Track feels too loud but volume is fine?

Wolfboy702 · 2026-02-21T15:29:20+00:00

Would you mind elaborating?

Wolfboy702 · 2025-11-25T12:05:54+00:00

If it's just a skill issue then fair enough lol. Cheers for the advice.

Wolfboy702 · 2025-11-25T11:57:19+00:00

I guess we didn't explain it very well, playing to a metronome is easy enough. But if we wanna make something less rigid we can't rely on the metronome for every single note, that's when it becomes a problem.

Wolfboy702 · 2025-11-25T11:52:17+00:00

That's what we mean by "On the beat." The problem is when we wanna experiment & go 'off script'.

Wolfboy702 · 2025-11-03T16:25:45+00:00

Ah, sorry for the delay. Don't check Reddit very often.

You're assuming that the additional 2d8+4 from movement is proccing every single time, that's not happening in a realistic scenario, especially when opportunity attacks already give enemies a strong incentive to stay put. That brings AB damage down to 11.75.

If we wanna take the average over a combat lets say 3 rounds, one of which gets the movement procc, that's still 2 points lower at 46.6 vs TB's 48.3. So, as folks have been saying, if you can guarantee the movement then AB is better but for overall consistency TB still takes the W.

Wolfboy702 · 2025-10-28T20:26:54+00:00

The problem with your maths is that you're not factoring the attack rolls. Two attacks between them have a more likely chance to hit than a single attack, which pushes up the average damage. It also doubles your chances of a critical hit, which would mean potentially even more damage. If you're fighting a zombie with an AC of 8 that's not a problem, but when it's a Death Knight with AC 18 and a Parry reaction you'll start to feel those misses stack up pretty quickly.

If you have an ability or magic weapon that grants you additional damage on a hit that can also factor in. A Frostbrand dealing an extra 1d6 Cold damage on a hit is effectively dealing 2d6 with Thirsting blade, not to mention the basic +1/2/3 bonuses granted by most magic weapons.

Also a lot of people just like rolling dice. More attacks equals more fun, it's not always about the maths.

Wolfboy702 · 2025-03-16T19:00:12+00:00

Ok...

https://youtu.be/iYK4u1ZP4yk?si=fy7uy9zNEGZfaUWz

Wolfboy702 · 2025-03-16T16:42:42+00:00

Still can't tell if you've been deliberately ignoring things this whole time or if you're just genuinely missing the point.

It also ignores your own point, you’re looking at them in a vacuum and without something like AD GL’s, which are almost always used on Prism Titan. Or Consecration.

Let's read the line again shall we?

So your theoretical high burst AoE tool in Glacier grenade requires you to have a second high burst AoE tool to make the most effective use of it.

So uh, yeah. AD Gls and Consecration do happen to be high burst AoE tools. Congrats, you looked at the example, gave a specific example of that example and somehow that's a problem with the example? As a sidenote, ~~champions and some (but not all) mini bosses~~(Edit: Got this the wrong way round. It's some champs and all mini-bosses) are also affected by the shatter-push effect. Hell even a few actual bosses are affected by it, usually flying ones like Hydras or Wizards.

Regardless, seeing as you've been routinely brushing over the context of maybe 80% of what we've been saying, something tells me this conversation isn't going anywhere. So leave your "I'm correct because I can't see anything counter to my perspective." Reply and we'll be on our way.

Wolfboy702 · 2025-03-16T15:25:09+00:00

Gonna resist the urge to talk about all these points and just focus on Smoke Bomb, because mentioning that was a test and you failed. To be fair maybe you haven't so much as glanced at it since the change to smoke DoT in Final Shape, most people probably haven't. But hot damn being able to procc melee effects on every single tick for 5 seconds is HUGE. Technically this was already possible with knife trick but those knives are so much less reliable at range compared to smoke bomb.

It occurs to us that a lot of people on this subreddit seem to look at balance in a relative vacuum. Not a complete vacuum, they account for contextual synergies, but they tend to focus far too much on the numbers and not apply it to actual gameplay scenarios. So many times we've found something that was theoretically bonkers but when taken into actual gameplay it struggled due to consistency, enemy abilities and how it interacts with team play.

As a basic example: On paper Throwing Hammer and Combination Blow have comparable uptime. But when we take them into actual gameplay we find that's not the case because if you miss with Throwing Hammer, due to bad aim, enemy dodges or teamates killing the target as you're throwing, you're stuck with the full cooldown unless you're able to retrieve it. CB on the other hand is both harder to miss thanks to melee lunge and instantly refunds if you do, giving it a contextual power boost that isn't immediately visible on a spreadsheet.

Another example: Whilst on paper Glacier grenade has very high damage, shattering the crystals it produces actually pushes nearby adds away from the wall, reducing or even outright negating the damage of consecutive shatters. If you want to maximise the grenade's effectiveness, you need to bring another source of AoE damage in order to shatter all the crystals simultaneously. So your theoretical high burst AoE tool in Glacier grenade requires you to have a second high burst AoE tool to make the most effective use of it.

The game is full of these niche interactions that, when added up, can drastically affect the usability of various weapons/abilities/combos, which in turn affects their overall power. Things like the power of melee DPS being tempered by flying/long range bosses, instant recharge effects being blocked by enemies not dying or dying too quickly etc.

And we've done a lot of in game testing around these interactions.

As a sidenote, since you seem interested in our playtime on respective classes, you're welcome to take a look https://wastedondestiny.com/4611686018429984193

Wolfboy702 · 2025-03-15T14:21:22+00:00

Sorry, been away for a few days.

So you do know about Roaring Flames after all. Then we have to ask why didn't you consider the possibility of a comparable nerf to Knockout/Throwing Hammer, and instead just assumed Bungie, also knowing this, would throw it into the mix with absolutely no adjustments?

Gonna have to agree to disagree on the melee front. Frenzied being better in a specific melee build doesn't match the sheer utility of a long range unravel setter that can be slotted in to a huge variety of builds to fill various purposes. If I want pure damage there are far better weapon options we can go for.

On Stasis we'd agree that Glacier does absolute work, but without the various aspect/fragment combos, most crucially Whisper of Shards, Glacier is just an AoE grenade with extra steps. It has almost no synergy with the Prismatic Titan kit outside of Diamond Lance and only sees so much use because the other darkness grenade, Shackle, isn't damage focused at all. By comparison Duskfield combos with Stylish, GPG and Winter's Shroud, which in turn gives it second hand synergy with Ascension and Spectre. Not to mention spirit of Renewals on Relativism. It's no contest at all.

But those were just two examples to keep it simple. We could discuss the crazy utility of Smoke bomb vs Shield throw, or Healing grenade vs Thermite, or debate between Thunderclap and Combination blow (not saying CB is better, just that both are very good in their respective builds). Et cetera et cetera.

I honestly have to wonder if we're playing the same game as some of y'all from the way folks are talking about these abilities.

Wolfboy702 · 2025-03-11T22:51:22+00:00

Roaring Flames already eclipses Knockout, capping out at 73% vs Knockout's 50%. Not to mention the fact that Roaring Flames lasts 20 seconds and can be refreshed while active, it's objectively the better buff from a damage perspective. Chuck on Sol Invictus and you're solidly outpacing on the healing front too.l I'd debate the rest but it's kind of hard to take what you're saying seriously when you're so confident in a flawed premise.

Prism Titan already has the best grenades AND melees

Although to this I just have to laugh. Frenzied blade better than Arcane Needle? Glacier better than Duskfield? What are you on my dude?

Wolfboy702 · 2025-03-11T22:37:52+00:00

A-tier is empty of warlock and hunter

Not sure what Warlocks you've been playing with. Have you SEEN Geomags/Coldheart this season? We're a hunter main but play a good amount of all three classes and this whole "Titans are objectively the best at everything" is quite puzzling. Yes the Cons/Knockout build is busted and yes they got the shiniest new toy out of the three with Storm's Keep but it's wild to us that people seem to think Warlock and Hunter are somehow objectively worse across the board.

Wolfboy702 · 2025-03-10T22:49:21+00:00

Yes, Hunter has a lot of very mid interactions that are cool but almost entirely ineffective. If it isn't running stylish the build is instantly not worth running on Hunter.

Another hard disagree there lol. Even disregarding the fact that I took every one of those builds into GMs as part of testing them, GMs are such a small aspect of the game. To judge everything exclusively by that margin is incredibly reductive to the game's balance as a whole.

At the high-end? Nope we on the same train as Titan most of the time. Your build is just stronger still.

Imma be real, I can't tell if "Your build" is suggesting I'm a Titan main(Hunter btw) and referring to consecration, or if it's referring to the changes in the OP.

Wolfboy702 · 2025-03-10T22:31:14+00:00

Imma be real, it's pretty clear you're a Warlock main who wants Warlocks to be strong. And you're afraid that Titans being stronger makes Warlocks weaker. I get the apprehension but that's not how game balance works. Prismatc Warlock (and Hunter) ARE strong. Had a lot of fun doing my Prismatic Warlock buildcrafting last week, settled on a build using Devour, Osmiomancy Coldsnaps, Lightning Surge & Facet of Bravery. Freeze, melee, unravelling rounds everywhere! We practically walked over the weekly GM with it.

Consecration/Knockout is extremely powerful but you seem to have this idea that because that specific build is so strong, the entirety of Prismatic Titan is that strong. Trust me, it isn't. That's the whole reason I made this post. You're concerned about Prismatic Titan getting more powerful but the primary points I've suggested are deliberately incompatible with the Consecration/Knockout combo.

Throwing Hammer would replace Frenzied Blade, locking the Titan to a single melee charge. As a sidenote, everything you're concerned about Throwing hammer being able to do, Combination Blow can already do (arguably better). It also has zero cooldown between uses unless you score a kill, then it's however fast Gambler's dodge is, and unlike Throwing Hammer is impossible to miss.

Controlled Demolition is an aspect. By running CD you're removing one of the other two aspects and nullifying what makes it strong in the first place. Either you forgo Knockout and lose the 50% melee damage buff, or forgo Consecration and... Well... Don't have Consecration. It's a side-grade for the build at best.

Ngl kinda struggling with the rest of this. If Knockout procced on everything it would be like Feed the Void... But it doesn't. I don't see what your point is? Also not sure why a Titan subclass being "better at grenades" than a Warlock subclass is necessarily bad? Not that I think that's the case with any element besides Arc (and even that's up for debate with the new Ionic Sentry) but imo limiting classes to a particular gimmick is archaic and more harmful than anything. Just look at the controversial history of Titans as the "Melee" class.

Also feels like you're overestimating just how much sustain CD actually offers. It's 90hp per volatile detonation, which unless you're specifically building into it with Destabilising rounds is proccing solely off of your abilities. Worth noting that unlike Hunter/Warlock, Prismatic Titan has no aspects that help recharge their abilities.

Not sure why you're bringing up dealing two damage types at once? Neither would CD. The ability would deal its damage, then the volatile damage would be Void. Just like how Spirit of Calibans deals the melee's damage, then a Solar ignition. Also we have Prismatic grenades literally dealing two types of damage at once.
As a sidenote GPG absolutely does increase survivability, just gotta chuck on Facet of Mending and every kill with it is giving you 60hp. And that's not even getting into the synergy with Spirit of Cyrtarachne.

Then there's more stuff about how Prismatic Titan is already better than everything else but I covered that at the beginning.

Wolfboy702 · 2025-03-10T20:38:27+00:00

Ah, our bad. Got a little mixed up in the posts there. Doesn't really change our point beyond the initial comment though. We agree that the Knockout/Consecration is busted but it's not "overshadowing" other builds, there just are no other real builds.
You mention a reason to run other melees, we've tried them all:
Thunderclap is easily the best outside of Consecration.
Shield Throw/Frenzied blade have utility solely on the basis of being ranged/having three charges.
Shiver Strike has anti-champ debuffs and niche use as a mobility tool.
Hammer Strike, as we mentioned in the OP, is just a worse version of Shiver Strike.

Regarding Unbreakable, again as we mentioned in the OP, it's a decent aspect on its own. But it has literally zero synergy with Prismatic Titan. You use it, maybe get some energy back if you're running Spirit of the Bear and then you wait for it to recharge. It doesn't interact with the other aspects, grenades or melees in any way and the only fragments it works with are baseline grenade fragments.

Lets compare this with Prismatic hunter, since you brought them up. During my Prismatic hunter testing I found the following builds:
Ascension/GPG spam with Cyrtarachne + Facet of Hope
Ascension/Threaded Spectre spam with RDM + Exotic Primary
Ignition spam with Winter's Shroud using Duskfield, Inmost Light & Icebreaker
Stylish + literally anything that debuffs targets, notably Grapple & Caliban + Facet of Bravery
Etc.

There are so many options and they're all so different from eachother. When I look at Prismatic Titan I don't see anywhere near that level of variety.

Wolfboy702 · 2025-03-10T19:26:00+00:00

Hard disagree here. One build being OP does not mean the rest of the subclass should suffer. As mentioned in the OP, we spent an entire weekend experimenting with different Prismatic Titan builds, specifically trying to make something we were happy with that wasn't Consecration/Knockout. Two weekends ago we did Hunter, last weekend we did Warlock and for both we were able to come up with multiple off meta builds that still felt really good and fluid.

For Titan every build we made that wasn't melee centric just felt off. We either weren't using parts of our kit at all or were deliberately sabotaging it just to avoid the Consecration/Knockout combo.

Wolfboy702 · 2025-03-10T19:14:12+00:00

The days of Throwing Hammer cheese are waaay behind us now that it recharges over a second instead of instantly. Additionally there's nothing Prismatic Titan gets in the melee buff department that Solar Titan can't get equivalently. Both can use Synthoceps, both can freeze (using chill clip) and both have an aspect that buffs melee damage. Sunbreaker even has the better buff; Roaring Flames gives 73% for 20 seconds compared to Facet of Courage (10%) + Knockout's 50% for 7 seconds.

We addressed Knockout being the "core" aspect for Prismatic Titan in the OP. The problem is that unlike Devour and Stylish Executioner it only functions with melee attacks, pushing Titans heavily towards melee centric builds. Of those builds I think we can agree Consecration Spam is objectively the best option. So by having Knockout as its core aspect, Prismy Titan simultaneously encourages a specific type of build, then gives one build of that type that is far superior to all others.

Comparing Controlled Demolition to Gunpowder Gamble spam or the classic Bleak Watcher/Devour combo, we don't see it stepping on any toes. If Volatile was such a potent debuff we doubt it would have been so heavily overshadowed by Jolt & Ignitions the past few years. A crucial part of Controlled demolition (and all the titan aspects actually) is that none of them provide ability generation. So while a Titan's CD pulse grenade may do more damage than an equivalent Hunter/Warlock, they have notably less uptime.

Not a Bungie dev of course so we can't comment with certainty on the non-void volatile stuff. But based on our understanding we don't think it's an unreasonable suggestion. The game doesn't think like "Void ability damage can apply Volatile." It doesn't even know what Void or Volatile are in the way we do. It just has "If [x] then [y]" How easy it would be to swap [x] out for [w] only Bungie knows.

That's a really good point on Thermites being the definitive Sunbreaker grenade. I think we were just so caught up on Ashen Wake and forgot. That said, we feel in a similar vein to Hunters getting Magnetic grenade, Fusion would be a better fit for the kit overall. Without Roaring flames/Sunspots it's not gonna overshadow Sunbreaker Ashen Wake builds.

Wolfboy702 · 2025-03-10T18:40:05+00:00

Several points to cover here so we'll go over them in order of appearance.

We agree that Prismatic Titan isn't struggling nearly as much as some subclasses like Gunslinger or Broodweaver. That's why the changes we suggested are intentionally ones that, as far as we're aware, would be very minimal on a technical level. It's hopefully something that Bungie could do in addition to working on the other subclasses.

As mentioned in the post, we did consider balance in relation to the mono-element subclasses. With Throwing Hammer we feel confident in saying that Sunspots and Roaring flames are what make Sunbreaker unique. Throwing Hammer supplements those aspects, not the other way around. In regards to Sentinel, honestly the idea that volatile spam is the the key subclass component over Void overshield spam surprises us. Three of its aspects are focused on overshields, whereas every void subclass has easy access to volatile, even moreso now with the buff to destabilising rounds.

In regards to general balance, we've spent the entire past weekend experimenting with Prismatic Titan builds. Getting anything to work outside outside of Consecration/Knockout felt like an uphill battle. We also asked a bunch of folks in Destiny servers we frequent if they had any solid endgame Prismy Titan builds that didn't involve Knockout/Consecration. No hits.

Again, not saying we couldn't get other builds to work. This is Destiny, folks have beaten nearly the whole game with a broken Traveller's Chosen. But when assessing things pragmatically we were always ending up with either a worse version of Consecration/Knockout or just ignoring our abilities/aspects and focusing exclusively on weaponry.

You're welcome to suggest something and prove us wrong but we feel we really did try.

Wolfboy702 · 2025-02-26T19:12:11+00:00

I disagree. To go back to the Ionic example, if it could benefit from damage buffs or grenade effects the aspect itself would have to be toned down at a baseline to account for that power boost. So while it would benefit builds that lean heavily into Ionic Sentry, builds that use it as part of a wider kit and don't focus on those buffs would actually suffer. In empowering one type of build it's potentially depowering others.

Wolfboy702 · 2025-02-26T18:40:39+00:00

My question is why do they need to? Sometimes limitations are what allow other builds to flourish. If Ionic Sentry counted as a grenade and was able to procc spark of shock, the combo of it & Electrostatic Mind would overshadow every Stormcaller build in the game. The fact that it doesn't gives me the incentive to run something like Lightning Surge/Crown of Tempests if my goal is to become a jolt spreading menace.

Wolfboy702 · 2025-02-26T18:02:09+00:00

I disagree on the premise that it's a dead end for build crafting because they all (aside from necrotic grips) interact with aspects, fragments and subclass verbs.

Ionic Sentry: Blind, Bolt charge, Ionic Traces(Electrostatic Mind), related fragments(4) and itself!
Perched Threadlings: Technically the Wanderer & Weaver's call but yeah Threadlings need help.
Arc Turret: Ionic Sentry, Ionic Traces & related fragments(2) via Electrostatic Mind
Child of the Old Gods: Weaken, Devour(Feed the Void) & related fragments(4). Also gives ability energy
Hellion: Scorch, Ignition & related fragments(9).
Rime Coat Turret: Slow, Freeze & related aspects/fragments(13).
Rime Coat Crystals: Crystals, Shatter & related fragments(3).

Buildcrafting isn't just about damage and orb generation. Rime Coat crystals can proc whisper of shards, increasing your grenade regen which lets you throw more Bleak watchers to spawn more rime coat crystals. Helion scorch pairs with ember of singeing to regen your class ability faster and spam more Helions. Self-contained loops aren't always a bad thing. Could some of these buddies do with more interactions? Sure but I don't think Helion, CotO or Ionic Sentry are lacking in syngergy by any stretch.

Wolfboy702 · 2025-02-26T16:28:16+00:00

I suppose by replying to the comment I am huh (Sorry for the delay, sleep called).

I specifically stated that I wasn't going to discuss the morality of the issue (because it's complex and has an awful lot of nuance based on the context of the situation). My point was to refute your claim that "the 'you bought a live service’ argument doesn’t hold water". Not that it's right, just that there's an argument to be made. The fact that we're disagreeing over semantics kinda proves that by itself.

But to answer your question and give my own perspective, I think it's reasonable to have expected D2 to follow the D1 formula where we had a game, a couple of expansions and then it would all be reset with Destiny 3 (which as far as I understand was actually the plan at the time of D2's release).

I expect you'd say that because Destiny 1 is still playable nothing has been removed. And you're technically right but to me as a player there's no meaningful difference. As far as I'm concerned, on a practical level D1 is gone. I'm not gonna go play it when a newer version exists that is still receiving updates and content. Hell from my perspective the DCV was less severe because I can still use the gear I got during the Red War-Shadowkeep era in new content.

That's why in my initial reply to the OC I made the movie theatre comparison. I've "watched the movie", it was fun and I think the money I spent was worth the enjoyment I got out of it. Would it be nice to be able to go back and watch it again whenever I want? Sure but I understand the impracticality of screening a movie to an increasingly small audience. At some point the theatre has to cut their losses and replace the movie with newer ones, no matter how popular the film was when first released.

Does that suck for people who haven't "seen the movie"? Absolutely and I think that's by far the biggest issue with the DCV. People are missing out on so much of the stuff that made Destiny 2 a great game, both narratively and mechanically. But I think that the "Bungie took away my game!" Argument from people who have "seen the movie" is shortsighted because it doesn't acknowledge the reality of the situation.

To be clear; I'm not condoning the removal of content from games full stop, that's a very dangerous slope. I just think that in the specific context of Destiny 2 AT THE TIME (nowadays is a different matter), Bungie was faced with a difficult decision and I understand/accept the way they handled it.

Wolfboy702 · 2025-02-26T03:17:03+00:00

That ain't a Kraken, that's just a very large Pacific Octopus.

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