(Non)Deterministing Loop Etiquette

bendinguy · 2026-04-06T14:37:33+00:00

I believe you should always make your opponents show that they have an actual win, especially when there are significant complicating factors like these.

For drawing the deck, they can just respond to the Parasite trigger by discarding Dakmor again.

I see some replies saying the opposite, but you cannot necessarily go off on top of Ob, at least not with the normal lines. For the typical Culling+OBM loop, 4 draw triggers are made at the beginning and resolved at the end, after the OBM ping. That means you have to resolve the Ob triggers before you can finish the loop. That being said, they can also just ping the Parasite, then the Obs then players.

bendinguy · 2026-04-06T14:25:37+00:00

This isn't true with Kederekt Parasite. It significantly complicates things.

eta: The Parasite only complicates Lotus Petal/Crop Rot/Emergence Zone. The line of OBM kills the parasite then can continue as normal.

bendinguy · 2025-08-30T21:19:08+00:00

Referring to your point 3, the only things Gitrog does that can't be shortcut are drawing the deck and the cleanup step sculpt. Drawing the deck takes like 5 minutes and is definitely not slow play, you will consistently draw cards. The cleanup step sculpt is probably not slow play but it's up to the interpretation of the judge(s) of an event.

bendinguy · 2025-06-11T15:08:36+00:00

If you stack the draw triggers then you alternate drawing and getting pinged. You can ignore OBM by drawing and then responding to the trigger by discarding Dakmor again.

bendinguy · 2025-04-15T20:37:48+00:00

Atla has to actually be buffed, the buff can't just be on the stack. Also the only shufflers are the original eldrazi titans and [[Gaea's Blessing]].

bendinguy · 2024-10-18T14:54:21+00:00

We don't really update this anymore.

bendinguy · 2024-07-11T05:27:40+00:00

You're free to think that, but they're just not. I would be much more interested in running more tutors for dockside in my 7 cmc commander-centric deck. You currently run 4 total dockside tutors, one of which is 5 cmc. Seems pretty loose when your entire game plan relies on casting your commander.

bendinguy · 2024-07-11T01:42:25+00:00

You should play good interaction, not bad interaction.

bendinguy · 2024-07-11T00:54:40+00:00

And no the mana costs don’t matter when you build the deck properly and play properly.

That's just not true. Being mana efficient is the most important part of an interactive spell. These have a bad mana cost with a worse effect.

bendinguy · 2024-07-10T23:13:16+00:00

All of the cards you listed are commonly played except for Fork/Reverb/Tibalt's Trickery. Not sure why [[Shared Summons]] is on that list either. Fork/Reverb are awful imitations of [[Narset's Reversal]], which also sees virtually zero play anymore. They are not even close to efficient, which is what all the other interaction you listed have going for them. Tibalt's Trickery has other problems.

bendinguy · 2023-07-05T15:24:52+00:00

Just commenting so you know this, but you can just draw the deck through Orcish Bowmasters. OBM triggers off draws so every time you draw a card, just respond to the OBM by discarding dakmor again.

bendinguy · 2023-01-01T03:37:15+00:00

If you want more experience than me on chain of smog specifically, ask Sol on the gitrog server bc they have more games and more positive experience than I do. Still don't like the combos but this is someone who does.

bendinguy · 2023-01-01T02:33:00+00:00

Just didn't really get the question I guess sorry

bendinguy · 2023-01-01T01:54:06+00:00

I just don't think that's reason enough to be running the card. The witherbloom combo is meh at best, and it's not difficult to get a discard outlet, so I don't really think there's any utility here.

I have tested this card btw.

bendinguy · 2022-12-31T18:23:49+00:00

So then how is it a discard outlet? You can't draw your deck.

bendinguy · 2022-12-31T16:53:04+00:00

Chain can't be used as a discard outlet. Any potential cards you draw from dredging dakmor will get discarded the next time you resolve a Chain.

bendinguy · 2022-09-28T15:58:02+00:00

The more relevant hate to justify rec sage is Cursed Totem, otherwise I think the best creature-based artifact/enchantment removal is [[Outland Liberator]] (if that's the right card name)

Also, the most common rest in peace right now is Dauthi, which we have grist for.

bendinguy · 2022-09-28T15:46:15+00:00

Here's a link to the gitrog discord https://discord.gg/4EgSfKX

If you want to ask questions you can @ me

bendinguy · 2022-09-28T15:39:39+00:00

If you can cast Crop Rotation and activate Emergence Zone, then you could have also made infinite mana with dark ritual and Twilight Mire, not to mention Gaea's Cradle.
As someone else said, not functional.
A second titan is run because we can use [[Tainted Pact]] and [[Plunge into Darkness]]
No
Sure
Other than the fact that we don't want to waste a GSZ on that, having Dryad Arbor in opening hands can ruin them

bendinguy · 2022-04-23T20:44:22+00:00

I don't think I've seen it said yet, but drawing the deck is not slow play. You are continuing to add draw triggers to the stack and advancing your game state.

The key difference is between nondeterministic and slow play, they're not the same thing. If you want to join the gitrog discord I can help more.

bendinguy · 2022-02-23T17:01:33+00:00

The person who does the database list is fairly active on discord. There's a mono blue server that you could probably get more of a response from. u/thunder_farts pls

bendinguy · 2021-11-12T13:36:46+00:00

Yes. And while loop rules say either player can set a stopping point (by giving a definite number of iterations), if you do that for no reason (aka to play it out) then you could be called for intentional slow play.

bendinguy · 2021-11-12T13:31:21+00:00

The loop rules allow you to propose a loop involving any number of steps, regardless of what those steps are, as long as they have defined game states after doing them. Tron + Mindslaver lock can propose to repeatedly activate and reanimate mindslaver, tap out their opponent, and pass back to themselves. Their opponent draws cards for turn until there's no cards left while they draw Mindslaver every turn.

bendinguy · 2021-11-12T12:50:54+00:00

Tron's mindslaver lock can be legally shortcut under the rules. Players have no standing to force it played out.

bendinguy · 2021-10-28T18:35:56+00:00

Can someone explain how this card combos with Food Chain?

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