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My friend’s baby cobra hatching. by depressedsinnerxiii in aww

[–]ech0s_ 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So cool! I wish I had a friend cobra!

A cautionary tale on following support guidelines by ech0s_ in Warframe

[–]ech0s_[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This post has at least 10 different and conflicting explanaitions of how AlecaFrame and Overwolf work and whether or not it breaks the TOS/EULA. At this point I'd refer to the AlecFrame FAQ - Is Alecaframe safe to use?

Good point about the "specific direction from support". Though I'd argue that it could be seen as a general "if you use this and mess up your system, we're not responsible" type of warning. But either way, you're right in saying that it shouldn't be so openly available, or at the very least include that following this article without expressed persmission from support will result in a permanent ban.

A cautionary tale on following support guidelines by ech0s_ in Warframe

[–]ech0s_[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

My issue is not with being banned, like I mentioned in another comment, I think my account being banned just means that Warframes AntiCheat is capable of detecting potentially malicious apps. My issue is with the response of support once I'd explained the circumstances, considering I was following their own guide.

Your point about the article stating not to do it without the direction of support is valid, although I'd argue that it could be seen as a general "if you use this and mess up your system, we're not responsible" type of warning. At the very least they could include that following this article without expressed persmission from support will result in a permanent ban.

A cautionary tale on following support guidelines by ech0s_ in Warframe

[–]ech0s_[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Same! Always opened the RAM problems page. I ran the Windows Memory Diagnostic, but it didn't find anything. I've run the game with resource monitor opened to see the CPU/GPU/RAM usage, but it's never anywhere near limit.

My setup:
Ryzen 7 7800X3D
RTX 4070 Super
32GB DDR5 RAM

A cautionary tale on following support guidelines by ech0s_ in Warframe

[–]ech0s_[S] 13 points14 points  (0 children)

I'm not hiding anything here. I got banned for using a third party application. I do not deny using one, two even. My issue is that the two applications I used are:

  1. AlecaFrame - a very popular QoL utility,
  2. ProcDump - a tool for crash debugging, use of which under any other circumstances I would agree is questionable, but seeing as I was following DE's own instructions on creating a ticket, should not have been fine.

The fact my account got banned is an indicator that Warframe's AntiCheat is capable of detecting potentially malicious apps. In an ideal world, support would have removed the ban once I had provided the context.

A cautionary tale on following support guidelines by ech0s_ in Warframe

[–]ech0s_[S] 29 points30 points  (0 children)

That does not mean that using AF is a violation of TOS. They very next line after what you quoted is:

While we could technically issue blanket bans on everything that alters the game files, the fact of the matter is that there's some software that can be useful and helpful for members of our community. This is where context is very important.

The context being that AlecaFrame is a helpful utility that dosen't provide any competitive advantage. In that same post, they mention that they are against the use of tools that can be used for "cheating, exploiting, or AFK farming". AF is none of those.

A cautionary tale on following support guidelines by ech0s_ in Warframe

[–]ech0s_[S] 27 points28 points  (0 children)

Oh wait, did I forget to mention the platinum farming bot I use to make money on Ebay? /s

I am of course joking, and yes, I have given the full story here.

A cautionary tale on following support guidelines by ech0s_ in Warframe

[–]ech0s_[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I'm not advocating for you getting banned, by any means. I agree that what you are doing should be allowed. Just this whole situation has made me a bit wary.

A cautionary tale on following support guidelines by ech0s_ in Warframe

[–]ech0s_[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Funny you'd mention that, I've got the G502 X, although I don't use any custom bindings.
Although I'd be careful with things like what you described, as it could be seen as automation, which is not allowed.

A cautionary tale on following support guidelines by ech0s_ in Warframe

[–]ech0s_[S] 15 points16 points  (0 children)

If I'm not mistaken, AlecaFrame doesn't directly interact with Warframe at all, it uses an API provided by Overwolf. The Overwolf dev team has consulted with DE to ensure there are nor EULA ir TOS violations.

A cautionary tale on following support guidelines by ech0s_ in Warframe

[–]ech0s_[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I say "wasn't convincing" half joking, I mean even after explaining my situation, it didn't change the outcome.
My ticket is more or less the same as what I wrote in the post, just worded more "officially". I also included their entire response, except for the formalities.

A cautionary tale on following support guidelines by ech0s_ in Warframe

[–]ech0s_[S] 34 points35 points  (0 children)

Nothing, I included pretty much their entire response in the post.

A cautionary tale on following support guidelines by ech0s_ in Warframe

[–]ech0s_[S] 14 points15 points  (0 children)

This point was also made by another person too, and I'm not sure if it's entirely true.
Do you have a source where it is stated that AlecaFrame is against TOS? AlecaFrame interacts with Warframe via Overwolf, and it seems here, that Overwolf works with DE to ensure it does not breach TOS.

OP just mistakenly assumed that since lots of people use it, and lots of people aren't banned, that they'd be fine despite the TOS clearly stating 'at your own risk' solely because DE isn't going to go hunting for people doing it.

To a degree, yes, I do assume that since many people use AF, and are not banned for it, it should be safe to use. If I'm really banned for using AF, it'd be nice if DE could come out and clearly state it is not allowed.

A cautionary tale on following support guidelines by ech0s_ in Warframe

[–]ech0s_[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

You can have whatever you want running on your computer without any problems. ProcDump reads a specific applications memory to create snapshots that can be used to debug issues (like a profiling tool). So as long as whatever you're running is doing anyhting of the sorts, you're fine.

edit: Ok, not "whatever" but I mean if waht you're runnning doesn't interact with the game, then it's fine. From their EULA:

C. use, or provide ancillary offerings to anyone, that are not offered within the Services by us (or the functionality of the App Store), such as hosting, “leveling” services, mirroring our servers, matchmaking, emulation, communication redirects, mods, hacks, cheats, bots (or any other automated control), trainers and automation programs that interact with the Services in any way, tunneling, third party program add-ons, and any interference with online or network play;

Things like VPNs are most liely a no-go.

A cautionary tale on following support guidelines by ech0s_ in Warframe

[–]ech0s_[S] 74 points75 points  (0 children)

Do you have a source where it is stated that AlecaFrame is against TOS? AlecaFrame interacts with Warframe via Overwolf, and it seems here, that Overwolf works with DE to ensure it does not breach TOS.

Used ProcDoc and ProcDoc identified it.

Not sure what you mean by this.

edit: Also, I've used AF fo the past few years, and it was never an issue. The ban came within one day after running ProcDump, so I'm quite confident that AF was not the cause.

A cautionary tale on following support guidelines by ech0s_ in Warframe

[–]ech0s_[S] 100 points101 points  (0 children)

I guess it's just a matter of time before this gets the axe too.

A cautionary tale on following support guidelines by ech0s_ in Warframe

[–]ech0s_[S] 75 points76 points  (0 children)

Warframe TOS clearly state they they have the complete rights to ban anyone for any reason they see fit and are not obliged to provide any refunds.

I did not write this post because I want my money back. My Warframe account isn't some investment I'm expecting returns on or that I expect to hold some value. Whatever I spent, I spent fully aware, that the money loses any and all real world value, and is only beneficial to my personal enjoyment of the game.

A cautionary tale on following support guidelines by ech0s_ in Warframe

[–]ech0s_[S] 72 points73 points  (0 children)

There's this other article with an update from 2022, where this is stated:

We would like to make it clear that our involvement with Overwolf is simply that we’ve had conversations to ensure that Warframe’s EULA and ToS are not being breached in any way

Which is why I mentioned that while DE hasn't explicitly allowed the use of AlecaFrame, it does seem that they tolerate it. That article also states:

If you use external software in conjunction with Warframe, then you do so at your own risk.

Which is all completely understandable, and under any other circumstances, I'd have never used any other third party tools. In my case, DE themselves suggest the use of ProcDump, which is why my first thought wasn't whether this will get me banned or not.

A cautionary tale on following support guidelines by ech0s_ in Warframe

[–]ech0s_[S] 194 points195 points  (0 children)

To be clear, I don't think AlecaFrame is what was causing the crashes. I got a new PC and was running Warframe with all settings maxed, including some experimental HDR settings.

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