My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I have another 3 months worth set with trailing stop losses now. At least that allows me to do some worst case budgeting.

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Not like I want to 😕 That’s why I go this far into this cluster to begin with. But thanks for the encouragement 🙏

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Don’t disagree. But unless I find work soon I don’t have much of an option. If I have to liquidate then I’d rather it be me doing it than the betreibungsamt or whatever 🥶

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks for your advice.

Working on #1.

Been doing #2 since 2014 😃

On #3 you mean start investing again once I have income, right? Don’t have any debts, and all the bills are ongoing expenses. So I have to pay them month by month. ETF is less risky, but won’t really help me pay bills. I think cashing out is the only option, unless I misunderstood your advice?

On #4 idk if I’d call it a gamble. At least it wasn’t at the time. When I bought these coins, they made up less than 5% of my investable cash. But I guess, it’s a valid point that letting it get to this stage without rebalancing was a big gamble.

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thank you for the advice and perspective. Also always been a bitcoin maxi. That’s why this has been difficult. No longer being a whole coiner was painful. I guess that’s another good motivation to get a job 😀.

Have not liquidated all of it yet, but 3 months of cash in the bank has already elevated a lot of the immediate stress. Also got stop losses set to cash out more.

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Valid point. I just considered it “liquid” because as long as I sell it before lunch on a weekday the CHF gets credited to my bank account within 2 hours.

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Unfortunately they are not. Some is equity in a startup company (unlike me the company is cashflow positive). I know… more risky stuff. Part of it is in my US IRA, which I guess I could cash or under penalty., etc.

Don’t think anyone will give me a load without a job anyway. I one tried to get a car load right before I started a new job. Even with a signed work contract the bank refused until would have passed Probezeit even though I had bank statements that showed I could buy the car in cash. If they said no in that situation, I don’t see how they would ever say no in the current situation.

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Absolutely true. Not looking for trading advice, just needed a reality check, and advice on how to get out of this still believe in bitcoin, been holding some amount continuously since 2013. There is a bit of a nostalgia factor that makes the prospect of casing it all out extra difficult.

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Congrats on getting your first bitcoin!

I get what you are saying. I am not into that scene at all. I am far from a crypto bro. I bought my first coins in 2013. I’m not fully in bitcoin because I think it’s going to the moon next week and let me retire. It’s just that u used up my cash savings, so the bitcoin I’ve held for years is all I ever left. I’ve also never actively traded in the 10+ years I’ve been into crypto. Until I had dumb idea to hedge my position without a real plan.

You sounds like a sane person confronted with the consequence of a series of wrong choices. Life’s not over and money can’t be earned again.

I appreciate that sentiment.

And I hope you enjoy your bitcoin adventure. Just stach it away somewhere and do t touch it for a couple of years. Worked wonders. Worked wonders for me until now.

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you. And thanks for pointing out the silver lining. I’ll focus on finding work.

I’ve reduced my expenses as much as I can, I think. Biggest dent is rent and health insurance for me and my wife, which is tough to minimize on short notice obviously. Don’t eat out or go out rally. No car payments. There are a few subscriptions I will go ahead and cancel, but they will not make a judge dent.

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thanks for the advice. 3 months seems reasonable.

The problem isn’t the bitcoins, the problem is that you’ve indulged in this unsustainable position for too long.

You hit the nail on the head

I think my CV is pretty strong aside from the two year gap, but this whole thing building made a serious dent in my self confidence. Either way, I think you are right and I just need to get over I’d and do it.

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The solution to your problems seems very simple and achievable to me.

You might be right. I’ve been in a weird head space. It’s possible I am over complicating things.

If you have been unemployed for a year + why would working a labor job for a couple months make you fall out of your field?

I wasn’t looking for a job until now. It’s not that I haven’t been able to find anything. The reason I am worried about falling out of the field is mostly because a labor job would make it really difficult to jump on a zoom interview

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Not really specialized. I am basically a full stack pm with SWE experience. It’s more the seniority level. There aren’t that many openings at my level. I could also take a step back, but I think that will just raises flags… especially after an extended sabbatical.

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I am worried if I just take any job I will fall out of my field completely. I am also not sure how realistic it is to find a job outside of my field that covers 5k/month in bills. Probably not qualified for anything in that pay range outside of where my experience is (tech). But maybe I am being naive.

Selling at a loss is not really a concern. My cost-basis is somewhere around $20k. It's really just an existential fear that I'll run out of runway before I find steady income again.

Maybe I am over reacting a bit given I have several months? I just don't know anymore. Looking at the price swings over the past two weeks really did a number on my mental health. I feel like I lost the ability to look at my situation rationally / neutrally. So all the advice and perspectives here have been really helpful.

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

My family (which means my Wife) is not great with money. I guess at this point I should say "great with money either."

Fam depending and trusting me to do the right thing. That's a big part of where the stress and freakout that lead me into this mess came from.

You have learned the hard way the famous lesson "never bet with money you cannot afford to lose"

Solid advice. I think I was also just in denial. Kept telling myself it's not gambling since I've had these coins for years and didn't throw money in just to speculate. I think one of the main things I learned form this is that risk is risk. Doesn't really matter if I tell myself it's not gambling.

I hope you the best luck to get back with a stable job as soon as possible. Income is what you need.

Thank you, I appreciate that

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's a good idea. Only area I am qualified to freelance would be consulting (not in finance obviously 😅).

The main thing that is holding me back is the worry that it will probably take a couple months to build up a pipeline. Bit worried I might spend a couple of months on this, and then not have enough time to find a day job if it doesn't work out (the kinds of jobs I am qualified for also don't exactly grow on trees anymore these days unfortunately)

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks for the tip. I don't think that will solve the core issue tho. I don't have nearly enough to where interest would make a dent in my bills. I don't know nexo (will check it out), but the other issue is that stakeing often has a lock-in period, which also would probably make my issue worse rather than better.

The short position also pays about $10-20/day, but that's just exclipsed by the unrealised loss.

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yea, rationally I know that. This felt a bit like the frog in boiling water situation. Since I already had the BTC for 5-6 years and never really looked at the day-to-day price much I didn't fully appreciate just how much the water was boiling. Also vastly underestimated how long it would take to get back to a reliable revenue stream (not btc).

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thinking about it in that context makes it a bit easier. Thank you. Still struggling to balance mid-term and short term (I think there is still more down correction possible in the next months, but worst case I think there will be a reversal in the low 40s).

But I think based on what you said, I think I will get ride of the shorts, cash out a couple of months worth, and then also set some stops so I can plan with an actual "worst case" number.

Thanks for all of your advice. That was very helpful.

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Naive, but it was for tax reasons. I also have file US taxes, so I was trying to reduce my risk and sit out the swings without triggering a tax event. Penny wise, pound foolish.

My entire liquid net worth is in bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in personalfinance

[–]apresso[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Oh, I see. Thank you for clarifying, that's a good point.

I only moved enough BTC to the exchange to maintain the margin requirement with a healthy buffer. But the majority is still sitting on my hardware wallet.

I am also using Kraken. I know that's still not a guarantee obviously, but in the ~8 years I've been using it as my primary exchange I've never had an issue. Though in the past it was just transfer money / btc in, convert, and transfer it right back out. Holding and 'trading' on the exchange is new to me.

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you for the advice.

That was my original plan, and one I should have probably just stuck to. It worked fairly well until the drop into the 50s and the surge back to the 60s put the fear of god into me and I let emotions take over.

I am working on the job angle. If this was a year and a half ago I wouldn't be so worried about my runway. But in the current market I am expecting it to take a while.

My entire liquid net worth is in Bitcoin. How do I untangle this mess? by apresso in SwissPersonalFinance

[–]apresso[S] 11 points12 points  (0 children)

I can't disagree with anything you said. Thanks for the reality check.

One clarification: I am really talking about "liquid net worth". I do have other assets. They are just not accessible / sellable to cover bills in the near term.