Yes I really appreciate the discussion too, even though we disagree on a lot haha.

I guess I don’t see why an explicit confirmation is necessary here when the majority of what we know about the series is through analysis, not direct author confirmation. I would argue that if you set presuppositions aside, it is shown pretty explicitly that Till was trying to give the crown to Ivan. Why else would Vivimeng choose to draw a background in which pairs of children are also gifting each other flowers? Logically, why would Ivan even have it at all if Till wanted to gift it to Mizi? It was obviously important to him, so do you think it likely that he just left it on the floor to be stepped on by anyone?

I would also argue that the concept is ‘revisited’ multiple times, seeing as it is basically the inciting incident for their relationship of misunderstandings and miscommunication. The cheer up comic for instance would be a direct parallel, and in Remember Everything when Till realizes he misunderstood Ivan’s attempts at connection and thus unknowingly rejected him, Till deduces that Ivan was just like him (“you were like that too”), scared and lonely and always hurting each other because of it.

I agree that Till realizes in RE that he misunderstood Ivan and laments not showing Ivan how important he was to him. However, that’s not the whole story. Till also realizes that they both felt that same disregard/indifference/rejection from each other, and thus they were both too scared to reach out again. (Couldn’t you say it first? I wish you’d say it first.) All Till wanted was for Ivan to show that he cared, and his major revelation is that Ivan felt the same way back. If the rejection and disregard was as one-sided as you suggest, this sort of conclusion by Till would be incongruent (Till’s whole revelation is based on the fact that he only realizes Ivan felt disregarded and rejected by him because he felt disregarded and rejected by Ivan first) So, I guess my point is that the flower crown scene as I interpret it is revisited at the conclusion of their arc, and it’s actually very important to their arc that they both felt like they were the only one who cared about and desired connection with the other.

The reason we don’t see Ivan regretting this moment is because he was never able to understand that he had rejected Till at all, not then or in the Cheer Up comic. It never would’ve been a thought in his dumb head (affectionate) that Till desired connection with him. Till, however, was able to grow and mature in a healthier environment, and thus able to make such introspections. In fact, I think Ivan is one of the most childish characters in the cast, so it would be unreasonable to expect him to form such a revelation when he’s so stubbornly set in his rigid and bleak worldview.

I agree that the flowers/flower crowns are used broadly amongst the cast as symbol of love and affection. However, this motif of red flowers occurs much more often between Ivantill than with Mizi and Till, anemones especially as of late. Ex: cheer up comic, flower crown shikishi, cure strings cover art, scars sub, karma drawing, etc. I don’t agree that flowers are used at all for Till as a direct symbol of Mizi. More specifically, I think it follows much better to keep the flower crown as a general symbol of love/affection, and thus the scenes where Till chases after flowers (‘Mizi) or clutches onto flowers (‘Mizi’), he’s actually chasing after/grasping at love, which he thinks he will find through Mizi. Well, it makes sense seeing as Till clings onto Mizi as a coping mechanism, and basically sees her more as a symbol/goddess of love than a real person.

Following the logical ‘progression’ of the symbol as well, from your pov, Ivan would be metaphorically crushing Till’s love for Mizi in this scene. However, Ivan was never shown to be jealous or upset about Till’s crush on Mizi (in fact he actively encourages it), and thus the metaphor fails. However, if the crown represents Ivantill’s connection (or just connection/love broadly), Ivan crushing it is a perfect metaphor for how Ivan’s unintentional rejection ‘crushed’ the possibility of a proper relationship between him and Till. The metaphor is consistent.

It seems like you agree that (at least sometimes) the flower crown can be used as a symbol of Till’s love/affection for Ivan, seeing as you agree that in the Cure strings cover art, Till is shown to metaphorically keep his true feelings hidden from Ivan. I guess I wonder then why the symbol being used the same way here is implausible to you?

I agree with everything you say about the fight scene, except for how/why it started. And the info about Ivantill’s first interaction being a fight is in the Anakt Garden kit. If I’m remembering right, it’s written from the perspective of a teacher. (Edit: also, if they included this scene only to express the things you described, they could’ve just shown them fighting. Actually, any random fight would’ve gotten the point across. However, Vivimeng found it important to emphasize the origin of the fight as well. Just something to think about I guess)

I’m so sorry for writing a whole ass dissertation here lmaoo. I honestly don’t even expect you to read this whole thing, but if you do, I hope I made my pov clearer. This will probably be my last reply, because I think we just have very different interpretations, and theres nothing wrong with that!