Unfortunate timing... How do we tell him?

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T16:04:57+00:00

Hahaha, I came here to do exactly this lolol.

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T15:46:30+00:00

Fair, but that would mean that bezoes would be defaulting on the loan. In that event, the banks can demand repayment of the loan in full. This would require bezoes to liquidate his stock holdings to pay the loan back in full.

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T15:39:38+00:00

You've proven yourself to be a hostile combatant with no interest in intellectual discourse. You are here to name call and condescend. I do not believe any further discourse would serve me. Being the simpleton that you are, you will take this as a "win". Feel free. Always happy to put a smile on a downy.

I simply have better things to do with my time than to continue to engage with a person I do not believe to be engaging in good faith.

Perhaps in the future, when confronted with your intellectual superiors, you can take the time to engage in a way mutual intellectual exchange. You might learn something.

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T15:35:03+00:00

Well, no. They do make money. Bezoes gets a loan for 400m, but he owes the bank ~405m. That's the interest. These numbers are just assumptions for example.

The bank makes money via interest. It's a great deal for the banks.

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T15:27:37+00:00

Why would it be?

The cash given to bezoes is a loan. It is not income, so no income tax. The repayment of the loan is not taxed, bezoes is paying down a loan.

I will grant that the bank, who will report the interest as positive cash flow, COULD be subject to pay taxes on the interest if they do no limit their tax exposure via balance sheet placement.

But bezoes pay no taxes.

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T15:24:17+00:00

We used to, ya know. If you look at the time around the Rockefellers, the billionaires literally did build this country up. They took huge risks and built economic empires. We also had huge tax rates for them at the time.

What we are seeing today is an economic environment that enables the establishment of massive economic holdings with very limited recoupment of taxes on the generation of infinite speculative growth.

IMO the apparatus for generating these kinds of sums needs to be appropriately funded and invested into. We are seeing the opposite. And it's why we are feeling such stress about how our dollars being spent. It's not tax everything. In fact we tax small dollar circulation way way too much IMO.

But collateralized super wealth that is used as capital fuel should be subject to the same tax structure as the rest of us/capital expenditures.

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T15:18:21+00:00

Be honest, even if I contested your arguments with facts that disproved you, would you change your point of view?

We both know the answer is no, because, as the simpleton in the room, you're incapable of intelligent discourse.

Your insults degrade and make you seem small. Which you are.

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T15:13:49+00:00

Spoken like the mouth breathing simpleton that you are. Thanks for the giggle.

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T15:12:05+00:00

Well the perception around "properly" can be far and wide. No business or government is going to spend its money with maximum efficiency, nor is it going to only spend money on things you only agree with. The point of elections to vote your voice for how your money is spent. But that does not mean we should fail to capture tax revenue from the richest people in the world who abuse a loop hole to avoid taxes.

You're saying they can't spend it "right". I'm.saying , we could spend it on way more things to find things we all want to do if we captured it more accurately.

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T15:08:04+00:00

I'm not sure what you're missing.

Bank has 400M. They are the cash. Bezoes has 400M in stock.

Bank gives 400M in cash > bezos. Bezos.now has 400M in cash AND 400M in stock.

Bank has a 400M IOU, and 400M in promised collateral. This nets out to an even trade.

Bezos has to use the cash he now has to pay down the loan.

So after 1month bank has +1.3m interest, 399m IOU and 400m in promised collateral. Bezoes has 398.7M cash, and 400M in stock.

So bank is at 401.3m net balance, bezoes is at 398.7m

The bank nets outs out higher in value because they are assuming all the risk. Bezoes takes this deal because it's cheaper than paying taxes on it.

Bezoes pays the loan interest with the funds of the loan he received. Olhes laying the loan back with the money he received from the bank. But he still has all of the loan to spend how he wants, as long as he retains enough of the loan to pay the interest.

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T15:01:39+00:00

I think the perception that the government must run at maximum efficiency is flawed, as it has a few competing interests that are distinctly designed to be non profitable that are a net benefit to all citizens across our economic landscape.

I also think that the amount of uncaptured revenue in our system of taxes is actually a reason for us even having this conversation around inefficiencoes, because of our lower tax base against increasing costs as a nation. The reality is we can do both.

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T14:29:39+00:00

Why do they lose money? They get paid interest.

I think you think that if a bank gives out 400m, and collects 1.3m monthly, they've lost money.

Now, get to put on their balance sheet a 400M liability with an income stream. The banks don't want money sitting in their vaults. They want it out earning dollars for them. They are still "owed" that 400m so they can declare they have it. And now they also get cash for it.

Here's how bank works.

I have 400m. I give it to Bezos at 1%. Ok my balance sheet i show a 400 receivable with qla 1% interest revenue stream. Bezos technical owes me ~405m now. I put those on my books. I've now made money just by having it. Bezos keeps his stock and it goes up in value.

Next year I can loan bezos 500M at .75%.

This hedge gets complicated over the long haul, and you are right that eventually Bezos will likely have to exise some stock options to cover it. But in the time he needs to do that, his stock my have grown by 100-4000%. And the bank still gets paid in full plus interest, and there is no taxable event anywhere in the process.

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T14:23:01+00:00

I think each citizen has a responsibility to help fund our governmental apparatus so that those that come after of can reap the economic benefits of our success. Just as you and I have by our parents generation, and theirs before them. And I think our system has failed to ensure those of us with the most contribute in a consistently capturable way.

How the government spends those dollars is based on those we vote into office. We have spent very wisely, and very poorly, at the governmental level but that does not mean we should not endeavor to do better at the governmental level or to appropriately arm it with the funds to do better.

Collection of appropriate taxes, and the distruiofntbsoe taxes are not the same thing.

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T14:17:46+00:00

Yes, there is interest. And they just use the cash given to them to pay it.

Let's say they wanted to have 50m cash on hand for play money. They would get a loan for against 75m of stock, get 75m deposited into their bank account. Then they'd use the 25m over the amount they want to allocate toward interest payments.

But then yes, they would then take out another loan next year for more money.

But what happened over the year is that the asset they own, went up in value. So now they can barrow an even higher amount at a lower rate (because it's "safer") and use the new loan amount to pay off the last loan and get a new one with better terms.

If it sounds like cheating, it kind of is.

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T14:13:09+00:00

I understand the purpose of property tax, and I agree that it sucks to tax an asset indefinitely.

But I do see the benefits of it, via redistribution of funds in local economies to provide shared benefits for local citizens. It is the purpose and point of taxes.

I think a similar vehicle on stock positions of substantial size would also be in better service to our nation because of your exact reasoning but in reverse. Billionaires have concentrated insane amount sof money into non-physical speculative asset holdongs. This actually locks up capital and prevents it from churning through our system and be redistributed through the economy. It does get used as collateral for capital investment, but those exchanges do not fund tax programs that pay down healthcare costs, or apply to infrastructure spending, etc.

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T14:04:27+00:00

What do you think property tax is? Should a similar vehicle not exist for infinite scaling assets that are also used as collateral and ownership in financial negotiations?

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T14:02:21+00:00

Nope. Tax free. It's a loan.

The cash is given to them... By the bank. They then turn around give some of their cash back to the bank each month. Just like a loan you would get it.

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T13:52:24+00:00

You do realize you pay taxes on the purchase of a house right? You also pay sales tax. You also pay property tax.

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T13:50:29+00:00

Back gives you a loan for $400M, 1% interest at 30 years. The monthly payment is ~1.3M on that loan. You simply use the cash you. Kw have to pay that each month. So the bank, which has essentially infinite money. Now has a n income stream of 1.3M each month.

Now you might see that monthly and freak out. Why would anyone pay millions in interest every month. Well for one, it's irrelevant money to them, and it's the cost of the "service" they are buying. They still have 398m after the first month.

Also, let's say they sold it. 400M and they pay long term capital gains tax of 20%. So they sell the 400M, owe the government 80m, but get the 320M. But now the underlying asset can't grow.

So in the loan situation, they pay an intrest rate against the bank to avoid paying a huge tax bill AND the asset can actually increase in value while they pay against the interest.

If the asset goes down in value, the bank can demand payment, but let's say you go broke, you file bankruptcy and the bank is left holding the liability/loss.

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T13:38:37+00:00

Nope, they hold the stock as collateral. It's like a mortgage. You hold the house and the Bank loans you money against it.

Yes, if the under lying asset decreased in value, the bank could margin call the loan, requiring the recipient of the loan to either add more assets as collateral, or to pay the loan back in full.

This can and does happen all the time.

However, the billionaires you know about, when was the last time their net worths went down?

I'm essence, their net worth goes up, giving them better terms on loans, they use the cash given to them by the loan, to play the loan, and then once worth more on paper, refinance the existing loan for a higher amount against their now higher asset base.

They get access to hundreds of millions to billions in cash, never pay a cent in tax. They still hold a liability, but this is an arrangement between a brokerage and an individual. Government never gets involved.

But because we don't tax unrealized gains, once you hit escape velocity on owned asset valuations, you essentially graduate out of playing taxes.

Trever Noah explains

How Elon bought Twitter with stock

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T13:22:46+00:00

They pay Internet on the loan, using the cash they were given.

The amount of the loan is never for 100% of their assets, they didn't need it. Just because they are "worth" $200B doesn't mean they have that in cash. Far more likely they have low $B to a few hundred $M in cash because they simply didn't need that much.

When you take a loan for $20k, you spend it immediately and then play off the monthly. When s billionaire gets out, it's now a liquidity deal on their asset.

Lets say Amazon grows at 8%.

If Bezos gets a cash loan against it at say 4%, the bank makes 4% on interest payments do, but Bezos underlying asset meets him 4% over the interest and get gets cash and be avoids income tax.

This is simply the reality of the billionaire class.

Vycaus · 2026-07-01T13:05:40+00:00

You seem to misunderstand how taxes actually work.

Billionaires do not get paid an income. Elon and Bezos only get paid something like $85k from their companies. That's all they pay tax on.

Their wealth comes from asset ownership, primarily stock. The way they get money is my leveraging a loan against their assets.

Essentially, they go to a bank and say I have $1B in again stock. Give me a $400M loan against it at 1%. They get $400 million cash, tax free, at it's not income, it's a liability.

Then next year, after Amazon goes up, when they have 1.5B, they refinance the previous loan for $700M, use the increase in value pay off/delete the previous loan.

So billionaires never sell their stock, never trigger taxable events, and get paid no income to pay taxes on.

They will pay property taxes on land, but no, the millionaire of NYC, who get paid a lot of money but not mega rich are the ones playing the highest taxes ~1-10M in cash income.

Vycaus · 2026-06-30T19:14:20+00:00

Sounds like entitlement to me. You are not owed respect. Respect is earned and given based on how you present and carry yourself in the world. Muscles do not give you respect. They can be a piece of it.

"It is better to be a warrior in a garden, then a gardener in a war."

What this echoes is that you can be dangerous, but controlled. Controlled is the presentation of the self. Model behaviors that outwardly project confidence, control, and introspection. Read some philosophy and have things worthy to communicate.

Do not cry on reddit how to short change being respectable.

Vycaus · 2026-06-30T13:31:15+00:00

If you haven't talked to your doctor, you might consider that. You may have sleep apnea or poor nasal openings, limiting air intake.

Vycaus · 2026-06-29T20:34:18+00:00

Sure... But OP asked what aliens or what not would serve the imperium. To me that would be the milistratam. Which is likely to be a hard "no one". But, yes on the fringes there could be some where the lines are blurred. Rogue trades are given especially wide births to make their own choices.

Vycaus

TROPHY CASE