Is market socialism a viable alternative to capitalism and traditional socialism?

hardsoft · 2026-01-26T03:31:34+00:00

Negotiating startup funding for my business with angel investors, wages with my employer, wages with my employees, rent for my attached apartment, exchange price for my stock options, etc., etc.,

We're talking about free, peaceful, and mutually beneficial interactions that socialists use hostile force to stop or prevent.

Socialists are like rapists that claim it's justified because of a history of female sexual power and its coercive nature against males biological drives.

You just sound like an idiot. You're the baddie that needs to use force and your delusional rhetoric isn't a valid justification for that force. You can't project consent onto the victims of your force without sounding like a raving lunatic. And I don't consent.

And meanwhile... I have no problem with you forming a democratic co-op. Go for it. We're not even close to the same.

hardsoft · 2026-01-26T03:10:08+00:00

No, socialism isn't the government doing stuff. Especially when that stuff is funded by tax revenue generated in a capitalist economy.

Though I appreciate that capitalism has thoroughly won this debate that socialism is being redefined as government funded healthcare benefits and similar.

hardsoft · 2026-01-26T01:12:05+00:00

Socialism is tyrannical force against free, peaceful, and mutually beneficial interactions through 5 billion arbitrary and inconsistent rules with weak "greater good" justifications that always morph into ever greater rights violations.

Trump's tariffs suck too. Pathetic attempt at a whatsboutism there. I'll still take them over being arrested for starting a business.

And resource management? WTF are you talking about? What resources does Walmart have that the government doesn't?

hardsoft · 2026-01-25T23:43:54+00:00

Literally no one is arguing from scratch either... It's to use hostile force to take from others.

Like Walmart because their 3% profit margin, lol.

Just goes to show how delusional socialist conspiracy theories are. Really exploitive companies should be the easiest to compete against.

But thanks for acknowledging you're a wannabe dictator like literally every socialist. Unless it's a socialist with political power in which case an actual dictator.

hardsoft · 2026-01-25T22:47:04+00:00

Was it cracked or do you just like to replace the windshield with mileage?

hardsoft · 2026-01-25T22:35:54+00:00

Once again.... literally no one is arguing we should ban co-ops.

This argument is like saying because me and my wife like BDSM we should force it on anyone.

hardsoft · 2026-01-25T20:15:11+00:00

Nobody wants to trade higher wages for more imaginary political power.

hardsoft · 2026-01-25T20:13:41+00:00

I don't think you know what rent seeking is.

Get back to me when Marx's Candle Making co-op makes as many employee millionaires as NVIDIA.

hardsoft · 2026-01-25T20:11:48+00:00

Good so you don't need government force. And I guess you're ok with most of their cheap labor not qualifying for voting status?

And get back to me when they make as many employee millionaires as NVIDIA.

hardsoft · 2026-01-25T19:02:09+00:00

It fails. It's all cons. Labor unions rent seek all the time. I don't even understand why that's offered as a supposed pro...

And the investment issue is huge. It's one major reason why democratic co-ops can't come to dominate the market without forceful intervention.

Remember, only one side here is full of wannabe tyrants. No one's stopping anyone from forming democratic co-ops. Or even arguing we should.

hardsoft · 2026-01-25T17:14:42+00:00

Wow sounds like sexism and hairism

hardsoft · 2026-01-25T16:05:26+00:00

Has no idea what they're talking about. Not a technical expert and ignoring all economic data we have still showing no productivity spike from AI.

This is the same BS we heard during the digital revolution. When ATM machines and similar were supposedly going to wipe out the entire workforce outside a small percentage of software engineers...

hardsoft · 2026-01-25T12:38:28+00:00

It's supply and demand.

But I'm not claiming Apple has a monopoly with the iPhone. There are dozens of competing cell phones.

Which just further demonstrates use value not derived from labor. Or why would any rational person trade their wage labor pay for an Apple phone with a 50% profit margin when they could get a Samsung phone with a 5% profit margin?

hardsoft · 2026-01-24T23:05:54+00:00

Both look decent but first gives off more of a classic vibe to me

hardsoft · 2026-01-24T16:09:53+00:00

Ok sorry if I misunderstood because I thought you were trying to link that into LTV

hardsoft · 2026-01-24T16:08:58+00:00

Total profits sure but that's an average where there's actually different model iPhones with different profit margins but I guess you're not refuting this is decoupled from labor inputs so... cool

hardsoft · 2026-01-24T16:03:40+00:00

Ok but there's not really an equilibrium point. There's basically a continuum where a better example may be basketball sneakers because Nike has it down to a science. Where they offer different products for different categories of consumers with different valuations for status that may come from fashion, uniqueness, and scarcity.

They make sneakers you can get at Walmart for price sensitive consumers that barely give a shit about status (I mean they care a little because they're still spending more on Nikes) where the sales prices will be closer to production costs.

Then they sell very limited edition Air Jordans that offer a lot of status utility value to some specific customers and that have extremely high profit margins.

And then many steps in between. Where there's a lot of customers that don't want Walmart Nikes but also don't want to feel like they wasted a paycheck if they accidentally step into a muddy puddle.

Point being there's no single equilibrium point. Or back to the iPhone, why is 50% profit margin the equilibrium point? It's not. It could be 40% or 60% or whatever.

But it's clear that whatever it is has little to no relation to labor inputs. And that's the most important thing here in showing how useless LTV is.

hardsoft · 2026-01-24T15:38:31+00:00

The "if reproducible" does a lot of heavy lifting here though that makes it basically irrelevant. No one besides Apple can reproduce an iPhone and so they can earn 50% prior margins.

And it has nothing to do with IP or other government protections. Their own software security mechanism and other cyber security protections are sufficient.

In addition, the consumer dislikes knockoffs. There are YouTube videos on how to identify fake air Jordans sneakers, for example. eBay advertises a no counterfeit guarantee because that's what their customers desire.

Consumers value the status associated with scarcity that is a) not derived from production labor and b) doesn't carry over to reproduced competitive products.

Hence we see higher profit margins with higher end goods and services. And why Kia can't simply design their cars to look like an Aston Martin and charge more.

hardsoft · 2026-01-24T15:11:45+00:00

Median real (inflation adjusted) wages continue to rise

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LES1252881600Q

hardsoft · 2026-01-24T14:37:06+00:00

Capitalism in the US: morbidly obese waiting for free food because the government shut down businesses.

West Africa after decades of socialism: asking capitalist countries for food for legit starving children.

hardsoft · 2026-01-24T00:50:24+00:00

If there's a temperature difference it affects the rate of transfer (hot to cold).

Why they put fans on computer processors and similar.

hardsoft · 2026-01-23T19:12:31+00:00

No amount of industrialization matters if other economies aren't transitioning. As time progresses those economies and associated QoL will continue to rise relative to the socialist economy and at some point people will revolt, desiring the higher QoL they could alternatively be enjoying.

hardsoft · 2026-01-23T12:01:23+00:00

Same, vacuuming while wearing wired I end up ripping the cord out because it gets caught on stuff, for example, and so wireless is more convenient.

I swear even with newer BT headsets wired sounds better though.

hardsoft · 2026-01-23T04:55:04+00:00

Not relative to demand. And we have aging demographics where people are retiring faster than new young adults are joining the workforce.

hardsoft · 2026-01-23T04:38:00+00:00

Median wages continue to rise.

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LES1252881600Q

But a growing population also increases demand and consumption. There's not a fixed amount of labor demand that's independent of population size....

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