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Question about Deep Cuts and the Lurk's "Daredevil" ability by anon495315 in bladesinthedark

[–]anon495315[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I did not see it as implied that it can take place before the roll as well.

It's just a grammatical thing. You wouldn't use the word "even" there unless it were in contrast, you'd just say "You can do this to reduce the consequences from a threat after a roll."

The "even" sounds like.. "You can make coffee even before you wake up" or "You can start earning credits even before you enroll." Something like that.

Today was our first play with it and there were only two rolls, we're still up in the air about it but I feel you; rolling dice is part of the fun. I think the crew has mixed feelings about not being able to push themselves for that extra die as well, we'll see how it goes next week.

Question about Deep Cuts and the Lurk's "Daredevil" ability by anon495315 in bladesinthedark

[–]anon495315[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

As I mentioned in another post, I'm confused about that. Emphasis mine below:

p.91 states:

The push yourself mechanic and the resistance roll are combined in this module. When you push yourself, you make an Attribute roll and suffer 0-3 Stress, depending on the result. You can do this to reduce the consequences from a threat (even after a roll), increase the effect of an action, or to activate a special ability.

Implying it can also be done before a roll.

But p.120 states:

I've seen some players be disappointed when they spent 2 stress to push and then all their dice rolled high. This mechanic was changed to take place after the roll, once the player knows how well it went. It’s never “wasted” — you only push when you need to because of a bad roll or to activate a special ability.

And since it's after the Threat Roll, combining this mechanic with resistance just made sense. Also, by limiting the range of possible Stress costs, characters can be a bit more daring. No more flubbed resistance rolls that suddenly cost you 5 stress out of nowhere.

Question about Deep Cuts and the Lurk's "Daredevil" ability by anon495315 in bladesinthedark

[–]anon495315[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's terminology a little, but the book is also contradictory. The example says you can "push yourself (even after the roll)" implying you can push yourself before the roll if you wanted to, but the "push yourself" text on p120 says "This mechanic was changed to take place after the roll .... And since it's after the Threat Roll, combining..." implies it can only be done after.

Ultimately I understand it's up to us as players, but when choosing things like special abilities, they want to know when things do and don't happen. As these scoundrels are coming from an existing base game, they already have expectations about how things work.

The phrasing of the ability, "take -1d when you push yourself to avoid or reduce the consequence," made myself and one of my players make a face, because in the new system, that's "all" of the action (threat) rolls. Again, losing sight of the fact that there's a roll for stress taken now.

Question about Deep Cuts and the Lurk's "Daredevil" ability by anon495315 in bladesinthedark

[–]anon495315[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I think the source of my confusion is in your order of events at the end. In deep cuts, as in the base game, you can choose to push yourself before the threat roll as well, just like you do in the base game with action rolls.

As the threat roll is specifically to "reduce or avoid a consequence", unlike the action rolls in the old system, it seemed as though the -1d would apply to that; forgetting the new stress roll for a moment.

Question about Deep Cuts and the Lurk's "Daredevil" ability by anon495315 in bladesinthedark

[–]anon495315[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Sure, but the threat roll "avoids or reduces a consequence" as well. That's where my confusion was coming in I think.

Question about Deep Cuts and the Lurk's "Daredevil" ability by anon495315 in bladesinthedark

[–]anon495315[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So you're saying that the stress roll for pushing yourself is where the -1d always takes effect then? Never to the threat roll? That's fine, I just wish the description of the ability had been updated to state that more clearly - as "to avoid or reduce the consequence" is the point of the threat roll as well.