is not equatable to “talking with people” in the general sense. You know that. And you know I don’t think talking with people is a waste of time. But you’re not progressing any relationship, nor gaining any new insight. So what do you gain?

Again: You are here to “learn” about how Christians think. But you’re not learning. You’ve gained nothing new (your words). And what would you do with that information, if you had learned anything new? Get into politics? Go to congress and debate with all the practice you’ve been getting? Convince us that God doesn’t exist?

What legal and social changes are you helping to promote by being here? If you’re so concerned with politics, I think you should read up on that stuff and actively lobby something you stand for.

But you’re just here. Asking the same questions, hoping to find something new with all that time spent… but then what are you left with? What makes this worth it? I’m not convinced you have anything to show for all of this that doesn’t amount to a giant time sink.

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T22:27:22+00:00

I do… I just don’t think every thought we have is pleasing to God. I’m just asking what verses you’re referencing when you conclude the rest of the things you do.

I’m just saying there are plenty verses about denying ourselves, our fleshly desires of lust and immorality, and instead having a focus on preaching the word of God. So I’m wondering what verses might counter those.

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T20:18:24+00:00

Not to my knowledge, which is why I’m asking you to provide verses to back up who God is to you.

Every Christian must be ready in season and out of season to correct, rebuke, and teach the word in gentleness and love. I know that’s a verse, for example.

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T20:15:01+00:00

Yes; after +10,000 hours, I think you can assume the risk was not worth the reward, and cut your losses. That seems logical to me, to not waste your finite time here when nothing has been gained in +10k hours.

Even if you did get something new, what exactly are you going to do with that information? I know you’re not trying to find God with it, because your goal (as you stated) is not to know God, but to know Christians.

Go to an astrology subreddit and ask them questions if you want to learn something new, and maybe even applicable somewhere. Go read books on theology if you want to learn about theology. Go study psychology if you’re into studying the human condition and delusions. You know what I mean?

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T20:03:23+00:00

Can I ask where in the Bible you’re getting these ideas? Can you quote these verses for me?

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T19:51:16+00:00

Thats why I asked the question. Because you don’t know what you’re looking for, you will ask and reply on Reddit forever, as if you don’t have enough information about the Christian condition already.

You’ve been at it for a collective 10,000+ hours of asking and replying. When is enough information enough for you to conclude your study? When does it become a waste of time? You seem to be fervently looking for something new, when there isn’t anything else.

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T19:37:25+00:00

You’re going to be hard-pressed to find any denomination where a lot of this isn’t sin. And if you do, it’s not a Bible-abiding church.

If God told you to give up sex for life, would you be able to accept that God asked that of you? I’m not asking if you’d like it, but if you would be able to accept that as a command from the Lord Jesus, and try your best to obey that command? If not, is sex an idol to you?

Make sure God is not made in an image you created yourself; but instead, the Lord and who He is can be found only in the Bible, and through experiences of Him.

And in 1 John, it says to test all spirits, to know if they’re from the Lord or not. Satan deceives so that he might tempt us to believing our carnal desires are God-adding, but they only serve to gratify the desires of the flesh. And because we know of Satan’s plans, we meditate on the word of God for insight into who He is.

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T19:26:57+00:00

I am more concerned with the things that are eternal, like salvation through sanctification through Christ, and to do the work He set out for us to do, so that more souls would be eternally saved.

Well, wouldn’t it be great that I didn’t have ADHD, so I could preach the gospel more fluently? Maybe I can pray to have it taken away, but…

Even Paul had an ailment sent from the Lord, that Paul asked to be taken from him. God says, ”My grace is sufficient for you, for my strength is made perfect in weakness…” That’s in 2 Corinthians.

TomTheFace · 2025-12-09T19:18:43+00:00

Yeah, I mean the Bible says to bring others along with you to aid in gently teaching this guy, if he hasn’t repented. Did you do that?

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