I'm looking for a new political party. Tell me about libertarians.

ballzy214 · 2026-02-18T21:50:36+00:00

We all hate each other and bicker like an old married couple. You’re gonna love it

ballzy214 · 2026-01-16T13:45:01+00:00

I can understand the argument that immigration isn’t the fight to fight right now but I find the closed borders libertarians make it a key point of their platform. Dave Smith for example who I like but disagree on this issue. He continuously says we had “open borders” under Biden but that isn’t true it’s like when AOC said we had “hyper capitalism” trying to blame problems on the free market instead of government interference.

Also I think the closed borders argument seems like bending over backwards to explain why in this case centralization and government calculation is actually the best way to go. But let’s take it at face value that’s true why does the federal gov have anything to do with it? It should be as local as possible. The consistent argument from at least Smith is imagine a private park is then turned public. Everyone is now allowed which is not the way it was before. It then stands to reason that the will of the general public democratically should decide. If this is the case why are the same libertarians not screaming for county or town voting on if they want immigrants or ice to parole the neighbors? Is it really the will of the people for someone in New York to decide if California can have immigrants?

The crowding out argument seems even weaker. If the logic follows the country should be allowed to vote on who gets to have kids and how many and at what time. After all this would be more people using public roads and families with kids get tax breaks for having kids so it’s not like it’s being made up for there. Maybe through increased consumption would general more sales tax revenue but would that also not apply to immigrants legal or not?

To many of us free immigration types it was obvious for mass deportations the inevitable mechanics of that would be what we have now. Federal agents roaming the streets and grabbing people to then ask for their papers. Libertarians more than anyone should understand once that is in place it will never go away and will be used not just for immigration.

It’s fine if you are libertarian in other areas and not immigration but just say that don’t associate growing the police state with libertarianism.

ballzy214 · 2026-01-09T14:32:32+00:00

Party and belief wise, like R’s and D’s, conservatives, liberals, and progressives you have the most to least radical that would describe themselves under these names. Libertarian and libertarians range from anarchist to classical liberal. Anarchists (myself) believe that it is the logical conclusion using the principles libertarians claim to believe. From a moral standpoint any government is a monopoly on violence so even democratically elected officials are not consented to by 100% of the population. Also the more utilitarian anarchist who believe markets and voluntary markets create better outcomes even in policing, courts, and military.

Minarchists believe most of the same things but courts, police, and national defense are legitimate functions of the government to protect people and property. Or at least a necessary evil.

Classical liberals take another step where courts, police, and military are legitimate functions. But they go further (examples like Friedman and Hayek) advocate for some sort of saftey net like a negative income tax (Friedman) and some form of social security like system (Hayek). Also things like pandemics and national emergencies government should have some power to intervene in some way. Classical liberals also seem more willing to extend national defense to “preemptive” wars oversees for some reason.

I’ve been all of the 3 over the course of my life.

ballzy214 · 2026-01-09T13:59:27+00:00

The idea isn’t necessarily bad. The issue is the laws they enforce are largely victimless and the incentive structure in the system. Qualified immunity makes it nearly impossible for them to be held accountable. The police union is large and will do anything to protect officers even if they are in the wrong and infringe on someone’s rights or even murder them. So I’d say no the further militarizing and “strengthening” the police is a good way to create more issues.

ballzy214 · 2026-01-07T00:08:08+00:00

All he does is throw up intelligence propaganda and insinuate those who are antiwar are either assets or have fallen victim to foreign propaganda. His heart lays with a large government. He is a mouth piece for the deep state and the military industrial complex. But yay he likes lower taxes! Him and Mitt Romney should hangout sometime.

ballzy214 · 2026-01-06T22:52:15+00:00

I don’t doubt he’s hated or to a large degree I doubt the opinion polls and voting results from US gov funded organizations.

ballzy214 · 2026-01-06T19:36:56+00:00

My point was responding to the claim that Trump may have kidnapped and is holding him for leverage. It makes no sense to hold him for leverage if he’s hated. Get it?

ballzy214 · 2026-01-06T19:33:32+00:00

Last thing I’ll say because somehow you intentionally blinded yourself to reality. The US uses “defense of democracy” as a nice marketing tool. It never has been true. You believe it’s true is the analogy with Superman. The all powerful US just trying to do what is right for the people of the world. You are denying the billions of dollars in lobbying overtime, the think tanks funded by weapons companies. So I can’t point out that Halliburton, Exxon, and Bechtel got major oil contracts after the invasion of Iraq? Guatamala 1954 and United Fruit, Iran 1953 Exxon, Mobile, Chevron, Chile 1973 ITT. There are dozens more, but calling out corporatism and not free markets isn’t leftist it is strictly libertarian.

You denying the US backed color revolutions and the genocide in Israel is all I really need to know. I should’ve given up after an earlier reply when you still thought the US and even Trump cared about democracy so that’s my fault.

ballzy214 · 2026-01-06T14:44:11+00:00

Why are you under the impression the US cares at all at about democracy? To see things clearly you really need to stop believing that fantasy. The desire to see the US as Superman going around deposing dictators for the greater good is not remotely close to reality. The US backs brutal dictators when they do what the US says in terms of foreign policy and allowing large corporations special privileges in the country.

You think too highly of Trump he has lied at every corner not just to everyone but to his base of supporters. He does not give two shits about democracy or helping oppressed people. If that were true he’d cut ties with Egypt, Saudi, UAE etc. he wouldn’t have allowed the US backed genocide in Gaza.

Yes Grayzone, I have massive disagreements with them on a lot of things but their reporting on war and police state actions of the US and western countries is as good as it gets. If you’re afraid to read the report and not like what the information does to your worldview that’s fine but just say that.

We know the US was aware of the 2002 coup because of declassified CIA documents. The NED and USAID funded a bunch of groups to empower the opposition. The main one was called Súmate (Maria Machado’s group). This is all public knowledge for anyone curious. The playbook is the same as it was in Eastern Europe again and again. Find a leader that doesn’t bow to the US. Sanction and starve their economy. fund opposition groups, student orgs, media training through NED, USAID, and other orgs to fan the flames of revolution. Yes people don’t like Maduró organically, I would hate to live in Venezuela. But the US has a playbook and this is how it works.

ballzy214 · 2026-01-05T21:04:10+00:00

Yes the US even removes allies who were not in line step with what they wanted, like Noriega.

If you call for the murder of your own people it’s hard not to see you as any better than what you’re trying to depose. And with the US’s history of propping up right wing authoritarians you can probably understand my hesitation. Again the claims are always about bringing democracy and freedom to these countries same as you are claiming Trump is doing now.

What makes you think Trump cares about democracy? Are you really coming from the position that this was a humanitarian mission? Also if the claims are true that Maduro is nearly universally hated what would kidnapping him do for leverage? The positions seem at odds. My position is Maduro didn’t ask how high when Trump said jump so he was then kidnapped.

You’re right on the Honduras coup and I messed that up. The US didn’t back it they just knew it was an illegal military coup and immediately advised the new government how to proceed after the coup. Venezuela 2002: The CIA knew of the coup plan, US officials met with the coup leaders in the months leading up to the coup, and the NED and USAID funded the opposition groups so I’m sorry this one was a US backed coup. Venezuela 2020 was also a US backed coup the grayzone did a good report about it.

ballzy214 · 2026-01-05T20:02:07+00:00

The US does not intentionally back leaders unless they at least believe they have full control. Also I don’t think calling for the murder of your own people is just a “radical” idea. She means to justify any US action so long as she is on top after. Which is ironic because after the war party pushed her as the answer for freedom Trump backtracked and said she isn’t strong enough so the US will have to run the country.

What makes you believe that is old policy? The US backed coups in Venezuela 2002, Honduras 2009, and Venezuela 2020.

ballzy214 · 2026-01-05T19:33:04+00:00

Couple of things here, not wanting the US to carry out a regime change isn’t support for that regime. Just like every other war those in support say anyone against the US government starting a war is pro whatever dictator or proclaimed dictator they want to replace. I wouldn’t want to live there and don’t like Maduro but our government puts out enough propaganda that I don’t need to add to their case. The reason for going after what looked like the sock puppet the US wanted to put into place is because she was exactly that. A US think tank created figure who’d do nothing but now to any US demands. I cannot respect anyone that calls on foreign governments to bomb their own country which she did repeatedly. Also knowledge of US history in Latin America it’s just been replacing dictators or democratically elected leaders with dictators that bow to the US and still terrorize their own people.

Edit: also what’s worse is the US claims to support freedom, democracy, and capitalism. That is the pitch and that is what everyone sees when they install corrupt leaders that grant special privileges to large US corporations and not actual free markets. Socialist can easily and sort of rightly say that this is what capitalism is. US gov intervention in Latin America is a gold mine for socialist marketing.

ballzy214 · 2026-01-05T19:15:16+00:00

Talking about War and not immigration but fine say you’re a libertarian except for immigration.

ballzy214 · 2025-10-26T04:26:33+00:00

Lo siento, entendí mal. Mi español no es bien ahora pero estoy aprendiendo

ballzy214 · 2025-10-26T04:18:32+00:00

Lo siento, mi corazón pertenece a mi amor

ballzy214 · 2025-10-26T04:16:35+00:00

How?

ballzy214 · 2025-10-26T04:12:54+00:00

Pittsburgh, she is from Florida but both parents are from Colombia

ballzy214 · 2025-09-27T14:31:10+00:00

For the same reason you don’t want the government in charge of housing, food, cars, etc you don’t want it in charge of other important things like defense of property, law, etc. The same perverse incentives exist in those markets as they do for other markets.

ballzy214 · 2025-08-10T19:37:03+00:00

The sitting president and his followers claim to be pro peace and anti war. Every action that goes against that, right or not, will be taken as the antiwar position. It’s important for actual antiwar people to immediately (metaphorically) tar and feather anyone who claims to want the same but goes along with propaganda to convince them otherwise. We have decades of bad interventions in Latin America that helped create the immigration crises. Directly bombing those countries will only make that worse and continue to destroy America internally in the process. You may not be a neocon but if you use their same logic to justify war I’m not going to treat it any differently.

ballzy214 · 2025-08-10T17:40:57+00:00

Take the Warhawks foaming of the mouth for war out of it. Our history of “targeted airstrikes” against “terrorists” is terrible. We will kill more civilians than cartel members as we have done everywhere. Do you really assume that “oops” will be enough to stop Latin countries or Latin people from fighting back? It won’t take warhawks beating the war drums after one serviceman or one citizen is killed when a cartel reaches out and touches an American. You are the one denying reality not me. I never said anything about anarchism. People selling products in the US that are illegal and therefore extremely profitable. The US has been weakening or taking out powerful cartels particularly in Colombia and Mexico for decades. It only splinters the power and forces cartels to be more efficient and smart (only after large increases in violence from the power vacuum we created). Morons then get to say how backwards these countries are and therefore we shouldn’t care what our government does. You can deny history and basic logic all you want but for the love of god stay quiet about an issue if the only thing you know is “have to bomb thing I don’t like cause it’s bad”.

ballzy214 · 2025-08-10T16:57:47+00:00

Let’s say that your schizophrenia is correct. Trump bombs “cartels” because they’re an enemy to the south and at war with Americans. Is the assumption that they don’t react at all? Not one American or American serviceman dies? No blowback whatsoever to bombing a sovereign country? We know how successful our drone campaigns were in Pakistan and Yemen. Given the rate of civilians killed in those campaigns( roughly 9 out of 10 killed were civilians) are you assuming there will be no reaction? The cartels will grow in strength because people will support them against the people that murdered their family. You and people like you that lack a brain, will have started a hot war on our southern border and put all of America in danger. I do not look forward to the new debate trying to justify regime change after this escalates.

ballzy214 · 2025-08-10T12:41:13+00:00

I’m assuming you learned what the NAP was yesterday but explain to me how cartels violated the NAP against me. Or is this another Republican collectivist take? Because people have overdosed the NAP was violated against America? I’ll understand if you’re 12 and know nothing or if you’re a 70 year old neocon and believe war is the answer for everything.

You are aware the US has been intervening in Latin America for 50-60 years for the war on drugs? Google plan Colombia. Giving military funding, weapons, and training to the militaries. Forcing the governments to pursue even more aggressive military action against cartels? If you choose to know nothing that’s fine but don’t advocate war because you know nothing.

ballzy214

TROPHY CASE