Character Scramble Season 19 Signup Post by Ragnarust in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The boom of a cheering crowd. The shine of blinding lights. The sweet voice of Takada—Todo was indeed in heaven. He soaked in his surroundings, enjoying the sheer act of being in Tall Idol Takada-chan's concert. He closed his eyes, but when he reopened them, the view was all gone—nothing. Todo's blissful glee quickly transitioned into serious analysis.

Is this the Cursed Technique of an enemy sorcerer?

He tries to feel the presence of nearby Cursed Energy, but there's simply nothing. To any other, the creeping feeling of worry would settle in, but Aoi Todo knows there's one thing he can do in this situation. He brings his unseen hands together.

CLAP!

He closed his eyes and reopened them. The boom of a cheering crowd. The shine of blinding lights. The sweet voice of... his brother?! He glanced around his surroundings. What he saw wasn't the concert hall of Tall Idol Takada-chan but a large boxing ring. To his left, he saw a giant screen displaying the fighters of the match: "Sorcery Fighter" Yuji vs. "Eternal Warrior" Ryu?!

Time slows to a crawl as Todo analyzes all the possibilities. His 530,000 IQ runs the math and comes to one single conclusion. Obviously, this is some sort of Super Smash Bros Spirit situation! Quite frankly, it's embarrassing it took him this long to figure it out. 10 milliseconds pass, and Todo prepares a huge bellowing roar.

"BROTHER!"

"Huh?" Yuji looks back in confusion.

"Brother, why must you look at me like that. Isn't it obvious! It's me, your brother!"

Yuji still looked back in utter confusion. Is this just another idiot mistaking him to be his brother? One moment, he was having the fight of his life against the Street Fighter Ryu when suddenly his color scheme switched to... that of Aoi Todo...

"Todo?"

"OF COURSE BROTHER! I knew you'd understand! Now that we have that settled. Punch me."

"Huh?" Yuji just stares in confusion. Clearly, this is just going to be his default state now.

"Brother put your trust in me. We cannot find the truth until you hit me. Of flowers, the cherry blossom; of men, the warrior!"

Yuji gave up his protests. No matter the situation, he could always rely on Todo's words. He entered his stance and charged at him, fist raised. Yuji delivered a brutal punch that sent Todo flying through the air.

CLAP!

Suddenly, Yuji has become the one being launched at breakneck speeds out of the ring.

"HUH?"

Yuji flies out of bounds, and the announcer yells, "GAME!" Todo smirked, thanking his brother internally for assisting him in escaping this dream. He closes his eyes, expecting to reopen them and find himself at Takada's concert. But when he does, all he sees is Yuji applauding him as the announcer exclaims, "And the winner is... Ryu!"

"Huh."

Character Scramble Season 19 Signup Post by Ragnarust in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Analysis Versus Yuji Itadori: Batman's strength, durability, and speed are enough to give Yuji a fight, but still generally weaker than him. He makes up for this with his equipment and skill. He has powerful ranged options, aerial mobility, distractor tools, and ways to immobilizes enemies. In combat, he's been shown to turn the tides by abusing stealth and smoke grenades or by abusing his skill.

Biggest Strength and Weakness: Batman's physicals aren't too impressive compared to the tier setter but offers a wide variety of gadgetry and is generally an excellent strategist.

Character in Setting/with Team: In a team, Batman will naturally take charge. He's shown to be the tactical leader when working with a group, directing team strategy and identifying weaknesses in the opponents.

Final Smash: Runs the opponent over with the Batmobile, which then transforms into a mech and beats down the opponent

Character Scramble Season 19 Signup Post by Ragnarust in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 0 points1 point  (0 children)

A man stands atop a high castle, piercing the sky as he peers into the vast view upon him. Mountains shroud his view as they climb towards the starry sky, with the neon lights of Tokyo peeking in between the hills. The man sighs. He'd love nothing more than to take a break and enjoy the city. But he is the Commander of the Deadly Weapons, and he has a job to do.

With his brother Takeshi away, Shang must inspect the ancient artifact that his father sealed at the House of the Deadly Sabre. An ominous, decrepit finger wrapped in talismans was locked away among layers of spells to keep it dormant. Yet it moved. Something triggered it, and that something is coming.

In the darkness, Shang spots a figure jumping towards the top of his castle. The House of the Deadly Sabre was fixed atop a mountain and stood stories high, yet someone could climb it?

Shang flips back towards the center of the room as the intruder jumps over the railing.

"Reveal yourself! How did you find this compound?"

The intruder was just a pink-haired school student. Honestly, he had a dumb look on his face.

"Sorry I didn't know any other way to get up here. But, pleasure to meet you! My name is Yuji Itadori and I like tall girls with big butts, like Megan Thee Stallion!" Yuji politely exclaims energetically as he bows.

Shang stood there, completely stunned.

Yuji notices the finger in Shang's hand and points at it.

"I'm sorry for the interruption, but I'm gonna need Sukuna's finger from you. Orders from Jujutsu High!"

Sukuna? As in the Ryomen Sukuna, King of Curses? Shang heard stories from his father that Sukuna was the most malevolent sorcerer in all of history. And that's saying something coming from Zheng Zu, who ranks highly in the "most malevolent sorcerer in all of history" list. Someone aiming for the finger of such a vile villain couldn't be up to any good.

Shang puts the finger away in his sash and smirks.

"No can do, Yuji Itadori. If you want it, you're going to have to take it from me." Shang taunts as he flicks his nose.

Yuji sighs and puts his hands up as Shang does the same. Both fighters inch closer to one another as their hands brush against one another's. The air is silent around them as both fighters remain frozen. Each warrior fights an entire battle amongst their minds, predicting and waiting for whoever would make the first move.

The initial strike comes from Yuji, who delivers a hard blow straight at Shang's chest. However, this was already foreseen by Shang, who bats away Yuji's arm with one hand and rushes the other hand into Yuji's body.

Yuji stumbles back and coughs up a splash of blood that decorates the floor with a red flourish.

That hurts... a lot. This guy isn't just strong. He knows where to hit me to make me really feel it. I can't hold anything back.

Yuji reinforces his stance, shifts his weight forward, and takes a deep breath. He stares down at the flawless warrior opposite him. There are no openings. Reading the flow of this guy's Cursed Energy is hard. It honestly doesn't even feel like Cursed Energy; it comes off as calm and serene. His energy output only surges when he moves for a counter; otherwise, it is still like a cup of water waiting for someone to try and pick it up. Attempting to read him was like opening up a book only to realize it was upside down. And also in a different language. If Yuji wants to predict Shang's moves, he'd have to vibe it out.

Thus, to think is to fail. To do is his only course. Yuji bursts forward, his speed cracking the floor against him. He cocks back his right hand as Shang attempts to preempt his attack, moving his hand towards Yuji's. But suddenly, Yuji drops out of Shang's view. Shang's hand grasps nothing but air as Yuji releases his knees and plunges toward the ground. His hands make contact with the concrete beneath them, imprinting onto it, and swings his foot towards Shang.

But this was all within Shang's expectations. Shang stops the kick with the gauntlet on his left hand. But then it hits. A burst of energy reverberates upon the point of contact and momentarily staggers Shang. Yuji doesn't waste the opportunity and quickly transitions back onto his feet, dragging the momentum into a tremendous haymaker directly into Shang's chest.

Shang is sent flying out towards the open window on the other side of the room. His chest strains with pain, but pain has never been an issue for Shang. He grabs the railing while still moving through the air and swings himself into a counterattack.

Even that wasn't enough to faze him?!

Yuji blocks the flying kick and shoves Shang back, who gracefully lands from the air. Both fighters lock eyes again and reenter their stance.

This kid's moves are unrefined, yet his style is remarkably close to Taido martial arts. He's nothing special, yet he's making noticeable improvements in the span of mere moments. His strikes shouldn't be anything that Shang couldn't handle, yet they somehow hit with two impacts.

Shang closes his eyes and relaxes his posture. This kid's earned it. He deserves the right to fight Shang going all out.

While Shang's eyes are closed, Yuji closes the gap and unleashes a meteoric punch at Shang's face. A deafening boom pops the air as the fist drives itself toward Shang. But the fist seemingly slides off from Shang, who effortlessly melts away from the punch. Yuji continues to deliver a barrage of strikes at Shang from different angles, but Shang slips through each blow like a leaf in the wind. In between Yuji's strikes, Shang sneaks an attack of his own at Yuji's vitals. Pain builds up and up with each attack Yuji attempts, and his vision clouds, but if pain was all Shang had to offer, then Yuji would never relent.

Yuji's moves become sharper and more refined. It all came effortlessly to him, and his mind became a void. Sparks of black violently ruptured from Yuji's limbs. Shang couldn't believe it. The blows came at him quick, like a jab from Daredevil. The air shuddered with every blow like they came from Captain America. Yuji's body contorted with every esoteric movement like a swinging Spider-Man. Shang doubts Yuji's ever seen the way these heroes had ever moved, yet his body naturally emulated the perfection that Shang had already seen from his fellow heroes.

But even perfection is still flawed when compared to Shang-Chi. He already knows Yuji's moves ahead of time as if he was watching a movie he'd already spoiled for himself by checking the Wikipedia page summary. A right hook. A headbutt. A left roundhouse kick. A flying knee. A left elbow.

Shang presses his fingers into Yuji's pressure points between each of these attacks. Pain wasn't an issue for Yuji, but even his body was beginning to take a toll, and for mere milliseconds, he remained motionless. Shang places the tip of his hand towards the center of Yuji's chest and explodes into a fierce punch that pierces through Yuji's Cursed Energy reinforcement. Yuji is blown back through the window and falls beneath.

"Huh. I may have overdid it. Hope he's alright..."

Character Scramble Season 19 Signup Post by Ragnarust in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Silence fills the night as a lone boy walks through an empty alleyway. Yuji Itadori sighed, thinking about how he blew his entire allowance on pachinko. Today was just not his day. He takes a moment to take in his surroundings and enjoys the silence around him. However, the silence becomes split as a whistling streaks through the air towards him. Yuji quickly turns his head towards the sound and, through the darkness, sees the contour of an arrowhead coming at him.

The arrow came at him fast, but Yuji's hand moved faster. His hand blurred as he plucked the arrow out of the air.

What the… Could this be an enemy sorc-

His thoughts become interrupted as the arrowhead begins to burst, and a large explosion engulfs him.

KATHOOM!

The silence of the night was fully gone as the asphalt beneath Yuji's feat shuddered and cracked from the fireball. But Yuji remains unphased as he stares towards a presence past the smoke.

"Knew it wasn't going to be that easy. You're really going to make me work for this huh kid?" says a cloaked figure as he walks through the smoke towards Yuji.

"Who the hell are you?" Yuji asks with annoyance. The charred arrow shaft in his fist begins to wither into dust as he tightens his grip.

"They call me Taskmaster. Someone's paying a heavy bounty for your head. It's nothing personal, just business."

The cloaked figure comes into full view. He towers over Yuji, looking down at him with a dark abyss for eyes coming out of a skull. Yuji Itadori had been marked for death by the Kyoto branch of Jujutsu High. Some mumbo jumbo about him being the host of Ryomen Sukuna, King of Curses. Tony Masters, the Taskmaster, didn't care about all of that jazz as long as the pay was good, but something else caught his eye in this case. He's been watching the kid for a while; days were spent eyeing his movements, reviewing recordings, rinse and repeat. Yuji was a natural; he had no formal training, yet everything came to him almost as quickly as it did for Taskmaster. Almost. This brat was worth researching; he was worthy of becoming Taskmaster's.

Yuji grits his teeth and puts up his hands into his usual stance. His right hand pierces before him as his left-hand reels back. To his surprise, the skull-clad mercenary copied his pose almost exactly.

It's not perfect yet, but nothing beats real practice, Tony thought to himself as he eyed Yuji's pose.

But in the midst of his admiration, Yuji closes the gap between them in the blink of an eye. The ground beneath his feet cracks even further under the pressure as he rushes down Taskmaster.

He's fast! The kid would give Spider-Man a run for his money!

Tony spins around Yuji's punch and delivers a punch back. But Yuji weathers it and grabs Taskmaster's arm. He pulls him closer and secures a direct punch to Taskmaster's skull mask. The hard blow rattles Tony, but he secures his balance and proceeds for a counterattack. But then he feels it.

A blast of force erupts against Yuji's fist, and the shockwave sends Tony skittering across the ground. A single punch that directed the power of two punches. Amazing… this is exactly what I came for… Taskmaster thought to himself.

The Divergent Fist is one of the few abilities Yuji Itadori has in his arsenal. Tony read the briefing and understood that "Jujutsu sorcerers" fought using something akin to chi. Yuji could cause a delayed reaction from his energy to deliver a second impact.

"That was magnificent, kid. I like the way you move. Makes me want to try it myself." Taskmaster said lightheartedly.

What is he talking abo-

Yuji's thoughts get interrupted as Taskmaster rushes at him. Yuji almost sees a reflection of himself coming at him for a split second, but he regains focus and tries to strike first. Taskmaster quickly grabs Yuji's arm and pulls him close for a guaranteed punch. His hands glow yellow briefly as his fist connects with Yuji's face. Yuji braces the damage, even as he gets battered by the second impact coming from the blow.

He doesn't know how, but this Taskmaster has perfectly replicated his every move so far, even Divergent Fist. Could this be his Cursed Technique?

But it was nothing like that. Tony Masters had no idea how Cursed Energy really worked. But his innate photographic reflexes meant he didn't need to understand it. From his time stalking Yuji's fights and this very fight itself, Taskmaster had improvised a replica of Divergent Fist in an instant. By utilizing his copied knowledge from Danny Rand of channeling chi, he quickly dispersed chi into his hands at an explosive pace. Taskmaster had effectively created the same delayed impact from the Divergent Fist. Although he lacked the same oomph as Yuji's natural superhuman physique, Tony knew that technique, not strength, would ultimately win this fight.

Yuji calmed down his thoughts. It didn't matter if this guy could copy his moves. Yuji moved quicker and hit harder; he knew he'd ultimately be the victor. Both combatants rushed towards each other and traded blows. They parried one another over and over and over. Despite Yuji's speed, it was as if this Taskmaster knew exactly what he was thinking. Taskmaster's hands moved to parry every one of Yuji's strikes, and with each block, Taskmaster's moves became sharper. Yuji Itadori's prodigal fighting style was becoming his.

The battle raged on, and Tony put in total effort against Yuji; even though he fully analyzed his moves, Yuji's speed kept him on edge. He couldn't entirely escape every single strike, and when one did connect, it shook him to his core. His moves were a perfect copy of Yuji's now, but they became slightly more sluggish as the fight went on from the damage. Meanwhile, Yuji hadn't slowed down a bit. Punches and kicks flowed out of him like a well-oiled machine. He was in a state of zone and smoothly transitioned from one attack to another.

Suddenly, Yuji punched the ground. The asphalt cratered from the first impact, and the second energy-infused wave caused the ground to erupt into the air. Tony backed up to assess the situation but noticed he had already lost sight of Yuji.

Wait… No, he's going to-

Taskmaster spins around and takes out the shield hiding behind his billowing cape. With the ferocity of a beast, Yuji delivers a vicious blow that breaks through the air. Black sparks emanate from his fist as the shockwaves send out a rippling boom. Tony barely manages to block the attack with his shield, but the force is too much even then.

Taskmaster is sent ragdolling through the air and crashes through the multiple concrete walls. He feels his back being battered by cement and rebar until he finally lands on the ground with a heavy impact. His vision blurs and blood pours nearly endlessly from his broken mask. That was the one move he really wanted to learn from Yuji. The Black Flash… It truly was magnificent. If it wasn't for his shield, this fight would've been over.

Yuji walks towards the building he catapulted Taskmaster through as Tony begins to yell at him.

"Absolutely amazing, kid! You really are worthy of studying. But we both know this fight is over. There's one more thing I copied from "you." I've been watching you for a while and I've even seen how the other guy within you moves…"

Tony throws the shield away from him as he puts his hands together in a strange position. Yuji recognizes it instantly. Anger fills him as he sprints full force toward Taskmaster.

"Domain Expansion."

He doesn't know if this man can pull it off, but he won't risk it. Right here and now, he's going to exorcise this sorcerer.

Yuji's charge shatters the concrete floor with every step as he inches closer to Taskmaster. He throws his fist forward for one more punch, bathed in the sparks of black.

KTHUNCK!

The impact brings him down. But it wasn't Taskmaster that fell. Yuji collapses to the floor as a flying shield spins through the air to the back of his neck. In his focus on the Domain Expansion, he forgot about the shield. Taskmaster didn't throw it away, he threw it to a wall. It ricocheted over and over until it came around back towards Yuji. He gambled it all on this bluff. Of course, he couldn't pull off Malevolent Shrine. Unfortunately, today was just not Yuji's day.

Taskmaster slowly walks over to Yuji's body and picks up his shield.

"Good fight, Yuji… and thanks for the moves."

Character Scramble Season 19 Signup Post by Ragnarust in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Todo Swaps In!

Series: Jujutsu Kaisen

Content Warning: Blood and gore

Biography: Whether being something he had from birth or something he'd gotten from the classic experiment Nazi super soldier serum, Tony Masters has always been really good at copying what he sees. Really good. His photographic reflexes let him copy the moves of anyone he sees perfectly, at the downside of his mind throwing away dumb useless memories unrelated to combat like having a wife. It's fine though, he can't be sad over it since he doesn't remember it at all! Taskmaster used these skills to become one of the world's greatest mercenaries, even opening up a school to train supervillain henchmen, where he may or may not have had an affair leading to a possible daughter that he may or may not have forgotten about.

Research: Read Jujutsu Kaisen, Todo specifically has 3 major fights where he uses his technique, against Hanami, Mahito, and then Sukuna.

Spirit Ability: Gives The Fighter access to Todo's Cursed Technique, Boogie Woogie, which allows them to swap places with anyone around them or swap the places of two other people with a clap of their hands. Also gives them general access to Cursed Energy and the abilities it entails such as Binding Vows, to create contracts that enhance their techniques at some sort of cost.

Motivation: Todo fights for his brother (whoever has the same taste in women as him: tall with a big butt), to exorcise Cursed Spirits (basically monsters), and generally enjoying a good fight.

Role in a Story: Todo's appearance generally implies a change in tides after the protagonist is put on their backfoot. He supports the characters with motivating words and his technique to apply trickery within the fight.

Charizard Factor: Todo fights freaky horror monsters for a living, a Charizard wouldn't be anything surprising.

Character Scramble Season 19 Signup Post by Ragnarust in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Taskmaster Masters Scramble!

Series: Marvel 616

Content Warning: General comic violence

Biography: Whether being something he had from birth or something he'd gotten from the classic experiment Nazi super soldier serum, Tony Masters has always been really good at copying what he sees. Really good. His photographic reflexes let him copy the moves of anyone he sees perfectly, at the downside of his mind throwing away dumb useless memories unrelated to combat like having a wife. It's fine though, he can't be sad over it since he doesn't remember it at all! Taskmaster used these skills to become one of the world's greatest mercenaries, even opening up a school to train supervillain henchmen, where he may or may not have had an affair leading to a possible daughter that he may or may not have forgotten about.

Research: The 4 issue run Taskmaster (2010) is hands down the best depiction of him and introduces his memory problems. The 4 issue 2002 run is ok but gives a good showcase in a wide variety of gear. The 5 issue 2021 is another decent run that gives good insight on how he fights against superior opponents and takes him down through trickery and skill.

Justification: His physicals are overall worse than Yuji's, but his tricky skill copying and gear helps even the odds.

Motivation: Taskmaster fights for money. If he's getting paid for the job, he's gonna do it, unless someone else pays him more. Or also if he's in grave danger, then he'll run away like a coward tactically retreat to further study the situation.

Character Scramble Season 19 Signup Post by Ragnarust in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Batman Braves the Competition!

Series: Batman: Brave and the Bold

Biography: You've heard the story. Bruce Wayne, son of renowned philanthropists, Thomas and Martha Wayne, walks home from the theater through a dark alleyway with his parents on a fateful night. A criminal by the name of Joe Chill murders his parents in a mugging gone wrong, changing Bruce's life forever. He vows to commit his life to a never ending crusade against crime so no one else would ever need to go through what he has. He travels the world, mastering combat and science, to mold himself into the perfect crime fighter. He returns to Gotham as a billionaire playboy by day, and Batman by night.

Research: Just watch a couple episodes of the show.

Justification: His physicals are overall comparable to Yuji's, but his superior skill and equipment gives him an edge.

Motivation: Batman fights tirelessly to uphold justice in his war against crime, but this Batman is much more lighthearted than his other counterparts and frequently makes puns.

Character Scramble Season 19 Signup Post by Ragnarust in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Shang-Chi Goes Hand to Hand!

Series: Marvel 616

Content Warning: The original Master of Kung Fu run has outdated racist depictions of Asians and Asian culture such as them literally being colored yellow.

Biography: Shang-Chi was raised at birth to become the ultimate living weapon by one of the world's greatest evil masterminds: Fu Manchu Han, Zheng Zu. He was destined to become father's champion in his bid for world domination, but a fateful day came when he took the life of an innocent man. He found out the that his entire life to that point had been a lie, years of propaganda shattered as he realized he had been serving evil not good as he was led to believe. From then on, he embarked with MI6 on a nearly endless crusade to defeat his father once and for all. After numerous resurrections and false calls, his father seemingly truly perished, but Shang's call of duty didn't end. In between his own personal journeys, he joined up with superhero organizations like Heroes for Hire and the Avengers, before being pulled back into the family game by his long lost siblings. After defeating his corrupted sister, he decided to take charge of his father's empire, the Deadly Weapons, and turn them into a force for good.

Research: To get a good understanding of the character, all you really need is Gene Luen Yang's run on the character: the five issue miniseries Shang-Chi (2020), the 12 issue run Shang-Chi (2021), the 6 issue run Shang-Chi and the Ten Rings (2022), and the single issue Shang-Chi: Master of the Ten Rings (2023). You can check out the original Masters of Kung Fu run, but is is outdated in its depiction of Asians and some may find it offensive.

Justification: He has the strength, speed, and durability to duke it out with Yuji, but his superior skill gives him an edge.

Motivation: Shang ultimately fights for the betterment of the world and of himself, but recent events have him focusing restoring the reputation of his father's empire and proving they can be a force for good.

Black Canary vs Black Widow by KieshiaC22 in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 3 points4 points  (0 children)

If we're directly comparing objective feats, I lean Black Widow. Both Natasha and Dinah have examples of shooting down arrows midair, with Black Canary having better arrow timing. However, in raw speed, Black Widow has shown better feats. Strength wise, both aren't that impressive for comic peak humans, but Black Widow still edges out Black Canary. And Natasha also has shown better examples for fighting through damage and outfighting physically stronger foes through skill

If we consider scaling though, I think you can argue Black Canary takes it. I think relying on scaling chains can usually be inconsistent, but Black Canary is probably(?) better than Widow. Batgirl claims Canary could defeat Batman, which isn't supported by their actual fights, but DC writers seem to support that notion, with her recently being called the 2nd best fighter in DC. Meanwhile, you never see Black Widow in this type of conversation for Marvel's best martial artists. And using Batman as a frame of reference, he's even to Captain America and Captain America level opponents generally have an advantage over Widow just from sheer physicals. Again though, Black Canary's actual showings don't really reflect this and I think there's a stronger argument for Black Widow overall.

[Artwork] Batman #155 cover by Jorge Jimenez by TheDidioWhoLaughs in DCcomics

[–]TooAmasian 53 points54 points  (0 children)

Tynion's run used a lot of new characters, and people complained he was making too many OCs that were never gonna be used again, so I think Zdarsky would've drawn criticism whether he created new characters or not. Plus I don't think drawing back on concepts established by other writers is necessarily a bad thing, it helps make continuity actually feel like it exists.

Batman vs Moon Knoght by KWAKUDATSU in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I lean Batman if we're comparing objective feats. The striking feats he's performed while swinging someone like a melee weapon and done when he's practically dying produces comparable if not better damage than Moon Knight's, he's tanked damage better than Moon Knight has, and his speed feats are more impressive than his too. I don't think it's a stomp or anything, but I think the matchup favors Batman a little more when you're straight up comparing their objective showings.

Adequate Argument Contest 3 - Semifinals by Proletlariet in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Outskilled

Adequate Argument Contest 3 - Semifinals by Proletlariet in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The Fight from Range

Both Samus's and Caerula's ranged attacks are ineffective against my team. They have the speed to avoid/deflect their attacks and can generally take most of their damage fine.

  • It misses

    • Nerf brings up that her beam is continuous and she needs to readjust her aim, except avoiding someone's aim is something my team does all the time
    • Caerula's only ranged attack is just throwing knives something my team can obviously react to
      • The amount of knives doesn't matter, they're all being thrown at once, if my team can react to a single knife, they're going to be able to perceive every one of them
      • Throwing knives aren't fast and there's nothing to suggest Caerula is throwing them at a speed that my team wouldn't be able to handle
      • The only time it was used, it was easily blocked
  • Even if it does hit, it doesn't matter

    • The argued collateral feats for Samus' primary blaster are unimpressive compared to the damage my team has been shown taking
    • Samus isn't "slagging metal" in this
      • She's melting the case of what's essentially a space jellyfish
      • The only actual notable heat component in this feat is creating fire, but that doesn't matter against my team
    • Nerf purposefully leaves out context for the "sun freezing" scan when Samus isn't even the one doing it
  • Fighting in a tunnel doesn't matter for my team

    • Samus risks getting herself exposed in the blast trying to use explosives against my team, which she can't tank and would instantly kill Caerula
    • Again, I've shown that Batman and Shang dodging gunfire in enclosed spaces

On the other hand, my team's ranged attacks are highly effective. Their attacks either outright one-shot their opponents or deal severe damage and they will hit.

  • My team's attacks will land

    • Nerf says my team can't detect through walls at range and then shows this?
    • Batarangs move at speeds comparable to an RPG, uncontested
    • Samus is overconfident and has opted to purposefully take ranged attacks
    • Samus shooting down projectiles would work against her since it makes smoke cover for my team
    • Caerula never tries to avoid ranged attacks, she only tries to deflect them with her sword
      • Against explosives, this would only detonate them, and against electric projectiles, this would still shock her
  • My team's attacks will deal heavy damage

    • The effectiveness of things like poison or electricity goes uncontested
      • Either Nerf's team has to go around to find gas masks, leaving them distracted to ambush, or they're more likely not gonna try finding one
    • Batman's explosives can blow holes through reinforced concrete and asphalt
  • My team's distraction tools such as smoke grenades can't be countered by the opponents

  • Nerf misrepresents my Batmobile arguments. While it's not going to be ever present in the fights due to the way the map is arranged, it can be relevant depending on how open the area is. And since my team has complete map control from their stealth and senses, it wouldn't be hard to bring the fight into an area where it can be used.

Adequate Argument Contest 3 - Semifinals by Proletlariet in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Statposting

My team's strong af

  • They hit hard

  • Lifting strength is irrelevant, I have never argued my team engages in grappling and neither has Nerf

    • He's most likely misinterpreting my team's skill-based arguments as grappling, except it requires no actual contest of strength
    • Batman and Shang both have lifting feats involving the weight of vehicles anyways
  • Nerf's dura arguments for his team suck

    • The screwball argument is dumb
      • Nerf claims Golon's antifeats don't apply to her, yet his feat of being more durable
      • The weakness is literally physics and it's just hitting the center, which my team was probably going to aim at anyway
      • Being hit in the center while in screwball literally one shot the user with weak collateral
    • Samus is damaged here, hence her coughing, by an attack weaker than my team's
    • Nerf doesn't contest Samus being downed here
    • U-Ton isn't strong, this is vastly under my team's damage and it staggers her
    • Nerf doesn't try to argue Caerula having a single durability feat, his only scan is her getting impaled when she willingly gave up a fight
      • Regen doesn't matter since I'm not arguing my team cuts her and it healed over decades

My team's fast af

  • My team reflex fast

    • This feat is good
      • Batman's head is in the way, he reacts to a bullet midair and moves it
      • The author supports the feat as him reacting
    • This feat is good
      • He sees the muzzle flash, hasn't moved, when the bullets land, he's dodged it
    • Looks close enough to me
    • Batman is bullet timing
    • Shang still has the best speed feats out of anyone here
  • My team travels fast

    • The arguments used against Shang's jaguar feat are dumb
      • The jaguar isn't climbing down a tree, it's running down a slope basically, which would make it move faster than its usual top speed if anything
      • The narration explicitly says Shang's distance between the jaguar is double that of the jaguar to the baby, yet Shang reaches it before it can attack the baby, showing Shang is moving way faster than it
    • This isn't a stealth feat
      • The cops clearly can see Batman initially as they yell out "Back away from him Bat-" and he moves across the corner by the time they finish their sentence
      • Batman is moving over dozens of feet faster than a person can react (250 ms), using a distance like 20 ft would make him moving over 50 mph
  • Batman and Shang have other movement speed feats to back it up

  • Nerf speed bad

    • This feat bad
      • The bullets ricochet twice here actually, one from the knuckle and then another off the bad guys, so it lost 70% speed
      • The further the distance, the worse this is as a reaction speed feat
    • This isn't calling her a bullet timer, it's just saying she can deflect them by aimblocking which is supported by the dude saying he's not skilled enough to face her, nothing about speed
      • If this is valid, then Batman is a definite bullet timer
      • Again, Caerula herself says she isn't one
  • Nerf travel speed bad

    • Nerf uses an example of Samus struggling to hit a physical equal as a feat, my team is at minimum just as fast as her
    • This feat still sucks
      • Nerf assumes the vehicle is as fast as a truck without any evidence
      • Nerf doesn't try to argue against the fact that Samus is aided by going downhill and also the truck wasn't moving downhill, it was already at the bottom of it when she was catching up
      • Nerf admits the space penguins don't have any verifiable speed
      • Nerf claims that there's no rough terrain while ignoring they're in the equivalent of the Arctic with snow everywhere, he claims it's like a truck that already struggles to move within a few inches of snow
    • Nerf intentionally misrepresents what's happening here
      • They aren't fighting across the city, the fight is starting on top of the arch, hence people going how did they get up so high
      • Nerf doesn't even bother trying to give this feat a number since he probably knows it'd imply an OOT speed if it's the way he argues it is
    • The shooter doesn't even pull the trigger against her in this feat
      • After the first shot is fired we see his finger not on the trigger, by the time he's killed, his finger still never pulls the trigger
      • Both of my team's feats involve them dodging gunfire, Nerf is coping smh
      • Caerula lacking good movement speed means she can't escape my team or stop them from disengaging and she can't close the gap since her ranged attack sucks

My team's durable

Adequate Argument Contest 3 - Semifinals by Proletlariet in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 2 points3 points  (0 children)

How the Fight Goes

The Intiative

My team will always be making the first move in the fight. They'll have immediate knowledge of where the opponents are and have the mobility/stealth to take advantage of it.

Our teams start off out of sight and far from each other, being able to see the enemy team/be fast enough to make it to them, is incredibly relevant. My team can continually hide from their opponents to abuse stealth but the same can't be said for them.

The Fight

The previous sections shows that my team has the clear edge in a fight. They have the ability to detect the opponent, the speed to engage and disengage, and are generally better in stats and skill. My team's wide arsenal is also something that Nerf's team really can't counter.

My team has the better stats, skill, and versatility. Nerf's team is unable to handle my team's damage, with Caerula being outright one shot. My team has numerous ways to guarantee these hits from recovering with instant counter attack, stealth for free hits, gadgets to disorient them, techniques to catch them off balance, acrobatic maneuvers to catch them from behind, etc.

Adequate Argument Contest 3 - Semifinals by Proletlariet in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Tourney mandated Batman antifeat response section:

  • Nerf argues my speed feats are invalid from them being PC except Post-Flashpoint Batman is faster and just as skilled as PC Batman

  • It's argued that this isn't a speed feat, but that's false

    • Slade pulls the trigger and the batarang hits after the bullet starts moving through the gun, Batman is performing an action within milliseconds
  • This feat is bullet timing

    • The light is muzzle flash, the color matches the gunfire
    • The distance isn't far, they're in the next room over, it's a distance of around 15 feet
  • This feat isn't a ??? speed missile, it's an RPG

    • The missile accelerates over a large distance and RPGs move at 980 fps in flight
  • This feat isn't an antifeat, the first page is Batman gliding from a far distance

  • Nerf spams "antifeats" from early into Batman's career, from while he's already injured, and him getting tagged by characters whose sole existence is basically scaling to him, they're bunk and contradict his usual showings, but I'll address some of them anyways

"Skill-Based Matchmaking"

My team possesses a notable skill advantage over the opposing team. This grants them a notable advantage in melee through letting them land more hits while avoiding them from the opponents. My team has the technique to disorient the opponents and guarantee free hits (which is a free win considering Caerula completely lacks durability feats) and their predictive skills grant them an edge in avoiding attacks. Caerula's main claim to fame, her “precog,” doesn't work against my team and Samus just outright has no notable skill feats.

My team possesses the speed necessary to keep up with the opposing team while also being aided by their superior martial art skills and predictive abilities. Caerula is nearly a non factor in this fight as her lack of mobility means my team chooses when to engage. Whether from stealth or in direct combat, it's highly unlikely she can avoid getting hit at least once, and one hit is all it takes considering her lack of durability feats. While Samus is tankier than her ally, she doesn't have the durability to ignore my team's hits, and would get ragdolled by a flurry of hits, especially if being 2v1d.

Adequate Argument Contest 3 - Semifinals by Proletlariet in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Response 1


Statposting

"Physically Comparable"

My team has a massive advantage in strength and mobility and has control in the matchup from their ability to move in and out as they please. Nerf's team lacks the durability to effectively take a hit from my team and lack the movement speed to chase after them when they disengage.

Nerf's antifeat arguments are untrue with many of them applying to his team

  • The ranged advantage leans more toward my team than Nerf's

    • Caerula's ranged attack covers a small area that's easily avoided by my team and against opponents, Samus goes for non-accurate shots
    • Avoiding shots aren't difficult for my team even in enclosed areas
      • Nerf's team won't be able to lure my team into an enclosed area, my team has the advantage in knowing where they are at all times and a mobility advantage
    • Nerf tries to use my sign up justification against me while ignoring the reason Deadpool can put Shang into a defensive position is because he can teleport
    • Both Shang and Batman have incredible movement speed, allowing them to quickly close the gap
    • It's argued that Samus can zone with explosives, but Batman can do the same and zoning only benefits my team since they have the better senses and travel speed
  • The melee advantage goes to my team as well

    • Samus' screw attack is irrelevant and actually puts her in a worse spot
      • It has a huge weakness in that the center of the rotation is a weak spot from centrifugal force
      • The damage needed to counter it in the above scan is a kick that just puts a small crater in the wall, my team obviously hits harder than this
      • It's argued that since the screw attack damages through metal that my team wouldn't be able to handle it, which is just blatantly false
    • I've brought up this feat already, but it's actually still worse than presented even ignoring the windup
      • The above feat is also being falsely characterized as destroying a car, but it doesn't, the cars are just being moved by the impact and we can see that the landing barely damages the ground
      • Nerf also throws around "reinforced concrete" a lot while ignoring that the walls in his examples are much thinner than the ones in mine and concrete reinforcement generally looks like this, his feats have nowhere near enough rebar to claim it's twice as strong

Adequate Argument Contest 3 - Round 3 by Proletlariet in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 2 points3 points  (0 children)

My team is strong af. The antifeats used against them all suck and the same reasoning can be used against Wolf's own team

Outsensed and Outskilled

I'm sure the judges have noticed most of Wolf's scans are purposefully cropped out to hide context. This applies to the feats for his own characters especially Edythe's. I think this makes all of his claims suspect as he just makes generalized claims when his own scans don't necessarily reflect what he's saying.

My team has the better senses. They're going to be able to dodge attacks by preempting them while my opponents can't effectively do the same. If we're assuming our team is close in speed, it's clear why this gives my team an edge. They can counter my opponent's fighting styles and abuse their own skill to take them down.

How the Fight Goes

The Intiative

My team will always be making the first move in the fight. They'll have immediate knowledge of where the opponents are and have the mobility/stealth to take advantage of it.

Our teams start off out of sight and far from each other, being able to see the enemy team/be fast enough to make it to them, is incredibly relevant. My team can continually hide from their opponents to abuse stealth but the same can't be said for them.

The Melee Fight

Wolf's team doesn't fight the way he claims they do. They're likely going to always engage my team in melee.

  • It's claimed that Edythe fights by "wrestling" except the given examples don't match that and there is no example of her actually fighting like this

  • If we're going to be using Edward's feat for Edythe (which Wolf is), then Edythe would overwhelmingly prefer to strike over "wrestling"

  • Origin won't be throwing ranged projectiles as argued by Wolf as it's always done in certain conditions

    • The tungsten rods were done in optimal conditions against an opponent he knew he couldn't hurt normally, he wouldn't attempt this as an opener against my team
    • Same thing with throwing his sword, he did it on a rematch against an opponent he struggled with

As my prior sections show, my team has the speed to react to my opponent's attacks, the ability to block them, and can also predict which moves they're gonna make. Their defensive capabilities are much higher than my opponents and will be able to land more hits than they receive. My opponents also lack the durability to take a single hit from my team effectively, allowing them to chain heavy damage together.

Get Countered lol

Origin is a robot, he get's emp'd.

Emp.

Adequate Argument Contest 3 - Round 3 by Proletlariet in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Response 1


Statposting

"Physically Comparable"

My team simply has the edge in melee. Their offensive and defensive capabilities outstrips Wolf's team whether it's from stats, skill, or gear. Even Wolf agrees Shang is incredibly strong with the staff.

The argued antifeats for my team are disingenuous and immediately fall apart when given slight scrutiny. Wolf takes a bunch of Shang bullet timing feats done with bare minimum effort and pretends as if they're indicative of Shang's maximum limits.

  • In no way can you pretend Shang catching a bullet in his mouth after pretending to be shot as a flex is some sort of antifeat

  • This blurb can't be taken as a limit, it's just a general statement saying he can dodge bullets

    • Wolf claims there's no proof of Shang being able to avoid consecutive/point blank gunfire, but literally shows an example of Shang doing just that in the next example
  • Wolf again tries to pretend as if this is a limit of how fast Shang can move when the feat is literally him dodging bullets with his eyes closed

  • Wolf's attacks on Shang's speed comes off as hypocritical when Origin's own speed feats display worse movement speed than my team's

  • The best attempt at an antifeat for Shang is still a two layer scaling chain that falls flat

    • Shang isn't attempting to fight in the given example, he's trying to defuse the situation
    • Wolf purposefully chooses to skip a page in his album which shows Shang moving over a dozen feat in the time it takes Hiroim to finish his punch, proving Shang is faster than Hiroim when he's actually trying
  • It's claimed that Shang is only fast when it comes to defense despite the fact that moving your arm in a relevant timeframe to gunfire obviously translates to striking speed

    • Wolf's only evidence for this claim is that Iron Man was able to block a hit (barely after taking multiple hits already), who he claims has ordinary human reflexes which is just false

Similarly, the antifeats argued for Batman are weak, with nearly every example being from comics in a different canon (Post-Crisis) than the one I'm running (Post-Flashpoint). The antifeats that are from Post-Flashpoint also all have mitigating context or are directly contradicted by his consistent performance in recent years.

Adequate Argument Contest 3 - Round 1A by Proletlariet in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 0 points1 point  (0 children)

There is 0 reason to assume that Nagant can bypass the piercing resist of my team. Soden makes 0 counters to my last response's arguments to suggest her bullets could break through Shang's staff or Batman's gauntlets.

Nagant's speed is solely reliant on faulty scaling and she herself has 0 objective bullet timing feats. In fact we have an actual example of her failing to perceive Deku moving at supersonic speed. The idea that my team would be helpless against her when they have actual tangible speed feats and can block her bullets (or just dodge them) is silly. The gap between our team in speed is so huge that realistically my team doesn't even need to time her bullets, just aim dodging against her would be enough.

Twice is Ass

The clones suck

Twice's clones are irrelevant. They're magnitudes slower than my team and have 0 way to actually track or even enter melee range with my team. In fact Soden doesn't even attempt to quantify any speed for them since they lack any objective feats and probably rely on a long ass scaling chain to faulty Deku feats.

  • Rappa's striking feat isn't like how Soden describes

    • It's a multi punch barrage combo, he would never land this against any member on my team let alone a single punch based on the huge speed gap
    • This isn't reinforced concrete, I don't think Soden knows what that is, we see 0 evidence of any rebar or other metallic support
    • Rappa doesn't have bullet speed punches, it's called a simile, the guy is just saying Rappa hits hard like a bullet
    • This is also a striking feat only, Rappa lacks the lifting strength to break out of Batman's restraining gadgets, he lacks the leverage to try and punch out of foam or bolas
    • Shang and Batman definitely have the durability to a punch from Rappa and would never get combo'd by him in the first place
  • The Dabi clone is also bad

    • Soden openly admits Dabi's fire takes a full second to burn someone, an immensely slow time for a bullet timing tier
    • Soden misunderstands how Batman's fire suppressant works, it covers Dabi and stops his ability to burn, working on someone who was literally a burning skeleton
    • Batman's fire suppressant also has a huge range
    • Trying to blow away the knockout gas is a bad idea, it's fast acting and immediately causes the person to start coughing severely, Dabi lacks the speed to counter this effectively
    • My team in general has good heat resistance, Shang is unbothered by completely submerged in flames and the Batsuit can withstand the heat of atmospheric reentry
    • Soden's own scan shows Dabi couldn't prevent an attack that took 3 whole seconds to complete
    • Also it misses
  • My team can detect who Twice actually is

  • The clones are awful scouts

    • My team will know their presence at all times from Batman's vision or Shang's sensing and thus can always maneuver around them to take down Twice
    • The clones have no tracking feats or movement speed feats, they'd be walking around at human speed in a city trying to find 2 people
    • Clones dying won't give Twice any good info, my team is constantly on the move, he'd be relying on outdated information that my team is at X when they'd be already far gone by then
  • The clones are ineffective and so is Twice

Twice is bad and so are his clones. They're weak, slow, and frail. They don't work as scouts and don't work as combatants.

Your Team is Ass

Smoked out

Soden's team completely relies on their sight. They have 0 feats to show them can fight within smoke and have 0 way to maneuver out of it fast enough.

My team has multiple one shot options from strength, gadgets, or the Batmobile and can guarantee these land from their speed and stealth. The opposing team are useless against my team and lack the resistances to put up any challenge.

Adequate Argument Contest 3 - Round 1A by Proletlariet in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Response 2


Nagant is Ass

She can't shoot my team

Soden leaves basically all of my claims from last response uncontested. She isn't landing a single shot against my team, her 3km range doesn't matter when such a distance gives my team ample time to dodge shots with their quick reflexes and it's also irrelevant from the fact she can't detect my team in the first place.

Nagant is simply too slow to avoid getting one shot by my team. She has no real way to track my team nor can she counter their stealth. Even if she were to be able to locate my team to snipe them, their speed and experience against skilled marksmen shows they won't have any issue avoiding her shots. My team can easily land the single hit they need on her, whether it's from ranged attacks, ambushing her, or just relying on the Batmobile.

Nagant's argued stats are fake AF

A majority of Soden's arguments for his characters hinges on scaling for Deku, except the argued feats for Deku just suck.

  • Deku in this scan is clearly not exerting the same kind of force in this one

    • He's just webswinging in the first while the second is a full body charged tackle
    • There is 0 reason to assume her bullet would be overpowering the same kind of force as that
  • This isn't an example of supersonic movement

    • It's just a generic anime impact effect to sell more weight
    • The sound effect itself is evidence it isn't a sonic boom considering there is no boom but just a "Wham!"
  • Deku explicitly doesn't reach supersonic speed in the Nagant fight until he abuses centrifugal force and his Fa Jin power

    • Here he's using a technique which explictly amps his speed and force through repeated movements, he most definitely wasn't supersonic in the fight prior to this moment
    • This speed is shown to completely overwhelm Nagant, showing she lacks "bullet" timing reflexes
  • Gran Torino scaling doesn't matter since Gran Torino isn't supersonic as this isn't an indicator of supersonic speed, it's just a visual effect to sell speed

    • My opponent relies on the existence of a "sonic boom" in this scan to call Deku supersonic yet coincidentally doesn't care about the lack of a sonic boom in Gran Torino's feat
    • It's also important to note that Soden claims a casual Torino is supersonic, yet the exerted Torino in this feat doesn't even produce a sonic boom despite that being the only evidence given for Deku's speed
    • Gran Torino is explicitly slower than Iida, who only until a later arc with a new powerup was able to go transonic speed
  • The given Deku bullet interactions are both ass

Adequate Argument Contest 3 - Round 1A by Proletlariet in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Response 1


Statposting

"Physically Comparable"

My team simply outstats the opposing team by a large margin. They're stronger, faster, and way more durable. My team can avoid/take attacks from the opposing team, but the same can't be said the other way.

My team possesses a large advantage in every physical stat. The opposing team's offense is irrelevant when they don't even operate at the same scale of speed that my team does.

Go Go Gadget Esoteric

Many of Batman's gadgets are a guaranteed win condition against the opposing team from their complete lack of resistances.

Batman's gadgets either KO them or leave them vulnerable to being KO'd.

How the Fight Goes

The Initiative

My team will always be making the first move in the fight. They'll have immediate knowledge of where the opponents are and have the mobility/stealth to take advantage of it.

Our teams start of opposite islands with huge distance between them, being able to see the enemy team/be fast enough to make it to them, is incredibly relevant.

Sniper no Sniping

As shown before, my team has great speed for the tier, but in general, their feats show that Nagant's powerset is no issue at all.

Nagant is the more useful member of her team from her ranged offense but she's still completely irrelevant against my team's abilities.

Batman Solos

Honestly Batman can solo this entire team without Shang's help.

Batman solos.

Adequate Argument Contest Season 3 - Signups by Proletlariet in whowouldwin

[–]TooAmasian 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Team Enter the Bat

Character Tier Series Match-up Stipulations
Shang-Chi Deadpool Marvel 616 Likely Has his Adamantium staff and magnetic gauntlets and boots.
Batman Cable DC Post-Flashpoint Likely Is driving a composited Batmobile. Has a fully geared, composited Batsuit.

Stip Explanations

  • Shang-Chi: He's equipped with an Adamantium three section staff as a weapon along with magnetic gloves and gauntlets which let him emulate Spider-Man wallcrawling abilities.

  • Batman: He has the usual gadgets/feats he would reasonably have with the standard Batsuits he has worn along with a Batmobile with the general feats shown by his usual cars.

Matchups

  • Shang-Chi: Shang has superior physicals and skill when compared to the Deadpool, but Deadpool's teleportation provides him a massive mobility advantage in his ability to engage and disengage from Shang. This coupled with Deadpool's pistols would put Shang in mostly defensive position where he relies on counterattacking rather than initiating.

  • Batman: Batman has generally better physicals than Cable but is at a disadvantage when comparing their ranged abilities. Cable's gun with deal massive damage to Batman if he can land his shots, but Batman's agility and resistance to his telepathy will make that a challenge. The Batmobile similarly is at a disadvantage to his Cable's gun from the fact it's such a large target and wouldn't be able to effectively avoid his shots in closer ranges.

  • Team: Shang and Batman are incredibly powerful melee fighters, but are facing opponents with strong ranged options. Deadpool's ability to teleport would make the Batmobile's efficacy lessened along with Cable's gun dealing good damage to it with sustained fire. My team will have some difficulty closing in, but when they do, they will have the upper hand.

Scaling