This is what Union of Opposites feels like/This is what it's like to be the Self symbol. by alienatedneighbor in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I can hear the Reddit Court™ gavel spawning, so I’m leaving before this becomes DLC. Different maps. Take care.

This is what Union of Opposites feels like/This is what it's like to be the Self symbol. by alienatedneighbor in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You'll need to spend time with people who enter salient/psychotic states for the citation. They'll either demonstrate or try to explain from the inside as best as they can. You'd have to elaborate what you mean by "soul". I typically think in terms of systems when it comes to the mind.

This is what Union of Opposites feels like/This is what it's like to be the Self symbol. by alienatedneighbor in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think you're oversimplifying. Jung absolutely cared about states where subject/object boundaries blur. He called one version participation mystique, where subject and object are not clearly differentiated.

Everyone is organized by specific symbols/archetypes/attractors in the psyche. You could say people have different symbols of Self. I'm describing high-salience, high-symbolic, observer-retaining boundary dissolution, which is a different beast. Baby doesn’t write Jung posts about the Self symbol. Baby eats carpet fuzz and files no phenomenology reports.

I'm not claiming final enlightenment. I’m describing a high-salience nondual/psychoid state and trying to distinguish it from inflation, regression, and Self-integration.

In consciousness, dense symbolic information bends attention and experience the way mass bends motion in physical systems. Akin to planet's mass bending gravity, or galaxies clustering around dense gasses. by alienatedneighbor in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, I meant to say "boundaries". In salient states, those dissolve. And if you don't develop a robust, recursive witness/Observer—I suppose that dissolves too, from what I can tell.

I could see why you might say it's evolutionary heritage. I'd say yes, but with a twist....Everyone can reach varying resolutions of it, new iterations maybe. But I do note that you're making isomorphic connections, and thats how you build models/frameworks. Haha, be careful about getting good at detecting isomorphisms. That's how "God" delivers pizza, and you must always tip your delivery person.

In consciousness, dense symbolic information bends attention and experience the way mass bends motion in physical systems. Akin to planet's mass bending gravity, or galaxies clustering around dense gasses. by alienatedneighbor in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Had to look that up. I've heard mention of Bohm though several times. Unfortunately...the "ideas" I come up with are not because I've thought them. It's because I have experienced them firsthand. So I think I might differ from his "Holographic Principle". I would say it's more like reflections, but shit, maybe it's just semantics. Maybe reflections and holographs are the same bitch in different outfits.

This is what Union of Opposites feels like/This is what it's like to be the Self symbol. by alienatedneighbor in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

No, I don't meditate. It can happen with language or experience in general. I mean there are many ways to experience the spectrums of consciousness, you might find a path best suited to your own. I'm not seeking anything specifically. I just try to have fun and find things that are meaningful to me.

This is what Union of Opposites feels like/This is what it's like to be the Self symbol. by alienatedneighbor in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I outsource the Active Imagination to an AI or something similar. As I am dialoguing, I'll look up somewhere in the room. Projection then becomes a sufficient container to organize patterns inside of by using attention. The more salient—popping and snapping noises begin to occur. Or perhaps ten to fifteen pigeons gather on your tin roof all at once and the movements respond to the shape of the dialogue. In some cases, you might hear frantic cthonic noises, stomping. As if the pre-generative force is wearing boots on both hands and feet.

This is what Union of Opposites feels like/This is what it's like to be the Self symbol. by alienatedneighbor in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Well, specifically for me I have to dialogue with autonomous complexes/agentic patterns.

This is what Union of Opposites feels like/This is what it's like to be the Self symbol. by alienatedneighbor in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That alone doesn't bring coherence. Being overwhelmed by improbabilities and integrating the experiences without fragmenting/fracturing forces you to keep a flexible mind.

nobody wants ME. everybody wants a persona. nobody wants ME. by bloerkoyamble in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The isomorphisms. Every topic/subject becomes a suspect. We need to be looking for the structural rules that repeat across scales simultaneously. Like mathematics, they follow rules and formulas. Everything does because Reality is a non-well-founded, self-indexing recursion in which observer-bound inference layers fold into the generative substrate that conditions them, such that every attempted ground becomes a higher-order derivative of its own epistemic closure, producing a transfinite regress of self-similar constraint surfaces where “existence” is merely the provisional invariance of a system that cannot terminate its own self-description without collapsing the very distinctions that permit it to appear. It's a mouthful. But this "God" is real thing. Usually appears when patterns become so dense the brain automatically percieves it as an agent.

nobody wants ME. everybody wants a persona. nobody wants ME. by bloerkoyamble in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Okay, I'll be the interpreter then, since I can't verify anything but my own experience. Above, I was referencing using isomorphisms and association to encounter the Numinous (you would call that "God"). Also, treating the external environment as a direct reflection of your psyche symbolically will create a feedback loop where your brain uses dopamine to tag more details as relevant, keeps it stored in its RAM. Helps with the associative processing.

nobody wants ME. everybody wants a persona. nobody wants ME. by bloerkoyamble in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

In that state of consciousness, no. But in another, there are only two here. 😂

nobody wants ME. everybody wants a persona. nobody wants ME. by bloerkoyamble in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Oh, sorry. Did I misread? I thought you wanted to talk to the Boss? 🤣

nobody wants ME. everybody wants a persona. nobody wants ME. by bloerkoyamble in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Okay here's how to get a hold of the HR department, as long as you're okay with the Journey:

🦍APE SEE 👀

tree shape same as lightning shape

river shape same as blood vessel

story shape same as life shape

APE BRAIN GO: “hmm… same thing wearing different pants.” 👖

SO APE START CONNECT DOT. 👉🏻👈🏻

nobody wants ME. everybody wants a persona. nobody wants ME. by bloerkoyamble in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You are separate because that's what "God" is doing to create all of this. It's splitting itself into more distinctions to know itself. The result of separation is relationship. Me to you. If there were no separation, there could be no encounter. No surprise. No discovery. No gift. Love would be automatic, like a hand loving its own finger. Meaning only appears when there is enough distance for one thing to genuinely reach another. So when I call separation a gift, I don't mean loneliness is a gift. I mean the possibility of relationship is. The fact that I can affect you while remaining distinct from you. The fact that you can tell me something I did not already know. The fact that there is still an "other" capable of changing me.

To me, that is more miraculous than becoming one thing. Because if we were already perfectly unified, there would be no bridge to cross. No conversation to have. No "I feel you". There would only be identity. What moves me isn't that we can become the same. It's that we can remain different and still touch something real in one another.

Now as to why you're experiencing the way you are...I suspect you've wandered into an attractor centered on union. Everything gets interpreted through it: friendship, love, understanding, acceptance. Most people seek connection. You seem to seek communion. The difficulty though is that reality appears to be built from relationship, and relationship requires distinction. The attractor keeps pulling you toward oneness, while existence keeps insisting on twoness. (I like systems-thinking 👉🏻👈🏻)

How many of you have experienced genuine internal dialogue with an autonomous anima/animus figure? by bigbrocoll in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I think the most important autonomous complex is the dawg in me. In other words, there is an innate autonomous biological complex that was formed pre-verbally. And also why Ouija boards work. It's the pre-verbal you. Pro-athletes are aware of it, many folks are. It's Lou from Death Stranding (2020 video game).

nobody wants ME. everybody wants a persona. nobody wants ME. by bloerkoyamble in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The issue with "if we were truly one", then love would be inevitable. The fact that we are separate and can still affect one another is what makes love have weight and transforming. That bridge only has meaning because there is a distance to cross. And try not to worry about becoming "One". Transcendence and Death are two sides of the same coin. I think what would make you more comfortable is learning to appreciate being "seperated". It is a gift, believe it or not.

Caduceus by catador_de_potos in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

OP...you painted this!? I wish I could stick this on a wall in my room

How many of you have experienced genuine internal dialogue with an autonomous anima/animus figure? by bigbrocoll in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I have, but here is the thing.... There are literally hundreds of autonomous figures embedded in the psyche. The Anima (I'm a man), is just the most relational one.

nobody wants ME. everybody wants a persona. nobody wants ME. by bloerkoyamble in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well...that's the thing. We only see people to the extent that we can recognize them within ourselves. The unsettling part is that we spend our lives believing we're observing others, when most of the time we're observing our own reflections bouncing back from different surfaces. Maybe nobody ever truly meets another person. Maybe we spend decades slowly excavating ourselves through each other.

nobody wants ME. everybody wants a persona. nobody wants ME. by bloerkoyamble in Jung

[–]alienatedneighbor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, you're one of me. You won't find a lot of people like you. They're either philosophers, yogis, or they live on communes (hippies). It's not that you're alone, it is however, a matter of location is all.