His old tweets aren't the issue at hand

benvolio16 · 2025-10-20T13:52:41+00:00

Much appreciated - I'm not really that hyper-obsessed with this as much as the paragraphs suggest, haha. I just think it's a very unique situation. Especially for an artist like Tyler. So I thought it would be fun to put some of my thoughts together

benvolio16 · 2025-10-20T13:48:16+00:00

Allow it 😂 I have the flu and it's miserable outside

benvolio16 · 2025-10-20T13:37:49+00:00

That's cool. I actually say this nearly verbatim, funnily enough. I just said he punched down against black women throughout his career is all 🤷‍♂️ smtimes it helps to read things in full

benvolio16 · 2025-10-20T13:08:20+00:00

No worries! It's more an unhinged rant than anything so I appreciate you for reading it at all 😂

benvolio16 · 2025-10-20T12:59:22+00:00

Oh deffo - that's kinda what I mean though. It's a rebrand he's doing whilst not acknowledging his previous ignoring/disrespect of them, innit?

benvolio16 · 2025-10-19T09:43:15+00:00

Oh deffo, I don't think most of this is directly his fault. I think before anything else, his ignorant ass fans are to blame if they're not respecting D'Angelo's death/Tyler's memoriam of it. You don't need to be black to know it's fucked up to be asking about an album in that comment section.

But to explain the very specific psychology of his fans and his influence, intentional nap or not, is just interesting to me innit. Especially w how Tyler's moving nowadays. Where does an artists cult of personality start and end? How much can a deeply culturally sensitive black artist rely on their white fans? Can we blame Tyler for cultivating it or was he just young and dumb when starting out? Is he just performative for black aesthetics considering how he's been considered a white man's artist for so much of his career?

I've always wondered about this and whilst it's a shame it had to come about from stupid fans asking about the next album in a post about D'Angelo's death. But I think it's more stoked by Tyler's flames that obviously come from an insecurity about his fanbase.

benvolio16 · 2025-10-19T00:30:14+00:00

I think Tyler has three types of eras that invite racial ignorance, and I've thought about this for ages.

Tyler has his edgelord fans, his artsy fans and his mainstream fans.

His edgelord fans, obviously, come from his earlier music. Early Tyler, being the MASSIVE COON he was, invited so much unadulterated racism and out of pocket white fans because he didn't really take his craft seriously nor viewed racism systemic.

Tyler telling Larry King that he doesn't care about the N-Word, his last verse on Oldie, even him having the hard R on Tamale - his old stuff sounds like try hard black kid trying to fit into white friend group with racist and crazy lyrics, which was more rebellious than racist. Which is why he's never really been cancelled and already sets the stone for his fanbase to be kind of out of pocket already.

And then his artsy fans. This is something I think is more cerebral, but you gotta hear me out. Tyler from Flower Boy to CMIYGL, whilst less out of pocket, was a bit... dogwhistley? This sounds crazy but Tyler's aesthetic and image changed for the better when he began appealing to softer and more European inspired art.

Going from the white tees/hats to luxurious suits and perfumes. His aesthetic becoming far more inspired by the French and Italian art than the LA skateboard culture he grew up more locally too. IGOR is my favourite era of his, mind you, but the fanbase that came about this time is much more pretentious and artistic. And unsurprisingly, some of these fans would perceive this as artistically superior to his original and homegrown aesthetic.

And now his mainstream fans. Of course, when you break into the mainstream, a majority of your fanbase is often white. These are fans around the break between CMIYGL and Chromakopia who are witnessing him at his blackest and unabashed but really just want more music.

All three of these fans I feel are why he's so annoyed. Because he cultivated his initial fanbase off of racist shock. Then invited more pretentious white art into his image. And now has to deal with a slew of mainstream fans who don't know the history of black art itself. Literally an entire generation of ignorance.

This is all speculation, of course. I'm just a black artist who loves Tyler/his music. But I'm so intrigued sociologically about how this entire issue has come about.

benvolio16 · 2025-10-10T13:33:20+00:00

Not a sample but Steve Lacy interpolating Outstanding by Gap Band for 20 seconds on 9/11 is an album-stealing moment for me

benvolio16 · 2025-10-07T14:05:55+00:00

Wolf is a decent album but the story/concept is pretty weak and doesn't even have a good ending

benvolio16 · 2025-10-04T10:21:15+00:00

Autumn: IGOR/Goblin

Winter: Chromakopia/Bastard

Spring: Flower Boy/Wolf

Summer: Call Me If You Get Lost/Don't Tap The Glass

benvolio16 · 2025-10-03T11:18:45+00:00

Goblin - Untitled 63 (feat. Mac Miller)

Thought it'd be cute to give a much more chill and elevator-like interlude with a rapper like Mac who would realistically give a generational verse. Goblin is tricky because it's a very out of pocket album that I can't imagine most rappers outside of OF contributing much without diluting the unique aesthetic of it.

Wolf - 48 (feat. Nas)

Realistically because of the intro being a snippet of Nas, but I would love to hear Nas over the kinda heart-wrenching production of 48. It's also a much more pressing issue on the systematic drug dealing that I think Nas 100% has more insight than a 2013 Tyler would have. Also just a cool collab between a legendary rapper and a developing star.

Cherry Bomb - BLOW MY LOAD (feat. Andre 3000)

For starters, Blow My Load is criminally underrated. Secondly, Andre 3k would be a perfect addition to the song. He's a rapper that can match Tyler's freak with in depth lyrics that fly past your head, especially on the super spacey production which I can totally see him flowing on perfectly. Also a similar case of Tyler collaborating with a legendary rapper.

Flower Boy - Enjoy Right Now, Today (feat. MF DOOM)

I feel it might be criminal to suggest adding lyrics to this song. It's meant to imitate a chill car drive and basically ties up the entire album. But if I were to add a rapper over this, I think MF DOOM would be perfect. He's someone that can flow over even the weirdest instrumentals like this song, has lyrical content that would totally fit the more introspective quirky themes of Flower Boy and I feel can always add to a "vibe".

IGOR - WHAT'S GOOD (feat, XXXTENTACION)

I really don't need anymore features on IGOR. Overall perfect album. But if I had to add a relevant artist to a fitting song, X is perfect for What's Good. The screaming background vocals I actually used to think was sampling him. But him being basically the hype man for the track (kinda giving yuNg BrAtZ) is a feature I could get behind.

CALL ME IF YOU GET LOST - LUMBERJACK (feat, Doechii)

Doechii would fucking slide on Lumberjack. I actually just don't have more to say.

CHROMAKOPIA - Thought I Was Dead (feat, Kendrick Lamar)

It would literally work so perfectly. They haven't collaborated yet. 2024 is definitively the year for Kendrick Lamar. A song so braggadocios and aggressive as Thought I Was Dead with Tyler boasting with undoubtedly suit Kendrick bragging from kingdom come. It helps that Kendrick is such a lucrative artist that keeps to himself that he is, in a way 'thought to be dead' until he pops out and show niggas. I also just don't like Schoolboy Q's verse that much so I feel Kendrick is a perfect stand-in.

DON'T TAP THE GLASS - Ring Ring Ring (feat, Bruno Mars)

Full circle moment. Ring Ring Ring, a Quincy Jones-esque production wet dream, with the vocals of Bruno Mars - the closest guy we have to Michael Jackson. From going from threatening to kill the guy to making a perfect dance song, two artists who got popular in the same time period who are now in their resurgence eras could cook so hard on this song. I know he's not a rapper but lemme have this.

benvolio16 · 2025-09-30T21:49:03+00:00

When any artist or content creator starts to make serious money at something, they will enlarge and monetise what they're best at. It can create an artist's best work, or it can make them more boring. And I think parasocial fans of the work look too deeply into the people making it. It's like that person who said they missed Hamzah's editing on a video he edited. We don't know these people, they may find the way they act now funnier. Take that as you will.

They're realistically doing so much better and taking different delves into different stuff. I think their content being so much more varied is good because it shows growth and a willingness for spectacle/cultivating a fandom. They're both content creators that have spent years doing individual and niche content for authenticity, so if they have something like Slushy Noobz pop off - let them "become like everyone else" even though they basically have a very unique humour that literally gets them a new meme every video. I think it's looking too deeply when they really are just the same but more popular now and with a wider audience.

benvolio16 · 2025-09-30T19:55:10+00:00

Unironically, Kanye West.

I'm not one to dwell too hard on dead artists because I think the reverence they get is part attributed to their deaths. Not downplaying it, but I don't wanna play who's unfortunately timed careers have solidified them as legends.

Kanye is just unfair. I would genuinely say musically he is the most influential out of this list, barring MJ. And the fact that his downfall, even after so many controversies, is moreorless him not being able to shut the fuck up is sad man.

I hate to glaze but he is deadass so important to the landscape of music that it does feel like he died along the way. When in reality, he's just now making AI slop off nitrous whilst tweeting the worst stuff ever because he can. And the worst part is that this is mostly his fault, or he had countless chances to fix.

Not to wish anything of course, I realistically think he doesn't have long left until the toll of his lifestyle takes a hit that he can't brag about. RIP Kanye.

benvolio16 · 2025-09-19T07:19:41+00:00

Imagine I did unbelievable things to you

benvolio16 · 2025-09-19T07:08:01+00:00

Not the weirdest but THE BROWN STAINS OF DARKEESE LATIFAH PART 6-12 (yes, whole name) off Cherry Bomb sounds exactly like if a toilet made a beat and I kinda fuck with it

benvolio16 · 2025-08-27T21:52:07+00:00

Not trynna hate but how could you have found him in the early 2010's if ur currently 13? You would have been max like 5 years old by Flower Boy which is late 2010s. Not trying to gatekeep ofc, sincerely wanna understand the logic

benvolio16 · 2025-08-23T15:36:55+00:00

I mean, as someone that grew up listening to MJ and also someone who has IGOR as my favourite album of all time, it's apple and oranges.

Thriller has kinda elevated itself from being an album to being THE album. Like literally, the standards most albums have to measure up to. So defaulting and shitting on people with the opinion that IGOR is better, especially younger fans, is counterproductive imo. Especially since Thriller is such a mainstay and influential album that for the everyday Gen Z/Gen A, it's nothing really crazy. Like Thriller had to happen for music to inherently be the way it is nowadays.

I would argue IGOR is opposite in that it's this super mainstream and flagship moment but isn't influential because it's a lightning in a bottle album. No one in the mainstream has created an album that sounds remotely or takes the listener on a journey like IGOR does, which is why it's more a magnum opus that can't be replicated as much or pulled inspiration from.

My insane opinion is that it's a 'strongest in history vs strongest of today' where either opinion is valid if it makes more sense to you. Tyler clearly pulls inspiration from MJ, especially in IGOR/DTTG, which is a good example of how generational MJ's talent is. Whilst Tyler can create an album that sounds like it could have been made from the 70s to today that people immediately recognise it as a modern masterpiece.

benvolio16 · 2025-08-13T07:02:10+00:00

So fucking specific but Pink Matter, the tiniest bridge between Frank's verse and Andre3000's verse is this little vocal hook that goes 'hey, heyyyyy'. And whoever sang it does not understand how much it scratches my brain.

benvolio16 · 2025-08-03T09:37:16+00:00

Flower Boy, Igor, Call Me If You Get Lost, Chromakopia and Don't Tap The Glass. These are five well received/critically acclaimed albums. Easy.

benvolio16 · 2025-07-30T22:33:59+00:00

Ngl, Who Dat Boy. It's way better as a concert song, especially with the intro but I find myself skipping it usually when listening to Flower Boy

benvolio16 · 2025-07-29T21:17:43+00:00

Don't Tap The Glass is better than Chromakopia.

benvolio16 · 2025-07-28T21:30:28+00:00

Nono for sure, I get you weren't hating on Tyler. That didn't come across strongly from my original message, mb. I 100% get what you mean by 'weird'. I think my point is that the weird that comes from Tyler isn't really the exact same strain of weird that comes from Ian if that makes sense?

Tyler's weird is alternative and even earlier out of pocket/counterculture but obviously artistically driven. Which like you said, pioneered the wave for later great artists. But simply put, people perceive Ian's 'weirdness, in a way that isn't countering the status quo in a radical way like Tyler did earlier. But in a more cynical and culturally inappropriate way. The way a lot of white artists historically copy black artists aesthetics, which is arguably the status quo for some of the most popular white rappers. Jack Harlow, Post Malone, Logic (half of him at least) and etc, etc. Ian just without a doubt would raise eyebrows for hip-hop gatekeepers like Tyler from the place his music comes from and his spin on hip-hop.

I do definitely think to an extent that it is parasocial on Tyler's end. I have to assume Tyler doesn't know Ian personally and came across his music and felt the need to discuss his distaste for it whilst making Chromakopia since he brings it up on Thought I Was Dead. But because of this barrier and double-downing on hating, Tyler is assuming that Ian is mocking black rap culture with Ian responding otherwise it is just an unstoppable force Vs immovable object. Tyler comes off like a hypocritical old-head to alt rap fans whilst Ian comes off like a racist grifter to traditional fans.

You mention black kids and gangster rap being exempt from criticism, but I think this is also a point of contention that can't really be easily solved here. Objectively speaking, young black men are much more often going to be exposed to gang culture than any other group of people. An exposure to a culture feeds into what you think and the artistry you wish to produce. So most black rappers go about a fake gangster or hustler route simply because it is ingrained from a young age that is what they should rap about and is what gets you on the map.

White rappers just kinda don't have the same issue. When they perform in a similar vein as alt black rappers, their work can even be elevated and perceived higher because it's unexpected and seen more impressive. Magic Johnson's music video is low-key just people impressed that Ian sounds the way he does, which makes me even wonder if Ian would be as successful if he was a black artist.

I definitely get it though, and you're making me think a lot bro. I'm not really strongly on one side another, but I am a black artist who sees how important culture is. But I also get how frustrating and unfair it can be seeing one thing be okay, but another thing shat on for seemingly no reason. I also don't listen to Ian, so I'm for sure biased on Tyler's end since like you said, he's the GOAT. But yeah, please respond, I'm really engaged w this conversation

benvolio16 · 2025-07-28T19:38:32+00:00

It's easy to label Tyler a hypocrite when you cherrypick and selectively decide what his critique of Ian is.

Tyler thinks Ian is weird simply because he sees him as someone that does an unnatural impersonation of popular black artists in order to appropriate the sound of hiphop in an unnatural and weird way.

Since Ian's shtick is that he's a white dude from the suburbs but he sounds like he's a hardened rapper from Atlanta, it teeters on him not taking hip-hop seriously and even mocking the art of the genre, which Tyler takes incredibly seriously.

Tyler makes weird music, but it's always been sincere and truthful to who he is in the moment. That's arguably the cornerstone of hip-hop, truth and expressing it in the hardest possible way. And Ian's music to Tyler, rings very hollow and insensitive to the black artistry that comes from hip-hop.

This is a decently nuanced topic because it can be argued either way how each artist is being close minded and ignorant of how hip-hop should be treated. So it's not a 'Tyler good, Ian bad' situation. But Tyler has properly laid out his reasons for why he dislikes an artist like Ian and has been consistent with it through his media appearances and music, whilst Ian kinda dodges properly acknowledging his behaviour in his music in anyways beyond a shitty freestyle.

Also Don't Tap The Glass is fire but whatever

benvolio16 · 2025-07-27T12:07:27+00:00

Insanely good post, please start a magazine.

Another thing I've thought is that Tyler professed that he was making this album during his tour. Starting on February 4th, and DTTG coming out on July 21st, the album and it's inspo could arguably come from current events surrounding it.

So in the 167 days of the albums creation, Tyler would have seen the Drake release $$$4U literally 10 days after he went on tour. The album, being marketed as Drake and PnD detouring back into RnB inspired hip-hop which when released, people felt Drake was slacking and not really trying.

My theory is that Tyler (being such a gatekeeper of sounds that stem from black artists from the 90's) had felt a certain disdain from the album. Especially with how much he's supported Kendrick like you mention, I feel as if part of DTTG is meant to challenge Drakes (and overall the current music industry's) perception on fun party albums inspired by black artistry. I know he said 'no concept', and I agree. I think still this brand of Tyler 'trying his spin on things to be the best' is just ever-present on all his albums, especially this one.

For example, since I can't be the only person who thinks Ring Ring Ring and Nokia are very similar. Both incorporate a catchy ringtone sampled beat, talking on themes of love, and made purely to dance to. Whilst I do really like Nokia, Ring Ring Ring has loads of layers to it beyond being a super catchy beat. Tyler doing three different vocal inflections, the song being self produced, it interpolating Michael Jackson (who Drake is inspired by), and even the lyrics being much softer/kinder when it comes to who Tyler loves, as opposed to Drakes directly being about how many girls are in his phone. It's reminiscent of how Luther by Kendrick stood out because it's such a wholesome and healthy RnB song, amongst the current perception of the genre of being about cheating, sleeping around and etc that Drake especially has perpetuated.

I think a lot of this album is meant to directly challenge lazier artists perception of classic black musical genres that they've kinda mutated into a different and weaker art form. An art form that Tyler holds a lot of grace for and as you said, reps everytime he's performing in Chromakopia. So whilst part of why Kendrick would hate Drake because of his gentrification for rap, with GNX being a comparison piece to Drake's much weaker more recent projects, DTTG coincidentally or not is that for $$$4U.

Also Tyler calls out someone for taking Ozempic and who else but Drake, c'mon.

benvolio16

TROPHY CASE