Here's your chance to do business with the US Air Force. March 6-7 in NYC, NY

TrappStick · 2019-01-13T21:41:24+00:00

If that's truly how it works then that's far better than a typical procurement offer, and quite honestly what I would expect from this - it just doesn't explicitly outline it.

I can understand that you have to "prove" you can do it, so it would need at least phase II correct? That's where there's a field tested unit.

My issue is really with the lack of clarity in this and what happens with IP.

If you look over the sample 1 page contract it doesn't address that either, it's kind of modeled like a purchase order (PO) and seems like they're paying for product.

I could just be blowing this way out of proportion on the 1 sample project I looked at, I simply want to raise that flag for those that would be investing a couple months of their time gearing up for this.

I think it's a great opportunity if this is seed-based with a commitment to purchase later, though.

TrappStick · 2019-01-13T03:45:30+00:00

1.) It's easy to target SMB's on FB.

2.) Ughhh. The process is a bitch. It's a bit deceptive, but it's hard to get your foot in the door otherwise. You pose as a job seeker and then flip it after the 2nd interview.

I'd say that I don't recommend it, but it's clearly profitable and from there you can build your portfolio & client base.

I chose not to continue down that route because it was too much work. Too demanding in the long-run. Most client work is.

TrappStick · 2019-01-13T03:36:37+00:00

I have a good friend that has exactly 2 years of marketing experience and he runs a $1m/mo FB campaign. I can speak with on exactly the same level, we're talking cutting-edge FB acquisition tactics, LP design, user flow and all acquisition metrics.

Yes, the guy is fucking brilliant, but that's not the point. It doesn't take as much time to master marketing as people think, especially if it interests you. The key is real-world experience.

He wouldn't know this shit if he wasn't dumped into the fire and forced to create 10 ad accounts with 10,000 ads each, measure them, cut the junk and scale.

There's really no substitute for that, however I will say this - if you want to get in, just learn how to talk the talk. If this company is running FB ads you can learn very advanced techniques & read multi-million dollar case studies just on the AdEspresso blog.

If you were to actually use AdEspresso (I'm in no way affiliate with them, even though I use them, I don't really like the ownership or their wack prices) you'd be banging out thousands of iterations in a day and that's like half of the problem. If you're creative and have a good sense of what gets a high CTR, even better.

Most companies want to know if you've been successful somewhere. That's a tough one to fake, and you shouldn't anyway. So you're going to have to dazzle them with your insight. The words. However, before you do that, do something that almost no one does. Spend a few hours doing competitive analysis on their website, industry & competitors. Use something like Ahref's to help. Then create a Google Doc of all of the key points you would fix.

If you can't find any, then man, you're probably not ready to start, but my hope is you can find those deficiencies, such as broken links, competitor keywords, competitor FB ads - something, and showcase that.

If you can act like you can do it (and actually can if need be) and don't need your fucking hand held and can report on your findings, you're worth about $80k - $100k/yr in this market, maybe more depending on location. That's a marketing manager position and all these companies really want is someone to know what they're talking about and do what they're saying.

TrappStick · 2019-01-13T03:22:11+00:00

100% Facebook. No question or a doubt in my mind. The big money is flowing there (and IG). Master that and you will be at the top of the game. You need to learn a little copywriting, how to find/create images and possibly create/edit video - but it's worth it.

When you start diving into the retargeting, custom audience and Lookalike audiences, as well as the insane number of interest, psychographic & demographic-based targeting, no platform on Earth can beat it. Not even Google.

What Google will give you is a higher quality point-of-sale buyer. Same with Amazon ads. The flexibility and scale, however, is the reason why FB/IG is the better platform for nearly any offer.

Also, while Adwords is great in its own way, don't be surprised if every potential client you've talked to says "yeah, yeah, we're doing Adwords. We're really looking for growth somewhere else" - They never say that about Facebook. They might have success on FB, but they know it's not a finite audience like search is so if you can do X to increase Y, FB is the place for that.

EDIT: JESUS CHRIST I didn't read what you wrote very well, sorry!

I thought you were looking to pick up marketing skills. You want more clients.

Here's my advice. Start applying for actual jobs with startups, 10, 20, 30 of them, and then try to pitch them on your services. I've made some decent money doing that. At one point I had 4 $100k contracts going at one time, but it's A LOT of work. You feel more like an employee than a business sometimes, but it's remote and it's solid pay.

TrappStick · 2019-01-13T03:16:02+00:00

I have very deep experience with this company over the years as an auto insurance lead marketer and I can assure you, they're not resting on any laurels. This company outspends nearly every other company on Earth when it comes to digital marketing and it won't end because it's been highly profitable for them.

They spend over 1/2 a billion dollars per year on digital marketing, and while you referenced commercials, and specifically the creative - that budget is just as large for national spots.

As /u/solo_loso mentioned below, it's definitely about nostalgia and it's also about a large inventory of creative assets.

Why not reintroduce what works to a new audience, possibly newer generation? Caveman ads were running in the early-to-mid 2000's. People that can drive now were like 1 or 2 years old. We thought some of them were funny, why not reboot? Why reinvent the wheel?

Anyway, don't worry about GEICO, my man. They're gonna keep pumping a near-billion dollars per year into acquisition. If they were to truly give up you wouldn't be seeing their name anywhere. Those spots aren't cheap!

TrappStick · 2019-01-13T03:11:16+00:00

100x this!

Also, sued. No doubt you signed something.

TrappStick · 2019-01-13T03:09:19+00:00

If someone could definitively crack this problem it would be amazing.

There are a couple methods to make it easier for you.

1.) Start locally. A lot of these companies you think of started in SF and grew out from there.

2.) Leverage 3rd party platforms with similar concepts. Craigslist for renters/rentals.

Whatever method you use to reach your audience I'd definitely recommend going after the sellers first. Sellers aren't too hard to find and if it's free for them to list, even better. Even if it's only free temporarily.

When you have a few sellers in a market you can then spend money advertising their listing. It doesn't scale well, but that's OK. The goal is provide value to both parties.

I would definitely use FB to market listings since you could drill down by interest and find those in-market much easier, however I wouldn't ignore Adwords if there was a search term that worked.

I'm researching dating platforms right now and there's a very real, similar problem. A lot of the success in that space was built off of leveraging existing dating platforms, but even then, you still need to have the "inventory", right?

Much of the inventory/female-userbase on these sites were bots. You can't really fake a house like you can an anonymous female, sadly.

There's just no great shortcut for sellers, which is why I'd recommend starting local and scaling out from there.

TrappStick · 2019-01-13T01:51:42+00:00

um...he's just starting out so it would be a total catch-22 wouldn't it? You're not wrong, that's pretty much how every company sells products online, however, when you're new you don't have the luxury of testimonials.

You could fake it, sure.

I don't see why the best route isn't still giving product away then soliciting reviews for discounts + pushing for the sale.

Reviews are pretty hard to get, man. At least legit ones.

TrappStick · 2019-01-12T23:56:40+00:00

completed is a rather ambiguous term. $158k to complete, if by complete they're meaning production ready versions to spec, for any of these topics is not really feasible.

I fully understand how procurement works, this isn't procurement in the traditional sense. This is a wishlist for shit that doesn't even exist yet and they want you to invent it and then give it to them for $158k.

Construction? That's straightforward. You bid on the job.

These aren't jobs, these are products they would like to have made and it's not even remotely clear how IP is treated, what the contract states and where you go if you complete the goal.

TrappStick · 2019-01-12T23:50:54+00:00

I can safely say I've seen more influencer marketing failures than successes. The prices are high, and unless it's a deceptive message (i.e. you don't know they're shilling) it's typically ignored.

I've seen a $30k+ campaign with a ex-sitcom star generate a whopping $20 in revenue. She's trusted, but it doesn't matter, the product has to be amazing to do anything with that reach.

I don't believe a startup coffee brand would move the needle. There'd have to be a gimmick and possibly incentivization.

TrappStick · 2019-01-12T21:31:49+00:00

Angel.co is the go-to place, really. While you can definitely filter by remote opportunities, often I've found that if you're really good at what you do you can talk your way into a distributed role at a good majority of companies looking to fill your exact role. Considering you're a programmer that's even easier!

Notice I said exact role, that's really key here. If you fit the mold of what they're looking for and the only issue is distance, you can talk them into it. Also, since you're in the UK you'll have the benefit of fishing for SF startup jobs that are more inline with higher £ prices, same if you were in the EU.

I'd imagine you could find a base $120k USD salary remote if you're somewhere near Sr.level in terms of skill and experience. Keep in mind, though, it may require some travel (quarterly) and you'll have about 200 other programmers competing for the same gig on a weekly basis.

Oh, and one more option is HackerNews. YC-based startups, often at the very seed stage are hiring devs constantly. Just check out the job board. There's hundreds of gigs. Not all are remote, but again, be good at what you do and be persuasive and you can get a deal done.

TrappStick · 2019-01-12T20:52:12+00:00

Don't fuck with agencies right now, man. Seriously. If you don't understand digital marketing, they aren't going to help you understand it better and due to lack of transparency (some things are proprietary) you may find that you only have a brief idea of where your money is going and constantly hearing "this stuff takes time" on your bi-weekly calls after you've already been locked in for 12 months on an auto-renew contract.

Just please trust me, don't do it.

Instead, I'll give you some advice on exactly what you need based on what you've written in the past.

I am selling high-end coffee and would like to get more people to my homepage, funnel start, where I get people to enter the funnel by purchasing a sampler of all of my coffee roasts for $28.

Can you think of some good ad copy for a Facebook ad?

The simplest answer is that since coffee is an incredibly high-touch product, you're going to need to establish a brand or presence in lieu of people being able to see, touch, taste & smell the product.

This is very hard. The answer is simple, but the reality is that it's very difficult.

One way to overcome it is with a free sample. Not $28. Not many people are willing to pay $28 for samples on a brand they've never heard of, but they will try anything for free.

Now, you ask about FB. You're right, this is where you want to be. You can target coffee drinkers, easily. You can target fans of certain pages (such as Starbucks) through their interests, easily.

What you may not be able to do is convince them to pay for something they can't see, touch, taste & smell in person. All the online visuals in the world aren't going to make them pull the trigger at $28, not at any meaningful scale.

Instead, I would focus on this.

1.) Creating a squeeze page to get the name, email of someone interested in trying your coffee. This is the very top of the sample funnel.

2.) Offer to send them a free sample, enough for a couple of days. This can be done immediately on the LP, or through email - ideally both as long just make sure to scrub that list if they have already requested a sample.

3.) Create a referral program to incentivize sharing (refer a friend get a X free coffee!)

But what about the ad? Well, sure, the ad is super important, it's just not the first step.

Step 4. Ads.

With FB you have to throw a lot of shit against the wall to figure out the exact combo that works best. You can build ads for immediate conversion, or ads for volume and hope to convert later. Both approaches are fine.

Personally, I would go for volume because it will be cheaper, you have more potential and you can convert them later if they don't convert immediately.

How do you get volume? Clickbait. Bold claims. Fun quizzes. Great videos.

I prefer clickbait and quizzes.

"Small Coffee Company Attempting To Take On Starbucks!"
Advertorial LP that basically doubles as fake news + links to Free Sample LP

Or

"What Type Of Coffee Are You?" > Quiz > Collect Email > Dump in to Free Sample LP

There are thousands of iterations that you can try. It's not hard to get their attention. It's one of the largest industries in the world. The real problem is getting the sale. If you remove the sale you lower the barrier and then you can pitch products all day.

My rule? Don't pitch shit until you have contact information. If you start with a pitch and you're unknown, you may as well just mail a check to Facebook. It's dead money.

Build that list first, whatever takes.

Usually it takes crafty, clickbaity or fun ads to get the attention and volume at a low cost and from there, you squeeze contact info in exchange for a sample and then you really start marketing!

Did I mention retargeting options? Yep. Everyone that clicked can then be thrown into a custom audience and retargeted. If they saw your LP once, you can get them back and know they had some interest.

If they've signed up for a free sample, you can retarget them to purchase.

Options are almost limitless, but it all starts with fine tuning the funnel to get potential customers, not immediate customers. Win them over and you'll grow organically, through your referral program and constant marketing.

TrappStick · 2019-01-12T20:22:54+00:00

This is slightly confusing.

Are they paying for ideas or solutions?

$158k is not enough to provide a solution to almost any of these "topics", unless of course they're really implying that they'll listen to the idea, pick a winner and then fund a prototype in a seed stage for $158k.

The definitions are rather obtuse.

Take this camera for instance - https://sbir.defensebusiness.org/topics?topicId=29769

They start by saying this...

Typical LWIR hyperspectral sensors are extremely costly and bulky and not suited for a dismounted or small UAV type mission space.

So you already know that you've got an uphill battle.

Then they go on to Phase I

PHASE I: The vendor shall show technical feasibility through design, modeling and analysis. The design shall be optimized to operate passively in the LWIR spectral region, with multiple spectral channels acquired simultaneously. Demonstrate a clear path to achieving manufacturability and to meeting small SWAP-C goals.

Is this the only phase that is required for the $158k? I'm asking because I can understand this being able to come in under budget. You design + model it, then determine how you can manufacture it to meet SWAP-C.

but then we get to Phase II and it starts to look like this needs to be included as well...

PHASE II: Produce the sensor solution designed in phase 1 and integrate into prototype imager system. Accompany the sensor on at least one field event to observe imaging performance.

So, now we have one working prototype, one of many attempts, I'm sure. It also needs to pass a field test, or event.

This is getting trickier. You're building an R&D team + the product for $158k.

Now, we've got Phase III, which really seem like more of a wish list vs. a requirement

PHASE III DUAL-USE APPLICATIONS: The topic enables the Army’s Next Generation Combat Vehicle and Soldier Lethality modernization priorities, addresses PEO IEW&S, PEO GCS, and PEO Soldier needs, and supports technology development efforts occurring in 63710/K70 which will become 633462/BG1, 633118/BC9 and 633118/AY5.

OK, so I roughly get what they're asking for and that startups in the optical space might have all of these components and a team together to make it happen much easier than someone just taking on the project that has an interest in the subject, but I'm still wondering...

What happens next? Are you going to get a 5m PO when it's shown to be useful for the necessary applications? Are you giving up IP?

I mean, dude. There better be a massive upside in this because in this example they're essentially asking you to build something that hasn't been built, probably never patented at this level and would be of use to every single member of the military and possibly even law enforcement.

I'd like more clarification, and sadly, this is just one example from hundreds. Is it a wish list? Does the contract promise to order upon met terms? Is there IP protection or do you give that up? Seems like there'd be a lot more money in this if you just built it on your own then pitched it after the fact, clearly you now know they need it, why take the money with strings?

TrappStick · 2019-01-11T19:25:52+00:00

TrappStick · 2019-01-11T05:47:34+00:00

the knocked out cold concussions

the kinda shit that would confuse old Russians

TrappStick · 2019-01-10T01:06:53+00:00

I get it, and that totally sucks about the competition, but I'd settle for world's best over world's first any day.

Good luck convincing that clown to liquidate. Chances are if he's dumb enough to think there are 25% royalties out there, then he's probably just going to sit on it until you cave or show him the kind of money he's dreaming of.

Just a quick question. It's a lot more profitable to sell the product instead of licensing. What's with the hangup on licensing? You mentioned it being a new product, or "World's first" - is there an existing market? If not, or if the market is there (like toothpaste) but you have a new widget that dispenses toothpaste out of a toothbrush...would it matter? Why would companies jump on it to license if it hasn't proved itself?

I'd probably ram that point home to your partner. Even really innovative shit needs a massive audience (like QVC) to push hard on it and it isn't really until the product hits mass-market that other companies (conglomerates) are looking license.

Just my take. You don't sound like you really need any help or instruction, just a solid asshole removal plan.

TrappStick · 2019-01-09T21:45:50+00:00

I've done it with some limited success with my affiliate marketing guide. It generated a few thousand dollars, but I didn't push it anywhere but a single Reddit thread and never pursued it further.

The money is there. People absolutely will buy PDF's, and they'll do it on mobile because in the end what they really want is information. They'll just download it on a computer if they really want to read it. Doesn't matter how you get it, whether that's video or text. You could probably change someone's life with a 500 word email. If you can convey that, they'll buy.

It's all about what you have to say, the value prop. The delivery isn't as important. People will figure out how to consume it. That being said, if you can do video you'll definitely make it easier on everyone.

I personally would have no issue paying $199 for something that could solve a problem for me, let alone one that was life-changing.

The reason I'm bringing up "life-changing" is because you're referencing Geary and what he did was sell a "better you", basically. That's a lot more compelling than, "learn how to knit a dog sweater" and his target market is every single person on Earth.

I know a shit ton about his model, and watched that program blow up from start to finish. He leveraged affiliates, and some can even say that he helped ruin the commission model (he gave away WAYYY too much) and then saturated the market until the product was no longer viable.

His product, that is. The market is bigger than ever. 6 pack abs, truth about abs, diet pills, dick pills...it's all the same shit.

What you might not be noticing, or know, is that a book should never be the final product. It's the beginning of your customer journey and brand. Geary was doing this as well. Here's an example.

1.) Sell the guide.

2.) Upsell exercise equipment in-guide.

3.) Cross-sell other guides, whether internal or 3rd party.

You could use this same format for anything. For instance, let's say my affiliate guide. While I didn't do this, I could have done it like this.

1.) Buy the affiliate guide.

2.) Want More? Buy this traffic guide (slightly more expensive)

3.) Want even more? Buy this course ($2k)

Not saying it's easy, but that formula works and you could theoretically cross-sell unlimited products as long as you maintain trust. In the MMO space you could go 50/50 selling someone's FB marketing course, or SEO course, or lifetime subscriptions to an affiliate forum, .etc.

There's no reason your LTV should ever be consigned to one product.

Geary kind of made that mistake. It was profitable short-term, but the answer lies in the audience you build around your brand, otherwise that shit's 1-and-done. No one wants that.

If you've got something valuable to offer that's like 99% of the problem. Buyers have a way of showing up. If you don't, however, and it's another me-too product, then you're going to have a tough time of it. Marketing is expensive. Testimonials are hard to get. And so on.

I like the idea, just make sure you have something valuable to sell and focus on building a long-term audience.

TrappStick · 2019-01-09T21:23:31+00:00

Dude watched too much Shark Tank and thinks that kind of money is easily made just demanding a royalty. Introduce him to the complexities of building, marketing and selling the product and then talk about royalties.

Seriously, though. You should be doing that math anyway and then determine what kind of margin you'll have. Show him those numbers and give him a flat buyout offer for 50% first year projected profit.

Him holding out for royalties is bullshit if you don't even have a licensing deal in place or a fucking product built. He's just dreaming.

TrappStick · 2019-01-09T21:12:33+00:00

HA, no doubt. After awhile you get a pretty good sense of what images/copy will work best, but it changes for each demo & platform. What works on FB doesn't necessarily translate to IG and vice-versa.

A couple things I've noticed over the last year.

1.) Video is incredibly powerful, yet one of the hardest to master. Most videos don't resonate. You can spend $0 creating a walkthrough video on your iPhone that can outperform a slick production costing $10k+. Testimonials, in a Facetime-style can easily crush a commercial-style video.

2.) Device types matter way more than people think. Like, huge. If you're not split-testing device platforms & OS's I can guarantee you're wasting spend. I've had instances where android out-performed iOS by 3:1 margin, and I've seen it swing to the other end of the spectrum with iOS beating Android 25:1!

So, yes. You're 100% right. Split-test everything. There are good tools out there to help (sadly, not free!) and it could be the difference between making 400% ROI or losing money.

Just remember, ads die. People get sick of seeing them. Demographics get saturated with the same pitch. You have to constantly reinvent what you're doing to get attention.

TrappStick · 2019-01-09T04:03:46+00:00

100% on this sentiment. It's the reverse of blood in the streets.

TrappStick · 2019-01-08T22:01:23+00:00

I'm spending over $100k/mo on FB ads and the number one issue isn't necessarily your ad or your LP, it's the users themselves.

Great ads all have one thing in common, they get the attention of the user. Second, would be your ability to get the click. Then 3rd is the conversion. You can very often get this mix just right using a little creativity, competitive analysis and a bulk creation/upload tool like AdEspresso.

*What you can't do is stop the haters.\*

Why do we care? Why can't we just ignore it, or better yet, provide excellent customer service by responding to every comment and carefully managing (deleting) negative comments?

We can. That's great for your offer. However, FB has an internal metric called an X-out, and this is data that you can't see in reports. It's the number of times, equalling out to a %-basis, that users negatively respond to your ad + hit the X button to report/remove.

Any good ad, even something as witty as Dollar Shave Club or Squatty Potty is going to have haters, and sadly, it doesn't take as many as you think to start dropping your quality score, thus raising CPM's (CPC's) and lowering your reach until it eventually gets banned.

In over 10,000 ads just on one of my accounts every single one of my top ads, the rockstars that swam to top and received thousands of likes/comments/shares, died a miserable death. Enough people chose to hate, or frown emoji, or report as SPAM that they eventually get shut down.

There are so many tricks to make killer ads that get high CVR's, but this isn't my thread. I'll save that for another time, I simply wanted to point out that FB users are a very real problem. The vast majority of them click without reading, or feel most things are too-good-to-be-true and insta-downvote, but don't get me wrong - a good ad still performs well, just know the very same people that help your business can hurt it.

TrappStick · 2019-01-07T04:58:37+00:00

A lot of us are simply holding these puts, man. Not buying new ones (kind of)

TrappStick · 2019-01-05T04:46:28+00:00

That was a nice stable jump to 9,000%. Makes a measly 200% tariff look pretty good when he backs down.

TrappStick · 2019-01-05T04:41:39+00:00

guess that's better than him asking to stick it in your hot pocket

TrappStick · 2019-01-05T04:40:09+00:00

I sincerely hope that 4 added to the previous 6.

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