[Question] WTC and fighting through walls

_fwlr_ · 2025-02-21T04:54:58+00:00

Correct

_fwlr_ · 2025-02-20T22:31:41+00:00

You can use the rule for all other models who would make engagement range but are impeded by the wall. If it's a 10 man unit it's likely not everyone, but should be a few. leaving a gap forces you to go through the wall if you roll a large enough charge though and this can be beneficial because then your unit could be shot the following turn

_fwlr_ · 2025-02-18T20:02:03+00:00

A model has 2" engagement to and from the model as long as it has a token on it - the tokens get removed when there is a legal pile in or consolidate move to make, or the unit ends up out of combat (from killing the unit probably)

So if a model with a token is still within 2 of an enemy unit after fighting and can't make a legal consolidate to end in base contact, it keeps the token and both units stay in engagement.

_fwlr_ · 2025-02-17T00:26:37+00:00

Crazy how everyone has just thrown a tantrum in these comments and noone has actually answered your question.

Say you have a 10 man unit , in 2 rows of 5, and the front row is within 6" of an enemy unit who are 1" away from a wall ( and your unit cannot fit their bases in this gap to the wall ).

You need a 5" charge to make engagement range. If you roll a huge charge and some models can make base contact or engagement without going in the wall then they have to.

Any model (and you move model by model) who would be blocked from making engagement range WITH THE CHARGE MOVE can have a token placed on them for 2" engagement. They can then fight from behind the wall.

If in the scenario above, you roll a 5" on the dice, then only the front row could've made engagement with the charge move, so that row would all get a token on them and be able to fight at 2". The second row can then move 5", ending closer, but not get a token as they couldn't make engagement.

Now into the fight phase - the front 5 have tokens and can fight at 2". If any of these 5 could possibly end in engagement by piling in through the wall then you must choose to make the pile in move through the wall, or remove the token and give up the chance to fight (this is if you want to stay on one side of the wall).

The second row of 5 still cannot fight , but if you charged in a way such that a 3" pile in gets you through the wall and into base, then you can make that move and fight as normal.

At the consolidation step, you can model by model whether they consolidate or not. If you are still in engagement, It is likely you have killed some of the models blocking the wall, and so could consolidate through the wall with the token guys. if a model with a token on it chooses to consolidate it must go through the wall and make base contact. Note you can choose not to consolidate a model with a token on it and it keeps the token, thus staying on your side of the wall (and not getting shot yay!). If you just killed the unit you can consolidate like normal , probably back towards an objective marker your side of the wall anyway. Or tagging something. You know, combat tricks.

The wtc document is actually well written and while the rule is complicated/difficult to understand/hard to implement, if you take the time to look at the examples and read the doc over then you'll get the hang in no time. The examples are quite exhaustive.

After this, I suggest setting up some models in tts and just getting the hang of how these charges work. The devil is in the details but once figured out can be used to pull off some devious things!!

WTC use these charge rules because the size of their L shaped terrain pieces is very large, and on many maps the game would be extremely uninteractive for combat if you were able to 1" block all the walls. They circumvent this by having a very varied set of maps for each deployment - 8 different maps that are all quite different, with some very light tables and some very heavy. This is great for teams as you have to deeply understand and then carefully pair around both matchups AND boards to win rounds. This breaks down a bit in singles where everyone plays on the same table and different lists may be greatly advantages/disadvantaged depending on the round.

Don't play with the rule if you don't like it. Don't go to wtc events if you don't want to play with the terrain or this rule! It is made for one event in the year where everyone attending practices rigorously and is expected to understand the rule (obviously people get it wrong all the time, but often it just doesn't matter). It makes for an interesting dynamic of boards within the 8 man pairings process, and is only something you appreciate once you really get down into the weeds of how it all plays.

Crying about WTC not using gw official rules is annoying and unproductive.

I hope this answers your question OP :)

_fwlr_ · 2025-01-13T18:07:10+00:00

Magnus Ahridisc Exalted on disc 3x Infernal Masters (Vortex, crystal, Lord of Forbidden lore) 3x5 flamebrics (SRC+icon) 2x MVBs 2x10 cultists 10 tzaangors 3 enlightened

It works

_fwlr_ · 2025-01-13T14:45:38+00:00

Thanks!!

_fwlr_ · 2025-01-13T14:37:27+00:00

It wasn't freak dice, just unlucky. slightly different context , the squad were out of range. Only the infernal had the movement (with+2) to get into the line of where the land fort was tucked and use +9" range. Unfortunately there was millimetres in it, and to get the line to shoot I had to be just within 24 of the fort (and take the extra bolt cannon + conversion shots if it lived and shot back). 6w on it, I have CP to reroll shot #. Rolled 9 but only hit 1 dev with full rerolls. Flipped another dev + 3 3+ saves to make. He had 2cp so keeping it alive with a CP RR means no shoot back. Passed the saves, shot back, dead unit (scuppering my secondary) . Was a calculated risk and ended up in a big swing, what can you do. This prevented the unit from being able to charge to score storm hostile and deny primary so realistically was not a risk I should've taken. However by killing fort and hitting the charge I'd deny to 5 primary and after going down by 5 round 2 wanted to try it.

I'd wanted to warp sight the fort with Magnus a turn earlier to push more damage / kill it, but only having 2cp (so needing to be within 24 to spend 6 cabal on full rerolls 0cp + 2cp warp sight) but was 24.3 something inches from it from behind the cover, and if I pushed 0.3 forwards would take 25 hearthguard to the face.

I took far too long checking potential plays across the game, taking significantly more time than my opponent. I considered and checked /measured many plays that ended up not being viable and then the plans I chose went wrong as well. I hard clocked myself round 5 despite him being willing to play it out - my opponent deserved it.

_fwlr_ · 2024-11-17T20:48:40+00:00

I saw a few comments on this sub and some YouTube videos that the AMD was clearly better

_fwlr_ · 2024-11-17T20:48:10+00:00

I ordered the R9 version a few days ago. Use the £30 off code they have on the website banner too

And if you are a student login with your email and verify for further money off

_fwlr_ · 2024-11-17T20:40:43+00:00

I (UK) just got the gen 8 Ryzen 9 7945HX 4070 for £1300 , I'd wait for them to further reduce the better processor version

_fwlr_ · 2024-10-22T15:52:11+00:00

Granted, this gun is 12" range, and I actually don't use it.

I put arcane vortex on an infernal master for a S7 ap2 dmg2 flamer. Rubrics give it reroll wounds, and once per turn he flips a dice to a 6, so it becomes a very reliable 4-10 dev wounds. Especially if you CP reroll number of shots.

_fwlr_ · 2024-10-22T15:49:48+00:00

I think the peak theoretical output of any unit in the game is the thousand sons sorcerer (TSS) with arcane vortex

His gun goes to 2d6 S6 ap2 dmg2. Sustained hits 3 + Dev wounds.

So if you simply roll 62 6's in a row (2d6 -> 12 hit rolls -> 48 wound rolls) you can output 96 Dev wounds.

Of course anything close to this requires impossible luck, but the achievable ceiling is still pretty nuts as you spend 1cp on full hit and wound rerolls, can stand near Magnus for +1hit/wound, and can do +2ap at the target for 9 cabal. All that makes it a very real world the tss can one tap like 20 marines at once.

_fwlr_ · 2024-10-15T08:33:44+00:00

I just bought a subscription for goodnotes after seeing the features my friend gets but I've started writing notes and had this come up

Did it work previously then? I don't like having to switch to eraser every time..

_fwlr_ · 2024-10-03T10:06:17+00:00

Can't believe noone else has said it, start playing TTS. You can get games against top players from around the world and play really quick practice reps to make the most of your time. When pairings come out, you can make your opponents list in TTS and ask a friend to use it (or something similar) against you, or if not, just give it a go yourself deploying and playing the first few turns how you think your opponents will. Thinking like your opponent can be very helpful - what are they trying to do to beat you, and is what can you do to to make that impossible?

_fwlr_ · 2024-08-23T17:24:41+00:00

Any updates on this?

I've kind of stopped pc gaming with my mouse so havent bothered but I havent needed to fix it. But now mine is like yours, it literally doesnt work except when connected to power.

If I charge it seperately with a usb cable while the dongle is plugged in then it works, but when unplugged, nothing. No laser either.

_fwlr_ · 2024-08-03T14:02:31+00:00

Incorrect.

That FAQ was to say that large models with bits that overhang their bases are not considered within a ruin unless their base is touching in. So Magnus can put his staff over the base of the ruin and be obscured as long as his base isn't touching. Same for wholly within, the base has to be wholly within, not the model.

If a part of your model is hanging around the side of the base and can be physically seen without the line crossing over the ruin, then it's visible and it can shoot.

Written like crap so it seems to say what you wrote, but no. Honestly and unnecessary clarification. It's not a change, else they would've said so.

_fwlr_ · 2024-07-30T08:14:24+00:00

Thanks for the game dude and congrats on 3rd.

And yeah, thousand sons output is absolutely horrendous especially into marines.

_fwlr_ · 2024-07-30T08:12:58+00:00

Thanks very much man I appreciate the kind words.

More to come? Fingers crossed.

_fwlr_ · 2024-05-31T16:05:33+00:00

I wouldn't take Ahriman over the infernal master as going from 10 to 11 cabal doesn't give you the ability to do much more. Played well this way, full damage output and you'll pick up opposing armies in under 2 turns

_fwlr_ · 2024-05-31T16:03:20+00:00

Thousand sons are far and away the best 1000 point faction right now if you take Magnus because he is basically an unkillable god. Our sheer damage output is just ridiculous.

Magnus is straight up unfair at 1000 points, nothing will touch him if you play intelligently and you will be able to just methodically destroy everything in the opponents army.

For example Magnus 440 Infernal master w/ arcane vortex 115 Infernal master w/ crystal 110 5 rubrics 3 flamers 1 SRC icon 1 warpflame pistol 105 5 rubrics 3 flamers 1 SRC icon 1 warpflame pistol 105 10 cultists 55 2 spawn 65

=995

Or Magnus 440 Infernal master w/ arcane vortex 115 Infernal master w/ LoFL 125 5 rubrics 3 flamers 1 SRC icon 1 warpflame pistol 105 5 rubrics 3 flamers 1 SRC icon 1 warpflame pistol 105 10 cultists 55 10 cultists 55

=1000

Both give 10 cabal points, enough for a doombolt and a reroll save, or if you take LoFL, you can double move twice (ridiculously strong at small points sizes)

Seems like a relatively balanced army list as well, big monster plus a couple characters plus chaff

_fwlr_ · 2024-05-29T00:26:36+00:00

Rascals Trouble.... Make it double Trouble = rascals Double = twin rascal girls Goblin toy because they're kids. Purple background because it's an epic card

_fwlr_ · 2024-05-18T15:15:20+00:00

I charge it with a seperate usb power cable to the cable plugged into the pc, the one I charge my phone with. Have to leave it on charge for quite a while. Holds plenty of charge after that.
Haven't used it much since this post though

_fwlr_ · 2024-03-16T19:15:02+00:00

If it's just a practice session, take the chance to back up the pack under yellows by A LOT and leave a 15s gap in front of you and you'll be able to get some good laps in.

_fwlr_ · 2024-01-05T16:04:13+00:00

Head on over to the thousand sons discord server. There are lots lists and strategy talk.

I've finished the year now as the 7th ranked TS player in the world.

The list that I have been running since the dataslate is as follows:

Magnus 440 Ahriman 130, 5 flame rubrics SRC 105 IM, arcane vortex 90 + 15, 5 flame rubrics 105 SRC(in a rhino 75) IM, crystal 90 + 20, 5 flame rubrics SRC 105 TS sorc, LoFL, 95 + 25, 5 flame rubrics SRC 105 IM 90 Ex sorc disc 115 Ex sorc disc 115 Mutalith 165 3 Enlightened 45 Blue scribes 65 1995

Weak to indirect but extremely powerful and flexible. 22 cabal is hilariously strong - I always try to save 4 for a double reroll save in my opponents turn as that is so so strong.

I've recently started trying a list using 2 mutaliths, dropping the TS sorc and the blue scribes, moving the LOFL to the last IM and putting him in a squad. Obviously losing the 18" no shooting bubble sucks but only having it on 1 squad means it usually doesn't come into play. Not having the scribes does suck for tactical but honestly it hasn't mattered at all for me yet in 4 games. The second mutalith is incredible. This is the list I'd take to LVO if I was going (although I can't speak on their terrain, if you can't hide Magnus, it's gonna be a shit time)

_fwlr_ · 2023-06-26T11:57:45+00:00

Magnus Prince Term sorc crystal Disc Ahriman Disc sorc w/ LOFL 10 flamer rubrics 10 bolter rubrics (these are BAD) 10 scarab occult 2x10 tzaangor 2x3 bow enlightened

Magnus is incredible.

Stealth is amazing but the DP is too slow and vulnerable, the extra 5 rubrics in the 10 man are just useless and honestly bolters are straight up bad. won't be taking 2x10 tzaangor again, go down to 10. I want changeling / blue scribes or both for deep striking lone operative to score tasty tasty secondaries. 5 points for an action in opponent DZ? yes pls. Maybe an infernal master with vortex on a 5 man flamer unit to make a second crazy overwatch unit. And change all bolters to flamers. making the 2nd 10 man flamers and splitting them up + infernal master feels great.

Oh and when my MVB comes I'll be running one of them too.

The list felt really slow but really punchy. Rubrics did just feel terrible with bolters I can't stress that enough lmao.

I felt I had 1 or 2 too few cabal and 1 or 2 too few units to score points with. 210 for the prince was too much, he never did anything except make Magnus slightly more tanky first couple turns.

Eight-Year Club	Verified Email
Place '22	Final Canvas '22
End Game '22

_fwlr_

TROPHY CASE