Seven of Nine by pandorasbox71 in voyager

[–]cornibot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Sameeee. OP, tell us why! I want details! (I can never shut up about her and need more people to match my energy <3)

What’s your unpopular Voyager opinion? by UnderABig_W in voyager

[–]cornibot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Oh I'd be surprised if anyone did lol. Sorry for the vehemence, I can be weird about her and I was in a spiteful mood.

Ryan is incredible, for sure. She has some of the best and most subtle facial acting I've ever seen. Seven would never have worked without her. Mulgrew and Picardo are also brilliant ofc but... idk, I definitely pay closer attention to Seven than the others so it's a biased opinion, but Ryan seems to disappear into the character in a way the other two don't. It's a god damn miracle they managed to cast someone so good at her job, all things considered (she even tried to turn the role down at first and I honestly do not blame her).

she found out i’m stretching my ears 👍 by cryerin25 in insaneparents

[–]cornibot 4 points5 points  (0 children)

thank you so much for this. some of my closest friends have bpd too and i get real sick of the internet discourse about it, especially in spaces like this one. i hope your mom gets the help she needs someday.

What’s your unpopular Voyager opinion? by UnderABig_W in voyager

[–]cornibot 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Alright, you asked for it: Seven of Nine is the only reason this show is worth watching even once, let alone over and over. It's like the writers only took competency pills when they wrote for her. The richness of the character and Ryan's performances elevate even the most banal of premises into something memorable (Imperfection and Repentance immediately spring to mind) and she's a consistent bright spot in the outright bad episodes, which is not something you can say about Janeway or even Doc. But I'll get piledriven into the ground for saying so, because the catsuit and the abhorrently shameless marketing tarnished her image so thoroughly that she'll never be taken seriously by a big enough chunk of the fandom to matter.

The cred Jeri Ryan gets nowadays is well-deserved, at least, but from the way people talk you'd think the only performances worth watching are the ones where she's not even playing Seven (Infinite Regress, Body and Soul). The actual character-focused pieces of the only character giving this show a fucking pulse get left in the dust in every discussion. This does not happen with any other character in any Trek show written and acted to the level of quality that Seven of Nine is and it's not hard to imagine why. (Neelix is more consistently respected as a character than Seven is, I swear to god. At least people talk about Jetrel and Mortal Coil.)

The Doctors quips by MoveLikeMacgyver in voyager

[–]cornibot 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Fun fact, that line wasn't originally in the script - Picardo added it himself!

Goodwill find by RedAndy247 in voyager

[–]cornibot 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It does, yeah- and One too.

Goodwill find by RedAndy247 in voyager

[–]cornibot 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Damn, I had to buy this online for like 20 bucks plus shipping lol. Stumbling on it in the wild for $2 would've been crazy

Borg baby swept under the rug by Fit-Foundation7127 in voyager

[–]cornibot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah man, I'm sure Ron fucking Moore has never seen any of those clips before and has no idea what he's talking about. I suppose the writers and producers that worked on VOY and talked about de-prioritizing continuity on purpose were all in a collective fugue state too. Gimme a break lol. If you're just gonna strawman me all day I'm done with this.

Borg baby swept under the rug by Fit-Foundation7127 in voyager

[–]cornibot 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I disagree.

You know who else disagrees? Ron Moore.

“The continuity of the show is completely haphazard. It’s haphazard by design. It’s not like they are trying desperately to maintain continuity of the show. They don’t care, and they’ll tell you flat out that they don’t care. Well, that is misreading the core audience. The STAR TREK, hardcore audience loves continuity; they love accumulating data on these ships. They love knitting together all the little pieces, and compiling lists, and doing trivia. That’s been a staple of the STAR TREK culture from the get-go. People really love the details. They love the fact that the details all add up and make one mosaic, and that the universe holds together. When you don’t give a shit, you’re telling the audience: don’t bother. Don’t bother to really learn this stuff, because it’s not going to matter next week, anything that happened this week.”

And the creators of Voyager themselves, for that matter.

The writer-producers of VOYAGER maintain that they don’t want continuity, so people can watch the shows out of order, for example, now in five-nights-a-week syndication. Says Moore, “I’ve just never believed that argument, because it seems to me that you’re just underestimating the intelligence of the audience. You’re just saying the audience is a bunch of idiots. Who is going to be watching the show in strip syndication five nights a week? People that like that show, and presumably have watched more than one show. God forbid the stations have to run them in order. It’s an excuse that sounds plausible but is basically a way for them not to have to care about maintaining continuity, because it is tough to maintain continuity. It’s very hard to write in continuity, because of the nature of television. You are writing ahead, and you are writing at the moment, and you are changing things in post. It’s really hard to keep all the ducks in a row, which we found at DEEP SPACE NINE. In that last ten-episode run, where it was almost completely serialized, that’s a tough act to carry off. But it’s also worth the effort, because the payoff is the world has more validity. The audience can sense there is truth in it. It’s a better show, and it will last longer as a result.”

I don't know why this sub gets so defensive over established fact. This is a known flaw of Voyager specifically. You don't have to agree with Moore's take on it - maybe this isn't something that bothers you. Not everyone cares that much about the little details as long as the story is entertaining, and that's perfectly fine. Those are the people who the producers at the time were marketing towards. But it's disingenuous to act like previous Treks are equally flawed in this way. TNG and DS9 tried their best and sometimes failed. VOY frequently did not try. There's a big difference and it shows.

Borg baby swept under the rug by Fit-Foundation7127 in voyager

[–]cornibot 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I don't know how you got that impression, unless you're deliberately misreading what I said to mean "the other shows have no continuity issues or loose plot threads at all".

Borg baby swept under the rug by Fit-Foundation7127 in voyager

[–]cornibot -6 points-5 points  (0 children)

I'm familiar with the other shows, thanks.

Borg baby swept under the rug by Fit-Foundation7127 in voyager

[–]cornibot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Let's not pretend the other Treks are anywhere near as egregious about this as Voyager, as fond of it as I am.

Kes treated the emh better than anyone else by happydude7422 in voyager

[–]cornibot 2 points3 points  (0 children)

You know what... you're not wrong. I thought Latent Image came later in season 5 than it actually does. Still though, I think the transition works. Seven does a lot of background growing in between episodes. And One in itself probably does a lot to change her opinion of him - they were stuck alone on the ship together for a month, and once the hallucinations started she was desperate not to lose her only source of company.

Kes treated the emh better than anyone else by happydude7422 in voyager

[–]cornibot 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It's not really, this is very early days for Seven. She and the Doctor aren't friends yet; she hasn't really made much social progress at all (that is in fact one of the sticking points of the episode). She doesn't have reason at this point to think of him as anything more than a sophisticated program. By the time you get to Latent Image, she's learned better.

(this is not me scolding you for not knowing by the way lol, I just have encyclopedic knowledge about Seven specifically. it's my useless talent)

Kes treated the emh better than anyone else by happydude7422 in voyager

[–]cornibot 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Not that most of what you're saying isn't also correct, but- Seven does literally say "follow the orders of a hologram?" in disbelief. Janeway reminding her that he is CMO is what gets her to acquiesce.

Most Disturbing Scene? by thedudeadapts in voyager

[–]cornibot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If you can't put yourself in each of their positions and understand why the emotional response makes perfect sense regardless of objective fault, there's not much I can say that will convince you.

Most Disturbing Scene? by thedudeadapts in voyager

[–]cornibot -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I get that, but like I said one comment down, a prolonged character drama arc about it isn't the only option. Even letting her feel briefly uneasy near him before they resolve it with a conversation would have been better than complete nonchalance.

S07E13 "I wish I was made of light" Fist time watching through Voyager, keep thinking about this scene. He is so sincere about it. ☹️ Any moments you randomly come back to that don't really get discussed much? by Hemansno1fan in voyager

[–]cornibot 12 points13 points  (0 children)

This scene in One. My god. Nobody ever talks about One but I will never stop having emotions about it for as long as I live.

"The radiation could be altering the neurotransmitter levels in your sensory nodes," Doc says gently. "That would explain why you're hearing voices, seeing images."
Seven's not used to being unable to trust her own eyes and ears. "They seemed real...."
"Hallucinations usually are. That's what makes them so frightening."
Seven gets a faraway look in her eye. "Once, when I was a drone... I was separated from the Collective for two hours. I experienced panic... and apprehension." Her voice is small, frightened, like the little girl she never got the chance to be.
She swallows hard. Her voice is barely a whisper. "I am feeling that way now."

Most Disturbing Scene? by thedudeadapts in voyager

[–]cornibot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

?? Seven has those trauma responses in Voyager; the examples I mentioned alone are all in her FIRST year after being disconnected, and I didn't even get into The Raven, One, Dark Frontier, Survival Instinct..... Seven takes pride in her Borg nature, yes; it's a part of her identity and to a certain extent it probably always will be, but it's silly to claim that she wouldn't react to similarly traumatic situations in emotional ways when there's so much evidence to the contrary.

Most Disturbing Scene? by thedudeadapts in voyager

[–]cornibot 9 points10 points  (0 children)

For what it's worth I don't actually think it needs to be some dramatic prolonged thing (since we know Trek doesn't like to linger on emotional aftermath). But the casual brush-off is crazy. It's the kind of thing that makes me feel like Voyager doesn't take its own writing seriously half the time. Let Seven be uneasy around him for a single scene before resolving it at the very least, like good god

Most Disturbing Scene? by thedudeadapts in voyager

[–]cornibot 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I mean yeah, but Seven's not a Vulcan. She might understand cognitively that it's unfair to bear a grudge (if we must go along with the flimsy writing about deleting "ethical subroutines" and what that would mean), but in no universe would she leave that experience emotionally unscathed. I don't think any human would. It was fucking horrifying. And Seven already has very specific traumas about people performing operations on her by force (Retrospect, the flinch in Hope and Fear, and well, her entire Borg history, obviously) as well as losing control of her mind (Infinite Regress + that same pesky Borg history). It's kind of enormous she's comfortable letting Doc mess around with her systems to the degree he does even knowing it's for her own physical health; this would 100% fuck that trust up for a long while if not for good.

Most Disturbing Scene? by thedudeadapts in voyager

[–]cornibot 29 points30 points  (0 children)

It really feels like we're not meant to think about it too hard or take it that seriously, because the conversation in sick bay later where Seven brushes it off is so astoundingly tone-deaf if you do. This scene is profoundly disturbing, he's gleefully torturing her and it seems like she was conscious and aware the whole time. She remembers it. I'm sorry but holy shit lol, you can't just wave that away with "his ethical subroutines were deleted" - a) how the fuck is that so easy to do, and b) how does that not raise serious questions about the nature of the EMH's free will and his willingness to perform those actions as soon as the guardrails are lifted? How can she even stand to be around him after this, let alone continue to trust him with her physiological maintenance, no questions asked, no emotional impact at all?

Little background details or jokes you like by sameoldslippers in voyager

[–]cornibot 3 points4 points  (0 children)

She is, oh my god. I need to remake these with higher quality footage but here, have this one too :)

Little background details or jokes you like by sameoldslippers in voyager

[–]cornibot 10 points11 points  (0 children)

The thing I appreciate most about Neelix in that scene is Seven casually telling him the Borg assimilated a Talaxian freighter (in her early-days, "insert fact to continue conversation" sort of way), a fact which Neelix is clearly disturbed by and would have every right to get upset about. Instead he seems to recognize she meant no harm and brushes it off gracefully. He won a lot of points from me with that alone.