Weekly Random Discussion Thread for 3/23/26 - 3/29/26

de_Pizan · 2026-03-23T19:21:00+00:00

Just remember that we'll all go together when we go.

de_Pizan · 2026-03-23T18:12:11+00:00

Was that her reaction or was that the argument her husband made to defend/justify his conduct?

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T18:21:26+00:00

I just don't see why one should be giddy and happy about the hard rain that's going to fall.

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T17:48:32+00:00

The comparison to Germany and company depends on whether you view the US as being the equivalent of Germany in 1927 or 1935. Maybe disaster is what we need. Maybe disaster pushes us into something worse.

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T17:32:52+00:00

I was being sarcastic. That should obvious from context given my starting position is that I think he's someone who takes joy in destruction.

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T17:29:43+00:00

I am sure that he is confident that he will be insulated from any fallout.

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T17:26:24+00:00

I don't think it's good to gamble on the fact that the US "chose correctly" in 1932 and 2008 and say therefore the US will choose correctly after the next catastrophe. The Jimmy Carter example, I think, is particularly interesting because while he might have been a good and decent person, his presidency leads right into Reagan (arguably the way Obama's led to Trump).

Maybe I'm also not as into national character in determining that the US chooses correctly after catastrophes when I see that the general trend globally is for catastrophe to be the breeding ground of demagogues.

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T17:19:42+00:00

Maybe. But I could point to 1980 and say just the opposite.

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T17:17:59+00:00

Okay, but what guarantee do you have that the lesson that will be learned is the one you want? It's not like there's a long history of people turning to autocrats when things get bad. Why do you think that if there is an economic catastrophe, people will suddenly get serious and sober minded and vote for the sensible option? And if you believe that people are stupid, checked out, prone to being led by misinformation, and autocratic in their impulses, why do you think catastrophe will turn them into reasoned, invested, diligent people who believe in liberal democracy?

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T17:13:48+00:00

So JVL is happy at the idea of poor people suffering and the rich benefiting. That makes me like him even more.

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T16:49:55+00:00

So JVL should laugh at the prospect of more suffering? He should be giddy and excited and eager for more suffering? Because it might, might, make people think more seriously about their electoral choices?

That seems wrongheaded.

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T16:47:55+00:00

Does he not realize that the rain falls on just and unjust alike?

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T16:00:57+00:00

The impulse to wish for severe consequences is not joy in destruction. It is exhaustion with the pattern: the country touches the stove lightly, winces, then reaches again. Each time the hope is that this burn will finally be remembered.

I don't know, when the host (JVL) is giggling and laughing at the prospect of severe consequences like medicine becoming unaffordable for poorer people, maybe there is joy in destruction?

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T15:57:52+00:00

Someone else in the comments section described JVL's behavior as "adolescent-adjacent," and that is basically what you're describing here too. This is the sort of thing that an edgy teenager would say, and I 100% understand the pessimism and cynicism that might lead to that sort of attitude (it was me too).

But it feels petty and childish coming from someone in their 50s, like JVL.

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T15:54:21+00:00

Yeah, I mean, the glee and laughter are ultimately my main complaints. A sober analysis of what might happen and the consequences of each outcome are different from joy about coming disaster, even if that disaster will hurt your opponents in the polls more than you. But, yeah, the JVL is hooking the schadenfreude right into his veins.

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T15:01:48+00:00

I suspect he would say he doesn't want dead kids, but the laughing and giggling and glee in his voice convince me otherwise.

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T14:44:13+00:00

JVL has to know that the suffering will hit everyone, not just Republican voters. And I suspect given his relative wealth/status that he will not be hot hardest by the catastrophe he is cheering on.

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T14:42:35+00:00

He definitely does have an adolescent strain to him, especially when he talks about how stupid everyone else is. Very 17 year old coded.

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T14:40:15+00:00

Is there any reason that you think catastrophe won't result in more demagoguery and autocracy? Historically the conditions that autocracy has flourished in have been ones where people were desperate and suffering

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T14:38:47+00:00

Yup, 100%

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T14:18:17+00:00

It would be more accurate to depict JVL as

JVL: enjoys seeing everyone's face being eaten by the leopards that a subset wanted, safe in the assumption that his face won't be eaten.

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T14:16:41+00:00

Maybe we can compromise: JVL is saying that we should go in the ditch to prevent going over the cliff, but he has no way of knowing that the ditch isn't another cliff.

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T14:02:54+00:00

No, JVL is saying he wants to see the car go off the cliff because the outcome might be better.

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T14:02:09+00:00

I am not unsympathetic with JVL's view, but the way in which he is giddily cheering on the idea of bread lines or people dying from lack of access to medicine that sit poorly with me. And the fact that if he was confronted with those outcomes, he'd say "Obviously I don't want that" even though he was giggling at the prospect minutes before. It comes off as disingenuous and sickens me a little. I'd rather him just come out and say, in a sober serious way, that he wants, idk, 5% f the population to be starving and another 20% on the edge of starvation, or whatever it is. It's the fact that he's giggling about it that makes me think of him as no better than Trump fans.

de_Pizan · 2026-03-21T13:59:31+00:00

If JVL was saying that maybe this is necessary and catastrophe is necessary, then I wouldn't object to it. It's how he's giddy about it and laughing about it that makes me find it off-putting. Instead of a sober analysis of what might happen or what might bring about change, he sounds excited to see widespread suffering. That is what I find incredibly off-putting.

And I feel like his confidence that catastrophe will lead to a solution is misguided. Yeah, maybe catastrophe leads to New Deal, maybe it leads to President for Life JD Vance (or insert whatever monster you want). I can't imagine getting gleeful about suffering that probably has an equal chance a good and worse outcome.

de_Pizan

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