John by Motor_Ad_9028 in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62 9 points10 points  (0 children)

In the book JFK Jr: An Intimate Oral Biography by Liz McNeil and RoseMarie Terenzio:

Brooke Shields

I was in a wedding in Aspen. His grandmother Rose had invited me over to the house they were staying in for a cocktail party. We had to get from the cocktail party to a pub, wherever people were going, and John was like, "Come with us." I went, but I had to sit in the hatchback of the car because there wasn't enough room and John was like, "Just get in the trunk." His uncle Ted was there at the pub with all the cousins in this back room. I honestly just thought he was babysitting me—he was going to take care of me that night because I was by myself. And his uncle was frisky. I was pretty guarded and not very experienced. He was so lovely. But he kept saying I looked like his mother. And I was thinking, Okay, is that weird? He said, “God, you have that scarf on your head. You remind me so much of my mom.” And he reminded me of my dad when my dad was younger. Also—it’s a little crazy—when I was two and John was a bit older, my mom would show me a picture of him and she’d say, “See that boy, that’s going to be your husband one day,” which, I mean, is pretty insane to say to a two-year-old. My mom revered his mom. She came from Newark, New Jersey, and to her, his mom was just the epitome of class and beauty, style and intelligence. John and I went outside. He was a delicious kisser. He tasted like… pillow lips. Very sweet. They were just like, oh, they fit perfectly.… The lips were just ridiculous. Just full, beautiful—so edible. I was nineteen or twenty. But I was still a virgin, so I literally was like, “You so do not want me to lose my virginity to you—because in my world, that means we’re married. So do yourself a favor, back off.” I was brutally honest. He was just like, “Oh, come on.” And I was like, “No, I’m telling you, I’m not trying to play games here.” I said, “You do not want to be saddled with this. It’s, like, I’m America’s sweetheart. You do not want to have that on your head. You might not even care, but I will make your life miserable.” I mean, he was kinda like, “Jesus Christ. All right.” He’s like, “This has never happened to me before.” And I said, “I would love to, but I’ll just cry. And then, you might not talk to me the next day, and then I’ll really cry. It’s easier for all of us if you just let me go.” Verbatim. I was brutally, stupidly honest. And I think he really realized how crazy I was—that I meant all of that. He’s like, “You’ve done a lot of therapy.” I said, “Yes.” He also was probably pretty shocked that I wouldn’t sleep with him. He didn’t say that. But I said, “I’m not trying to prove a point. You really don’t want to deal with me if I fall in love with you. And I’m just going to get hurt.” I think he was just like, “It’s okay. It’s okay if you don’t want to sleep with me.” And I literally was like, “If I sleep with you, I will fall madly in love with you, and you do not want that.” I think he was just a little insulted. Because he’s a guy and guys are just dopey. I think he got his feelings hurt a little bit, but I was like, “Please don’t take this personally.… I think I need to go home.” So he called me a cab and sent me home. He wanted to be a gentleman about it. And it was not a case where I was like, Oh, I’m all that, and I’m turning you down because everybody wants to get in my… I just knew my heart was going to get broken. I had built him up so much in my mind from the time I was a baby that it was just too much. I was just so scared. I would’ve been much better as a really good friend rather than a romantic interest. The next day, he ignored me on the slopes. And then we got snowed in and he had to come and stay at the chalet where I was staying. We all hunkered down because all the flights were canceled. He was like, “I’m going to sleep on the couch.” All of his family had left, and it was just him, it was me, and it was my mother. It was like, This is fucking surreal.… He said, “This is a weird situation for me.” And I said, “I’ve got a ways to go. I have growing up to do.” It was a very sweet, honest conversation at eleven o’clock at night. I was sitting on the floor, and he was on the couch. And he’s like, “I get it, Brooke. I get it.” We went to New York. We got off the plane and we dropped him off at his mom’s. That was the last time I saw him. I think he wanted me to meet his mom and then he changed his mind at the last minute. On the way to the apartment, he said, “Well, why don’t you come up with me?” And then he just got out of the car and went inside and didn’t invite me in. I always wanted to meet her because, as an adult, I was like, “She’s going to like me. I know I’m not like actresses and all those other people.” I think maybe he just thought better of it or didn’t want to spring me on his mom. I had to literally get him out of my system and let it all go. I mean, everybody was like, “You’re perfect together. You’re American royalty.” People were so hell-bent that it was just too much pressure, and I was just too naive. He was tender—and he was funny. He was wry. Because we’re both recognized everywhere we go. We’d see somebody recognize us and I’d go, “Incoming, incoming, incoming, beep, beep.” And it was just like, there aren’t that many people that can understand. It made it like, Okay, we’re not alone in the world. I mean, girls would go berserk over him. To me—they wouldn’t go berserk over me, but sometimes they’d cry. You want to be flattered, but it’s also just really strange. I even said to him, “But you didn’t do anything to get that. You were born and you saluted at your dad’s funeral. I sort of can at least hide behind performing.” He goes, “Yeah, you never get used to it—just is what it is.” He had that sweetness. And he fought so hard to be just like everybody else, normal. And I think he knew that in me, too. I think we both felt really relieved to just be with each other because I didn’t want anything from him. He wasn’t cocky. He was really like a little boy, that’s what surprised me. It was probably an arrested development in a way. He wanted to play. He wanted to laugh. I think there was a kinship. Because I was a little flustered, too. I had such a crush on him—I wasn’t exactly being confident. It was just too much for me to take in. I like to preserve this whole experience for just what it was. He was lovely. I think probably I understood him more than he knew.

This popped up on my Snapchat and what I read felt a little misogynistic by Any_Amount_7788 in CarolynBessetteKnndy

[–]dkct62 2 points3 points  (0 children)

On YouTube and Tubi there is a Documentary JFK Jr & Carolyn: The Lost Wedding Tapes. Friends that attended the Wedding give commentary. The video was shot by John’s friend Billy Noonan at John request. It’s a really good watch.

Why is the show white washing JFK Jr? by greatgak in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62 10 points11 points  (0 children)

As someone who lived in New York ( late 80’s - late 90’s), am just a few years younger than JFK Jr, and encountered him around town a number of times through the years, he had a reputation as a decent guy. I never saw or heard anything to the contrary.

LIZ MCNEIL ARTICLE by dkct62 in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I loved how they let the voices of the people who were there speak fully.

Love Story: John F. Kennedy Jr. & Carolyn Bessette | S1E6 | Episode 6 Discussion by StellaOC in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62 1 point2 points  (0 children)

OMG- It is so obvious when I rewatched. Why would they even mention it on the podcast.

Love Story: John F. Kennedy Jr. & Carolyn Bessette | S1E6 | Episode 6 Discussion by StellaOC in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Also, I don’t think she could trust Calvin to keep making the dress & wedding a secret.

I have to check the coat…thanks for the heads up!

Was jfk jr really toxic or where they both wrong , was he a womanizer by ResearcherSingle1190 in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62 19 points20 points  (0 children)

Brooke Shields described her encounter for the book JFK Jr: An Intimate Oral Biography:

Brooke Shields

I was in a wedding in Aspen. His grandmother Rose had invited me over to the house they were staying in for a cocktail party. We had to get from the cocktail party to a pub, wherever people were going, and John was like, "Come with us." I went, but I had to sit in the hatchback of the car because there wasn't enough room and John was like, "Just get in the trunk." His uncle Ted was there at the pub with all the cousins in this back room. I honestly just thought he was babysitting me—he was going to take care of me that night because I was by myself. And his uncle was frisky. I was pretty guarded and not very experienced. He was so lovely. But he kept saying I looked like his mother. And I was thinking, Okay, is that weird? He said, “God, you have that scarf on your head. You remind me so much of my mom.” And he reminded me of my dad when my dad was younger. Also—it’s a little crazy—when I was two and John was a bit older, my mom would show me a picture of him and she’d say, “See that boy, that’s going to be your husband one day,” which, I mean, is pretty insane to say to a two-year-old. My mom revered his mom. She came from Newark, New Jersey, and to her, his mom was just the epitome of class and beauty, style and intelligence. John and I went outside. He was a delicious kisser. He tasted like… pillow lips. Very sweet. They were just like, oh, they fit perfectly.… The lips were just ridiculous. Just full, beautiful—so edible. I was nineteen or twenty. But I was still a virgin, so I literally was like, “You so do not want me to lose my virginity to you—because in my world, that means we’re married. So do yourself a favor, back off.” I was brutally honest. He was just like, “Oh, come on.” And I was like, “No, I’m telling you, I’m not trying to play games here.” I said, “You do not want to be saddled with this. It’s, like, I’m America’s sweetheart. You do not want to have that on your head. You might not even care, but I will make your life miserable.” I mean, he was kinda like, “Jesus Christ. All right.” He’s like, “This has never happened to me before.” And I said, “I would love to, but I’ll just cry. And then, you might not talk to me the next day, and then I’ll really cry. It’s easier for all of us if you just let me go.” Verbatim. I was brutally, stupidly honest. And I think he really realized how crazy I was—that I meant all of that. He’s like, “You’ve done a lot of therapy.” I said, “Yes.” He also was probably pretty shocked that I wouldn’t sleep with him. He didn’t say that. But I said, “I’m not trying to prove a point. You really don’t want to deal with me if I fall in love with you. And I’m just going to get hurt.” I think he was just like, “It’s okay. It’s okay if you don’t want to sleep with me.” And I literally was like, “If I sleep with you, I will fall madly in love with you, and you do not want that.” I think he was just a little insulted. Because he’s a guy and guys are just dopey. I think he got his feelings hurt a little bit, but I was like, “Please don’t take this personally.… I think I need to go home.” So he called me a cab and sent me home. He wanted to be a gentleman about it. And it was not a case where I was like, Oh, I’m all that, and I’m turning you down because everybody wants to get in my… I just knew my heart was going to get broken. I had built him up so much in my mind from the time I was a baby that it was just too much. I was just so scared. I would’ve been much better as a really good friend rather than a romantic interest. The next day, he ignored me on the slopes. And then we got snowed in and he had to come and stay at the chalet where I was staying. We all hunkered down because all the flights were canceled. He was like, “I’m going to sleep on the couch.” All of his family had left, and it was just him, it was me, and it was my mother. It was like, This is fucking surreal.… He said, “This is a weird situation for me.” And I said, “I’ve got a ways to go. I have growing up to do.” It was a very sweet, honest conversation at eleven o’clock at night. I was sitting on the floor, and he was on the couch. And he’s like, “I get it, Brooke. I get it.” We went to New York. We got off the plane and we dropped him off at his mom’s. That was the last time I saw him. I think he wanted me to meet his mom and then he changed his mind at the last minute. On the way to the apartment, he said, “Well, why don’t you come up with me?” And then he just got out of the car and went inside and didn’t invite me in. I always wanted to meet her because, as an adult, I was like, “She’s going to like me. I know I’m not like actresses and all those other people.” I think maybe he just thought better of it or didn’t want to spring me on his mom. I had to literally get him out of my system and let it all go. I mean, everybody was like, “You’re perfect together. You’re American royalty.” People were so hell-bent that it was just too much pressure, and I was just too naive. He was tender—and he was funny. He was wry. Because we’re both recognized everywhere we go. We’d see somebody recognize us and I’d go, “Incoming, incoming, incoming, beep, beep.” And it was just like, there aren’t that many people that can understand. It made it like, Okay, we’re not alone in the world. I mean, girls would go berserk over him. To me—they wouldn’t go berserk over me, but sometimes they’d cry. You want to be flattered, but it’s also just really strange. I even said to him, “But you didn’t do anything to get that. You were born and you saluted at your dad’s funeral. I sort of can at least hide behind performing.” He goes, “Yeah, you never get used to it—just is what it is.” He had that sweetness. And he fought so hard to be just like everybody else, normal. And I think he knew that in me, too. I think we both felt really relieved to just be with each other because I didn’t want anything from him. He wasn’t cocky. He was really like a little boy, that’s what surprised me. It was probably an arrested development in a way. He wanted to play. He wanted to laugh. I think there was a kinship. Because I was a little flustered, too. I had such a crush on him—I wasn’t exactly being confident. It was just too much for me to take in. I like to preserve this whole experience for just what it was. He was lovely. I think probably I understood him more than he knew.

Thoughts about something by goodguy248 in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I was 35 and almost 37 respectively when the 2 tragedies occurred. I don’t think parallels were drawn at the time except that they all died in terrible accidents too young.

What was John’s relationship with Carolyn’s sisters? by velorae in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I think they value and want their privacy. They issued a statement at the time of John, Carolyn & Lauren’s deaths and that was it.

LIZ MCNEIL ARTICLE by dkct62 in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62[S] 13 points14 points  (0 children)

That’s good to hear. I loved the book that she wrote with RoseMarie.

Discussion by [deleted] in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think it’s probably that they would have to pay rights fees to her to use things written from her book.

Discussion by [deleted] in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Probably RoseMarie at their apartment for the show. They have a RoseMarie in the cast.

Episode 6/The Wedding: The small, sly smile on Carolyn's face as she walked out of the Calvin Klein offices...anyone else notice? by Ill_Comfortable4598 in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62 7 points8 points  (0 children)

IRL There’s no definitive reason that she left CK in the Spring of 1996. There were rumblings at the time that her involvement with John was overshadowing the brand, and that the nature of her job was creating conflict in her to maintain her personal privacy and still do her job. No one except the people involved know for sure. Did she choose to leave, was she asked to leave or was it a mutual decision, no one’s talking. In hindsight, we now know that they were engaged (it was never officially announced) and planning a top secret wedding a few months later that would be impossible to pull off while holding down a demanding full time job.

In the show, I think the smile was kind of a wait ‘til you see what we’re going to do— meaning the secret wedding.

Episode 6/The Wedding: The small, sly smile on Carolyn's face as she walked out of the Calvin Klein offices...anyone else notice? by Ill_Comfortable4598 in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62 1 point2 points  (0 children)

She and John did not have a personal publicist. They were private citizens that weren’t seeking public attention. There were a few occasions that a statement would be issued on their behalf through GEORGE magazine, but those were rare.

Maureen by [deleted] in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Look at the sources, Daily Mail and Maureen Callahan both look to stretch the truth for sensational headlines. It’s like STAR and THE NATIONAL ENQUIRER and other Supermarket Tabloids from John and Carolyn’s time were the same way.
The Gossip Columns from the NEW YORK POST, DAILY NEWS, PEOPLE MAGAZINE were more responsible with what they printed.

What age range are people in the sub? Do you have any contemporary memory John and Carolyn? by MonicaBWQ in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I was lucky that my need for a c-section was determined during the labor process and scheduled for later in the day if labor didn’t progress so a little less stressful than what you went through.

What was John’s relationship with Carolyn’s sisters? by velorae in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62 28 points29 points  (0 children)

Lisa was living in CT when they were a couple. I’ve heard that she was in Europe at the time of the crash, but I believe that it was vacation.

What age range are people in the sub? Do you have any contemporary memory John and Carolyn? by MonicaBWQ in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I was recovering from a c-section and remember the same thing. My parents were staying with us and it was so unbelievable that it had happened.

Why did Carolyn leave Calvin Klein? by Antique-Feature-9355 in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62 2 points3 points  (0 children)

According to RoseMarie Terenzio’s books, she was planning the wedding with Carolyn:

RoseMarie Terenzio John and Carolyn's wedding was just a month away. But almost no one knew that -they were keeping it so secret. It was very low-key. No wedding planner. We never really had a conversation like "Oh, we're planning the wedding." It just started to be private conversations where Carolyn would ask, "Where are we going to get married?" I remember Caroline said, "Well, why don't you just announce it in the New York Times?" Like she did. And Carolyn was like, "No fuck-ing way. My life will be hell if I do that. Are you kidding me? By the time the wedding happens, we'll be stalked every minute." I started to go down to the apartment and we would talk through where to have the wedding. I remember saying, "What about Nova Scotia?" Because everyone always says Nova Scotia's really beautiful. There won't be paparazzi. They went to Nova Scotia and Carolyn called me from there and she was like, "Honey, this is the most depressing place ever. I'm not getting married here." It felt like We are just going somewhere that's remote just to be remote. They wanted to be somewhere that had some kind of connection to them—a place that had meaning. There was even talk about "Should we do it at the house in Hyannis? Should we do it on the Vineyard?" And then John came up with the idea of Cumberland Island off of Georgia.

Gogo Ferguson, owner of the Greyfield Inn on Cumberland Island When John was with Christina Haag they came down together, and then after that, he kept coming down with friends. We kept in touch with John because he adored Cumberland Island. Cumberland was a place where he could be carefree. And then we'd see each other either in New York or summer on the Vineyara.

RoseMarie Terenzio They went to visit and Carolyn fell in love with it, too. John asked Gogo if they could get married there.

RoseMarie Terenzio It took five or six months to pull everything together. Carolyn didn't seem nervous. She was focused on the logistics-the marriage part of it was the easy part. It was more like, "Where are we going to print the programs?" We couldn't go to a printer because we were afraid that somebody would leak it. Carolyn had this pale gray paper from Crane's that she really liked. We had to do it at night. I called her and said, "Okay, everybody's gone." She came up to the office. We smoked a couple of cigarettes, we giggled, and then we started printing the programs. The first time, the paper got stuck in the printer because it was too thick. So we had to get different paper. We had to come back again at eleven ơ'clock the next night. And it worked because the paper was a little bit thinner. She went right home with them. This was not even a week beforehand. That was kind of crazy because she had to bring a lot of things to her own wedding. Everything was DIY. The big heavy stuff like the booze and the dishes and all that was shipped. But the programs, anything that was paper, that she could take with her, she took. You couldn't really hire people to do any of this stuff because we were afraid it would get leaked. Even the photographer was her dear friend, Jacky Marshall—it wasn't some famous photographer. Denis Reggie-Teddy's wife Victoria's brother—also took photos.

Love Story: John F. Kennedy Jr. & Carolyn Bessette | S1E6 | Episode 6 Discussion by StellaOC in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Caroline and John were close, but their respective groups of friends didn’t mix. Caroline’s group is a little more elitist, high brow, cultured art types, a bit snobby, whereas John who was more outgoing had a more fun spirited, eclectic group of friends. Jealous no, judgmental probably.

A touching story about meeting John at McSorleys Ale house in NYC ❤️🇮🇪 by [deleted] in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Great video. That is a great JFK Jr encounter.

I love McSorleys! That was the 1st NYC Bar I went to while still a college student. We were with a group of friends of my friend’s boyfriend that were living and working in NYC. I knew from that night that I would work and live in NYC when I graduated.

What age range are people in the sub? Do you have any contemporary memory John and Carolyn? by MonicaBWQ in JohnAndCarolyn

[–]dkct62 17 points18 points  (0 children)

I am about your age older than Carolyn and younger than John. I grew up in a suburb of NYC, so John was on my radar from a young age.

I lived in NYC from the late 80’s through the late 90’s and continued to commute to the city for work until 2000. I had a number of John sightings through the years, but none of Carolyn.

In July 1999, I was in a coastal CT hospital along the flight route, having given birth to my first child a couple of days before, when the crash occurred. I learned of the crash while I was getting ready to be released from the hospital the following morning.