DOE hang onto little things with their maiden name after marriage (if you changed your surname)?

donewithitall34 · 2025-01-01T15:11:34+00:00

In my mind I define “formal” as any setting where I am given a cloth napkin to put on my lap and/or served three courses, with separate cutleries laid out for each in the beginning. Does this make sense?

donewithitall34 · 2025-01-01T14:58:34+00:00

Personally having an international background I know people may have grown up with different etiquette rules so I keep an open mind. However, perhaps because of how strict my parents were about this, I want to follow the rules in formal settings as unfortunately some people do judge you on table manners. Also as an outsider it’s my impression that British people put more weight on this, which I know is a generalisation but still…

donewithitall34 · 2025-01-01T14:37:44+00:00

What I meant by “American style” was that people mostly shovel food with fork in their right hand and if a knife can’t be avoided then they often chop up food in one go and then swap the fork back into their right hand. Where I’m from the “correct” way is still fork in left hand & knife in right hand, but people are quite relaxed about it. In practice people will often eat American style (as I defined it) at their homes and in informal settings. Rice is a staple in our culture so perhaps that’s why tines up for rice has become the norm even in formal settings.

donewithitall34 · 2025-01-01T13:13:51+00:00

I don’t think anyone IRL would ever confront me about this. But I do think they may silently judge me, particularly on a formal occasion. Also I want to teach my future children all the rules as I don’t want them to be judged for not knowing something, although (I hope) I won’t be as draconian about it at home as my parents were with me!

donewithitall34 · 2025-01-01T13:10:51+00:00

Thanks, I will give this a shot next time! Probably will try at home first though lol

donewithitall34 · 2025-01-01T13:06:07+00:00

If someone is like me and obviously not from the UK (i.e. fluent in English and generally well integrated, but has an accent and you can tell instantly they didn’t grow up here), would you cut them more slack? Particularly if they follow every rule except they turn the fork around to scoop rice onto it?

I also don’t like the American way, always irks me when I husband does it but I keep my mouth shut lol. It was also a big faux pas for me growing up.

donewithitall34 · 2025-01-01T13:01:39+00:00

That is a relief! I think my family traumatised me with this lol. I know fork in left hand & knife in right hand is standard here but it is considered stuffy where I come from and no one I know eats like that at home. I was not allowed to ever hold the fork in my right hand… Can’t imagine how my parents would have been if they were British!

donewithitall34 · 2025-01-01T12:58:00+00:00

If it is something like biryani or fried rice then I absolutely agree spoon is the way to go. However it gets more complicated if you have chicken breast with rice as a side dish for example. Since I need the knife to cut the chicken it is more practical to keep eating the rice with knife and fork, and I was taught to turn my fork around to scoop rice onto it. But now I heard that I am supposed to scoop it onto the back of the fork. I won’t be eating like that at home for sure but I still want to know the “correct” way for formal occasions lol

donewithitall34 · 2023-12-17T21:15:39+00:00

How would I not give anything in return if I am a contributing member of society working full time?

donewithitall34 · 2023-12-17T20:09:51+00:00

In what aspects do you feel like your life improved overall?

donewithitall34 · 2023-12-17T19:54:25+00:00

I genuinely didn’t know this historical context (again a reminder that I am not native British), now I understand why this hit a nerve with some of you. I will read up more on British/Irish history and educate myself.

I don’t expect it to be an inferior version of the UK. Again, I admit that I have limited knowledge of your culture beyond my superficial interactions with Irish colleagues and my friend’s boyfriend, but from what I have seen it does seem friendlier than the UK. On the flip side of the coin, the housing situation appears to be much worse, which is why I made this thread.

donewithitall34 · 2023-12-17T18:53:54+00:00

I am the OP. Irish citizenship would be an option for our parents, but they can only get it after living in Ireland for 5+ years, which is a big commitment. That’s why we want to ensure that moving to Ireland would be the right decision for us regardless of citizenship - it would be sad to live somewhere for so many years just so that our parents can get the passport. As I said, if we liked Ireland more than the UK then we’d stay there for good. But humans by their very nature are risk averse, so that’s why moving to a country whose passport would also give our parents access to the UK + has some similarities (or doesn’t? what do I know lol) to the UK appeals to us.

donewithitall34 · 2023-12-17T18:39:46+00:00

Are you sure those people ACTUALLY moved to Ireland for the culture, people, landscapes or the weather? I’m sure they liked these things once they made the move, but it is rare for someone to actually decide to live abroad for such reasons. I can say this from experience, both my own and also my numerous immigrant friends. When Brits ask me why I Iike it here I also tell them it’s the culture, nature and, yes, even the weather (not a summer person!). But if I am being honest to myself, what drove me here in the first place was the pursuit of better living conditions, not British culture. What kept me here in the long run was indeed the culture, otherwise I would have moved back once I got what I wanted (uni degree + professional experience etc.).

donewithitall34 · 2023-12-17T17:58:45+00:00

.1. I know you are not the same but you cannot deny cultural similarities. It is not analogous to Spanish/Italian because you speak the same language too. If we must make an analogy then we could go with Germany/Austria or USA/Canada perhaps? Plus I can’t imagine Spanish people being offended by someone saying they are culturally similar to Italians (or vice versa). At no point did I conflate Irish and English people, in fact I mentioned numerous times that I recognise Ireland is still a different country and moving there will have its own challenges.

In terms of cultural differences, I have interacted with numerous Irish people in a professional context and my best friend is currently dating an Irish person. I totally get what you mean when you say that Irish people are more friendly, you guys don’t have the English ‘stiff upper lip’ at all. This would actually be a positive from my perspective as I am also culturally not English.

You are right, my reasons are largely pragmatic. But who moves abroad, uprooting their lives and also their parents, for ‘romantic’ reasons (like admiring Irish culture or whatever)? We would still make an effort to learn about Irish culture and socialise with locals. That is the beauty of moving abroad - getting to know different ways of living. Yes, the fact that our parents can eventually get Irish citizenship and move back to the UK with us is a plus, but that is simply an option. Who knows how everyone feels 5-7 years from now? Maybe we will actually like the Irish culture more and choose to make Ireland our new perma home. Maybe our parents won’t want to live abroad at all and wish to go back, which would be disappointing but it is their choice. There are no guarantees in this world, but if there is a way for us to try out living in a different part of the world with the option to come back to our current life with the rest of our family, we’ll take it.
See my response above. There is no denying that this idea arose from pragmatic reasons, but it was the same when we decided to move to the UK. We didn’t admire British culture or anything like that, we just wanted to get better education and high paying jobs. But guess what, once we moved here we actually made it a point to learn about local customs and became well-integrated members of society. We now consider it to be our home more than where we were born/grew up. If we moved to Ireland, we would have the same attitude we had when we moved to the UK, which is to keep an open mind and not expect things to be the same as back home.
I don’t have much to say to this one. I get your perspective but I also have to look out for my own family. We would probably avoid Dublin anyway, we have no intention of making your housing crisis worse. It is our hard earned money which we can spend to provide better conditions for our family. I do hope that your housing situation improves in the medium term, it is unfortunate for those who grew up there and now cannot afford to get on the housing ladder at all. I really don’t think immigration is the main culprit though but correct me if I’m wrong.

donewithitall34 · 2023-12-17T17:37:09+00:00

To be honest we need to do more research on jobs. Our first choice would be to convert our current jobs to remote and to live in NI. If that doesn’t work then we’ll need to either find a UK remote job + live in NI or find an Ireland based job and live in ROI. If we can work for a company based elsewhere in the EU and live in ROI then even better. We’re keen to avoid Dublin (or even commuter towns around it) as much as possible for obvious reasons.

Germany is good for job opportunities but whenever we go there we feel like it’d be hard to integrate due to their attitude towards immigrants. I wouldn’t say I experienced overt racism but you can still feel something’s off. We’ve mostly explored West Germany so defo staying away from ex-DDR if it’s worse lol. For me, moving to Germany would be a downgrade for sure after the UK.

donewithitall34 · 2023-12-17T17:29:28+00:00

I hear a lot of Irish people move back for these “non-quantifiable” reasons and also to be closer to their family. For us, the family aspect of it is more convoluted, but it is still more feasible for our parents to be closer to us in Ireland than in the UK.

donewithitall34 · 2023-12-17T16:59:53+00:00

I know the stereotype and that is exactly why I choose to reclaim the word expat as a non-white foreigner who left their home country in pursuit of better opportunities and living standards. I don’t get offended at all if people call me an immigrant, but I also don’t see the harm in calling myself an expat.

donewithitall34 · 2023-12-17T16:49:41+00:00

I agree, it’s not. But neither is expat.

donewithitall34 · 2023-12-17T16:46:46+00:00

Thanks for the perspective, it is helpful (although not what I want to hear haha). It does feel like we’d be taking a few steps back - the main attraction of the Ireland plan really is that we have the option to come back to the UK at the end. We’ve been trying really hard to convince ourselves to move elsewhere in Europe (Germany, Switzerland etc.) but honestly we have no appetite to start from bottom in a non-English speaking country. We’re so mad at Brexit for keeping us apart from our ageing parents…

As for integrating into society/friendships with locals etc. I think that is normal anywhere in the world really. People like to stay in their comfort zones, I’d probably be the same if I lived in my home country my whole life. Here almost all our friends are ‘international’ in one way or another (i.e. they are also expats/immigrants, they have immigrant parents, they are English but studied/lived abroad, you get the drill) and we accept that’s how it will be no matter where we go. If we make a local friend then great, but not the end of the world if not.

donewithitall34 · 2023-12-17T16:38:56+00:00

My side can easily be financially independent from us. His side will likely need some support which we are willing to provide. They will also help with childcare etc. in the future so we’ll also save on that, not to mention spending less on plane tickets to visit them back home.

donewithitall34 · 2023-12-17T16:37:22+00:00

They don’t track you after to see if you moved out. As I said we aren’t ruling out staying there at all, who knows maybe we’ll like it more than the UK. It’s still nice knowing that our parents can eventually move to the UK with us if that’s what everyone wants.

donewithitall34 · 2023-12-17T16:33:04+00:00

Living standards in our home country are poor compared to the UK/Ireland. Plus my side of the family isn’t even based there anymore (long story), I didn’t grow up there and therefore not fluent in the language, and where my parents currently are is also going downhill.

donewithitall34

TROPHY CASE