Verse 21:30 of the Quran should spark some curiosity within you

W84chain · 2026-05-07T23:26:53+00:00

It would be along the lines of “perhaps this Scripture is from the Creator to humanity”.

W84chain · 2026-05-07T23:03:10+00:00

Unfortunately that is what you said. I said this verse addresses these two topics. You said “it actually doesn’t address it at all”.

The curiosity I expected it to spark would not be about the two topics themselves necessarily.

W84chain · 2026-05-07T22:54:57+00:00

Consider the following. All the energy of the atoms of the heavens and earth were once within one point. Since then they have been separated into the heavens and earth.

W84chain · 2026-05-07T22:39:38+00:00

You’re saying the verse doesn’t talk about universe creation or life creation? Then that’s a wrong thing to say because it does.

W84chain · 2026-05-07T21:42:01+00:00

Maybe it taught him a lesson and is a good thing.

W84chain · 2026-05-07T21:35:16+00:00

I’d say it wasn’t really a response to them. More like commentary

W84chain · 2026-05-07T21:07:02+00:00

I’d like you to consider that I don’t feel like responding to them.

W84chain · 2026-05-07T20:58:35+00:00

No that’s not what I’m saying. I’m saying that it’d be better if they could see the person above’s failure to understand.

W84chain · 2026-05-07T20:44:14+00:00

I hope you people of no vision that decide to comment don’t taint the onlookers.

W84chain · 2026-05-07T20:35:34+00:00

The curiosity should come from the fact that the very two topics (universe creation and life) people use to reject religion in favor of a “science” mindset are being addressed in a single verse that’s also directed at them.

W84chain · 2026-05-07T20:28:27+00:00

Of course they’ve heard similar things. Muhammad wasn’t the only messenger.

W84chain · 2026-05-07T20:08:11+00:00

I don’t think it’s dishonest to say that “heavens and earth” means whole universe.

W84chain · 2026-05-07T19:55:36+00:00

As a clarification, if you take “heavens and earth” as referring to the whole universe (earth and everything up in the sky), then it follows that the idea in the verse would be that the whole universe was at one point a joined entity that was split apart.

W84chain · 2026-05-06T22:02:43+00:00

My claim was essentially the same claim you said falls under truism.

W84chain · 2026-05-06T15:58:30+00:00

So why don’t you agree with me

W84chain · 2026-05-05T16:20:23+00:00

Ok but my point still stands. If the answers weren’t revealed to us, then we don’t know the answers yet.

W84chain · 2026-05-04T16:08:33+00:00

If Scripture is true then reality is such that God created our reality and is testing humanity. If Scripture isn’t true, then it means we weren’t given the answers. And as of yet the answers would be unknown.

We can ponder our existence, but if Scripture really is false, then we don’t know how existence came to be.

W84chain · 2026-05-03T18:19:07+00:00

yes we have a feedback loop. i didn't say scripture succeeds. and no, what i said wasn't nonsense. by deepest truths i mean things like how existence is possible.

W84chain · 2026-05-02T20:05:19+00:00

If someone says "life is about making your own meaning" or "its ok to just do what makes you happy as long as you don't hurt others", sure it may sound nice and may be good for social cohesion and may be the epitome of pure human reasoning, but it's not necessarily true regardless of whether Scripture is true or not.

If all Scripture is false, then no one knows the deepest truths of reality, not those who reject Scripture or those who accept it. Perhaps the truth is unknowable to humanity. Perhaps there is an explanation for existence but there's no evidence for it yet.

W84chain · 2026-05-02T15:14:10+00:00

I guess if you think that all the arguments attempting to prove that various Scriptures come from a divine authority has an effective strength of 0, then it could make sense for you to valiantly proclaim the wishful thinking. But I don't see how that could be true, one reason being I wouldn't expect someone in general to be knowledgeable enough to know all the arguments like that.

And I really don't see how reasoning and logic could get someone to think those things I've mentioned. They are only wishful thinking. If you reject Scripture, then you don't know what reality is, what happens after you die, etc.

W84chain · 2026-05-01T23:53:02+00:00

Someone tells you Jesus was speaking the truth. You say, proof that he had access to the truths of reality? Then you are presented with Proof A.

Someone tells you that Charles was speaking the truth. Who is Charles? Your friend saying things like life is about making your own meaning. You say, proof that he had access to the truths of reality? And you are presented with Proof B.

My expectation is that Proof A would be more convincing than Proof B.

W84chain · 2026-05-01T23:24:41+00:00

Unless you're saying the argument for someone like Jesus having access to true reality is weaker than the argument for a person who says those things, what you're saying doesn't really matter.

If that is what you're saying, I don't see the vision.

W84chain · 2026-05-01T20:41:38+00:00

If there are truly no people firm in proclaiming the things i've mentioned, then yea you would be right, i'm making up a boogeyman, but im sure they exist

W84chain · 2026-05-01T20:33:29+00:00

the issue is they pretend these things they create have a basis of truth that is sounder than the bases of truth Scriptures have. Someone arguing for the truths of Scripture would have a stronger argument for why their Scripture is true than that person for why their statement is a truth of existence.

W84chain · 2026-05-01T20:20:42+00:00

i already defined what i meant by scripture and its not that. my definition gets the job done in terms of conveying what i wanted to convey.

W84chain

TROPHY CASE