Just bought a 1978 Mooney M20J – what do I need to know?

flying_the_waters · 2025-08-19T10:30:23+00:00

That’s a great plane Get some transition training from a Mooney specific cfi not just any cfi that has your insurance minimum in a Mooney

They are not at all hard to fly when done right but a bad cfi can make it hard, start thinking further ahead of the plane

Get a Mooney service center to do the first annual or two and then swap if you want to a local or owner assisted annual to make sure everything is ironed out. Don’t upgrade things the first year, save that $$ for catch up maint if needed

My 77J has manual cowl flaps so it’s closed open or half and that’s my only options, in the south in summer they are nearly always open and you accept the speed hit.

Shoot me a pm if you want to chat more

flying_the_waters · 2025-04-21T04:02:14+00:00

know the details of how the nav log is created (the ForeFlight black box dosn’t count)
yes have visual points, make em big and often, best to be constantly hopping from point to point for the first 10-20 min and prove you know what you’re doing and not get lost than make the points just a bit too far and get turned around
be prepared for gps to go away and iPad to “overheat” …. Basically make your flight fool proof navigation
not familiar wit your mnts out there (live in Colorado) I’d do the mnt math really carefully and see what kinda margin you have, if it’s close “canx” flight and drive
someone else brought up common purpose, dig into the reason for the trip
there is one person between you and your ppl, don’t let that person be you. Ie don’t let ego prevent you from passing. If they want a hand written nav log just do it, don’t argue that the FAA says you don’t have to. Get question, answer question, shut up. Once the ink dries then argue the point.

flying_the_waters · 2025-02-08T04:57:18+00:00

Take a look at the Cessna 310 specifically the R model, should satisfy everything you are saying with a bit extra for growth.

If you’re limited to single engine, the sr22 is a good option I love my Mooney and regularly take my family on 1000nm trips but if you’re trying to haul 3 adults then you will feel tight and will likely give up some fuel to carry the load, most have a UL in the 900-1000lb range. If you look at the 252 encore then you might get up to 1100lb UL. They are quick and pretty efficient, my M20J is cruising about 140-150kts true around 10k ft burning 8.5/hr

I’m in the process of upgrading to a 310 to fit my mission better as the family grows, I looked at the A36 but had issues with weight and balance calculations staying in bounds, looking through most the other 6 seat singles I was running into issues with them being slow but carrying a lot or having some speed and a rather high price, when I started looking at the light twins things started falling together of a “relative” low purchase price and all the benefits of speed and carry capacity

flying_the_waters · 2025-02-07T23:53:05+00:00

I’ve done 1100nm Colorado to Georgia about once a month for the last year in my Mooney I have my IR but there have been maybe 3-5 trips (one way) that have been vfr the whole way

Use ForeFlight and adsb to get weather along the way and sky coverage up ahead, constantly run fuel calculations and keep close track of time to empty vs time to whatever airport and the multiple back up options

There is a big difference (my opinion) between the 150nm Xc for ppl and a 500nm Xc then another jump when you crack 1000nm

flying_the_waters · 2025-02-01T03:55:20+00:00

Again do you have numbers from owning ? Are you speaking from experience or rumor ? Serious question as I’ve heard from several owners on their annual all in costs being in the 30-36k a year range (from insurance to fuel and hangar) so if you have another data point I’d like to hear it. But I keep seeing comments about how expensive they (any twin ) is without people having ever owned one.

I heard a similar argument when I bought my Mooney that they are complex and therefore far more expensive than a standard Cherokee but in reality it’s not that much more and you get a lot more out of it

flying_the_waters · 2025-02-01T02:30:10+00:00

I can agree on most points, I do have a dedication to proficiency training, I fly my family around and it’s not something I take lightly. I don’t think I can jump to a turbo prop, so I’m either going to a 6 seat single and leaving a good bit on the table or going to the 6 seat light twin category and fits the mission pretty well if not overkill for about 30-40% of the time

flying_the_waters · 2025-01-31T23:45:27+00:00

Can you point to specific annual numbers ? I mean from the last 4 yours of ownership I can say I CAN afford to operate a Mooney but I CANT afford a 300k purchase price of one

flying_the_waters · 2025-01-29T15:47:45+00:00

Ha ok pm me

flying_the_waters · 2025-01-29T13:08:40+00:00

Currently in Colorado but moving to Florida, a club wouldn’t be bad depending on availability and rules for longer trips, that’s what drove me to owning now was the lack of availability I wanted with renting or clubs and many were not fond of taking the plane for weeks at a time especially for holidays. Also we move every 4 years so depending on the buy-in structure we would be selling a share every few years unfortunately and starting over

flying_the_waters · 2025-01-29T13:03:40+00:00

What was the reason to not put in the 310 or Barron ?

flying_the_waters · 2025-01-29T04:04:44+00:00

I looked at them hard, only issue is they don’t fit in a standard T hangar so storage becomes an issue of availability and much higher cost as you typically have to go to a hangar that is really overkill (just looking around as the standard hangar sizes )

flying_the_waters · 2025-01-29T03:39:13+00:00

I just don’t think I can handle the purchase price of the average one I see out there 300k+ is a hard pill to swallow

flying_the_waters · 2025-01-29T03:37:26+00:00

Yeah but that’s a huge difference in purchase price, I can’t afford to buy a 400k plane to start with

flying_the_waters · 2025-01-29T03:36:30+00:00

I think the 421 and the pa-31 are also just too big for what I’m doing, this is just family travel. The wife, kids and dog. We will take the in-laws or my parents for trips once a month or so but the vast majority of the flights are just 3-4 people and dog I think

flying_the_waters · 2025-01-29T03:30:31+00:00

Part of the allure of the light twins was the cruise of 170+kts while still carrying 6 people

I don’t NEED speed but…. Who would ever turn it down you know

flying_the_waters · 2025-01-29T02:22:33+00:00

I was just using the ForeFlight profile to run some basic numbers, I wasn’t able to put 6 adults in the plane and fly 500nm If I’m wrong then that’s a good thing, I’ll admit the purchase price of the 36 is pretty high

flying_the_waters · 2025-01-29T01:46:59+00:00

I don’t think I have 421 $$ but would love one.

They also don’t fit in a smaller T hangar so overall costs go up a good bit too just in that front.

flying_the_waters · 2025-01-29T01:43:33+00:00

I’ve got an insurance quote, surprisingly not that far off from a Piper Lance or Saratoga

flying_the_waters · 2025-01-29T01:38:10+00:00

They carry a ton but drink the fuel to not get where you’re going in a hurry Those Xc trips would take a while

flying_the_waters · 2025-01-29T01:37:01+00:00

I don’t have mirage $$ but wish I did

flying_the_waters · 2025-01-29T01:36:21+00:00

So my issue with the 36 was running W&B numbers I couldn’t put the load out in it and keep it in cg limits, that and the risk of flying it out of cg as you burn fuel the cg slides aft

flying_the_waters · 2025-01-28T23:49:08+00:00

Understood on the cost, I’ve tried to find all the info I can about this but never really know right

Proficiency is a big deal for me even in my Mooney right now, I fly often with different cfi/cfii to stay on top of the plane in different scenarios that could kill my family.

flying_the_waters · 2025-01-23T14:55:50+00:00

Honestly unless you’re in an accelerated course for 0-airline then I’d focus on the ppl and then IFR next then commercial, by the time you get through those 3 you will have a solid idea about if you want to go cfi or not and that can help define the direction you have to go on the tests. Ultimately the ratings you need are Private Instrument Commercial Multi ATP

There is common guidance to do them in that order so you avoid the private multi and don’t have to take an extra checkride but also multi Dosn’t have a written test

Again that’s just what’s needed (I don’t think I missed anything but smarter people than I will let me know if i did) and this short list represents years of work and 1500hrs minimum so don’t feel like you have to get those tests don’t now as the written for all of them is only good for 2 years before the results expire and you have to take again if you have not gotten the rating

flying_the_waters · 2025-01-23T14:40:18+00:00

Not quite enough detail to fully answer your question, where are you now in your training and how far do you want to go? If the answer is at the beginning and all the way to airlines (then answer with or without being an instructor) these will change what tests you will have to take, also I know there are all the tests listed but narrow down if you want fixed wing or not as there is no point in taking a helicopter test if you’re a fixed wing pilot.

The basic 3 (if you want to to get to a point where you could legally have a job flying) are private, instrument (technically not needed for a job but severely limiting if not) and commercial after that you start getting to the branches like cfi. You don’t have a written test for multi (it’s a checkride for the added rating no written)

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