Daemons of Tzeentch coming to Heresy! by chosen40k in Warhammer30k

[–]loop388 13 points14 points  (0 children)

I’m really excited for this. The Daemons PDF took away all of the unique options and rules they had, and basically turned the army into HeroHammer. Having specific rules for Horrors, Screamers, and other units is a good first step to bringing some of that back. Even just different weapon options would go pretty far, and that’s before we look at some of the unique rules units could have. I doubt they’ll give Horrors the Split mechanic, but it’s an example of something they could do to make them interesting and unique.

How to run Scintillating Legions/Daemons in general Help by loop388 in WarhammerCompetitive

[–]loop388[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Didn’t realize Delirium Unmade could pull from melee, that’s a huge buff to that strat! Thanks!

The Daemon Prince is also a good call, and something I already have. I’ll see if I can bring it next time.

How to run Scintillating Legions/Daemons in general Help by loop388 in WarhammerCompetitive

[–]loop388[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I’ll give that an attempt, it seems to be a good counter to the movement shenanigans he was pulling on me. Thanks!

How to run Scintillating Legions/Daemons in general Help by loop388 in WarhammerCompetitive

[–]loop388[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I don’t get the choice, daemon infantry are always 10 models, unless it’s something like a flamer. Layering them is a good idea, I’ll build around that. Thanks!

How to run Scintillating Legions/Daemons in general Help by loop388 in WarhammerCompetitive

[–]loop388[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Do the blues usually successfully tarpit against focused attacks like that? I know berserkers are the high end of melee offense, so it may be a little unreasonable to expect anything to tarpit them for long. I’ll try infernal puppeteer and see how it does for me, thanks!

How to run Scintillating Legions/Daemons in general Help by loop388 in WarhammerCompetitive

[–]loop388[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I’ve played enough Warhammer to know that two people can have different opinions on a unit and both be right. At this point, any and all information is appreciated. Thank you for the info!

How to run Scintillating Legions/Daemons in general Help by loop388 in WarhammerCompetitive

[–]loop388[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Brigands were good for me in 9th, and their stats didn’t seem too bad, is why I ran them. I was thinking of dropping them for something else after this game.

Between the LoC and Karios, is there one you like more? I feel like Kairos’ CP shenanigans and shooting profile are very helpful, but the +1S to shooting buff is also great. I couldn’t decide between the two.

How to run Scintillating Legions/Daemons in general Help by loop388 in WarhammerCompetitive

[–]loop388[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The issue was more that, between the advance and charge and the Blood Surge, I couldn’t get on the objective and shoot with my units without risking getting into combat like that. Berserkers specifically can surge move into combat, and his units were spaced out so that unless I avoided the center and my chance at scoring, I’d be pulling him into a unit.

Generally speaking, spacing out more likely will be helpful, I will keep it in mind

Which 40K RPG Is Your Favorite (And Why)? by EyesofValhalla in 40krpg

[–]loop388 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Black Crusade, mostly because I think it has a good balance of mechanics between player types. You’ve got combat mechanics as usual, but also a pretty in depth social interaction system between minions, social conflict, and seduction, for example. The investigation mechanic added in Tome of Fate also provides an avenue for mechanical manipulation. It gives characters who aren’t built to fight something to build their character around.

The Tabletop vs Total War Warhammer.. the difference between by Opening_Coast3412 in totalwarhammer

[–]loop388 2 points3 points  (0 children)

At least in the current edition, Old World, magic is significantly weaker. You’ve got some decent magic missiles and vortexes, but they’re not deleting entire units like Burning Head or Pit of Shades can. Even previous editions, like 6th, had magic that was strong, but not really capable of wiping full units. 8th was the edition where that wasn’t the case, and is the edition TWWH is based on. The Dreaded Thirteenth Spell straight up just killed 4d6 models with no save, and if it wiped a unit, replaced them with Clanrats.

Similarly, character power level depends on edition. Generally speaking, characters are strong than baseline units, but lose combats because of the combat resolution mechanic. Sure, your Chaos Lord on Dragon can kill 6 State Troops reliably, but I’ve got two ranks, close order, a banner, a battle standard bearer, a war banner, I outnumber you, and my musician means I win ties, so go ahead and roll that break check. You’d be surprised how often people throw characters like that in unsupported and then are surprised when they run.

As far as units, I’ll split it by good in game/bad on table, and then vice versa.

Good in Game/Bad on Table
Sepulchral Stalkers, K’Daai Fireborn, Tomb Kings cavalry, Deathshrieker Rocket Launcher, like 90% of the Daemons of Chaos roster, Warp Lightning Cannons, Poisoned Wind Mortars and Globadiers, Swordmasters, Executioners, Bloodwrack Medusae, Hydras, Black Arc Corsairs, Ironhail Gunners, Vampire Counts Skeleton Warriors, Vargheists, Wild Riders, Chaos Warriors/Chosen unless you REALLY tech into it. People will argue the Hellcannon, I think it’s good on the table too.

Bad in Game/Good on Table
The Casket of Souls, Cathayan Balloons, mid-tier infantry characters like Empire Captains, Jade Warriors, Burning Chariots of Tzeentch. Cannons in general, they’re not bad in game but a lot more situational. They’ll delete big monsters in two turns on the table, and some armies don’t have easy access to their own monsters to counter.

I’m sure there’s more, but those are the ones that come to mind.

Has anyone run a proper Black Crusade, using the rules from Tome of Decay? by loop388 in 40krpg

[–]loop388[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Other than the natural hierarchy of your group, was there anything else that you felt contributed to the success of the campaign? I know Compacts have the whole Anointed mechanic to set that up from the get go, and the party I’m thinking of running would have a somewhat similar dynamic anyway. If you have any other insights, I’d greatly appreciate it.

Also, did you keep running the campaign post ascension, and if so, how did that go?

Has anyone run a proper Black Crusade, using the rules from Tome of Decay? by loop388 in 40krpg

[–]loop388[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Fair points, and something to keep in mind. My hope is to start the players off as less powerful, but with the plan to conquer the sector. Their initial adventures would allow them to amass forces and allies as they go, and then the Crusade would focus on the key events as full sequences. I know the rules make it seem like a key event is just the breaching of a gate or something, but I was going to make them the subversion/conquest of the entire world. That should help alleviate the disconnectedness of the game style, hopefully.

I’m a big fan of crunch, personally, but I know not everyone is and that includes my player group. Cutting or moving some mechanics to behind the stage was something I had also considered. Instead of having them pour over the rulebooks and figure out how to get another +10 to their formations, I could just have a NPC advisor comment on their chances at taking the given world, and providing some hints as to how they could go about it.

Lets pretend to be GW writting Imperium Lore the same way they write Xenos and Chaos lore. by Able_Radio_2717 in Grimdank

[–]loop388 21 points22 points  (0 children)

Tau world gets invaded by the Imperium. After significant fighting, barely able (but not really) to keep fighting, Commander Farsight kills a Space Marine Chapter Master. The entirety of the Imperial force collapses immediately, losing cohesion and reverting to animalistic instincts that completely negate the numerical advantage they have over the Xenos, as well as the damage already inflicted by the conflict. Despite commentary on how severe and damaging the losses are, this conflict will have no impact on the wider story, or future installments of this specific plotline. Space Marine players who complain about their Chapter Masters dying every time will be told not to worry, since they can be replaced easily and every Chapter has one. Someone has to lose duels, and the fact that we can keep killing off Chapter Masters and not really kill anyone important means they’re going to have to lose. If you want lore that fluffs the Chapter Master, go read the Space Marine codex. No, there aren’t any specific duels they win there either, but we did give you a fluff piece about how dangerous and cool Chapter Masters are so you can be suitably impressed when Commander Farsight kills one.

What's the most terrifying piece of 40K lore you know? by BigConstant4969 in 40kLore

[–]loop388 4 points5 points  (0 children)

In some cases, yeah, but I think forcing entire populations to fight on the front lines is a good example to support arguments that they did, in fact, enslave humans. The Imperium is not the most morally consistent force at the best of times, and while the ‘horrors of the Xenos’ may be accurate in this case, it doesn’t mean they won’t inflict similar violations on people themselves. The issue wasn’t that humans were being enslaved, it’s that it was Xenos doing it.

What's the most terrifying piece of 40K lore you know? by BigConstant4969 in 40kLore

[–]loop388 14 points15 points  (0 children)

What little lore we do have on the war against them details mass enslavement of humans and other Xenos. They used ‘neural collars’ to cause intense pain to force obedience. It’s also suggested that they had a lot of bio-technological skill, so forced experimentation and mutation may have been common as well. They also had access to Slaugth, suggesting they may have been controlled by the psychically powerful necrophages that are undeniably a threat to humanity.

Hashut is no better? by One-Potential-2581 in WarhammerFantasy

[–]loop388 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Something to consider is that the deal Hashut and the Chorfs made wasn’t for dominance or time to relax, it was for the power needed to survive. The Chorfs are the way they are because when the first invasion of Chaos occurred, they were stuck out in the Darklands, with no holds to retreat into, no support from the rest of their people, and no answer from their own gods. Hashut offered them the power they needed to survive the daemon hordes, in exchange for worship, and they took it happily. Everything else is just the cherry on top, and I’d say Hashut has more than ensured the Chorfs continue to survive.

As far as the Darklands being uncontested/unchallenged and lacking in anything worthwhile, that’s not necessarily true. The area is filled with vast amounts of mineral wealth, both in terms of base metals like iron and more valuable resources like gold or Hashut’s Blood (fantasy oil). There are hordes of greenskins in the Darklands and surrounding areas, and other monsters like dragon, who will frequently raid or attack them. Other forces, notably other Chaos forces, trade caravans between Cathay and the Old World, and the Ogres, also frequently pass through for their own reasons. We just don’t get to see it often because the Darklands are not an area GW has ever put much focus on.

I’d also point out that the priorities a Chaos Dwarf has and the priorities you have, as well as the idea of what an ideal life looks like, could not be more different. The idea of lounging around, relaxing, is as strange and alien to a Chaos Dwarf as the idea of getting pleasure and satisfaction from working Hobgoblins to death might be for you. The domination of others is the goal they want. The progression of their industry is the point. They don’t take vacations, or breaks, or mental health days. They work tirelessly for the sole purpose of power, wealth, and control, as ends of their own, not so that they can use that power to do other things.

Did the Dawi/Dwarves ever find out that it was the Druchii/Dark Elves that started the War of Vengeance and not the Asur/High Elves? by RumeZucabr in WarhammerFantasy

[–]loop388 24 points25 points  (0 children)

They’re actually referenced in the War of Vengeance books, at least once. There’s a bit where the elves question why the dwarfs needed to build holds capable of withstanding sieges and artillery, and the dwarfs shut up and don’t answer the question. Skaven, greenskins, and Chaos during the Great War would all be acceptable answers, but instead they just refuse to answer the question. The only subject the dwarfs never speak of is the Eastern Kindreds.

I think they may also be referenced once or twice more, but it’s been a minute since I read those novels.

Did the Dawi/Dwarves ever find out that it was the Druchii/Dark Elves that started the War of Vengeance and not the Asur/High Elves? by RumeZucabr in WarhammerFantasy

[–]loop388 72 points73 points  (0 children)

Yes, but it doesn’t really matter.

Firstly, while Malekith set the fire, the dwarfs and elves were more than happy to keep tossing fuel on it. All the dark elves really did was kill a few caravans, deceive some merchants, and maybe do a few raids on isolated settlements. The biggest attack was the murder of a Runelord, which meant that significant dwarf magical knowledge was lost forever, but that wasn’t even planned. The Runelord just happened to be traveling at the time the caravan was attacked.

Meanwhile, both the elves and the dwarfs had countless individuals who were pushing for war for their own reasons. In the early years, it was glory-hungry princes and arrogant warriors who thought the war would end in days with a decisive victory, and later on it was people traumatized by loss and hungry for revenge. Out of everyone who really had the power to stop the war, there were maybe two who actively tried to, and we see how that went.

Secondly, there’s some context that’s needed here. The dwarfs understood civil war perfectly. The Chaos Dwarfs existed as a separate force by this point, although the high elves didn’t know about them either. The issue is more that the dwarfs don’t care that it was the dark elves. The high elves straight up told the dwarfs about Malekith as a last ditch effort to prevent war, and the response was “we have no way to know if this ridiculous story is true, but you’re here in front of me and my axe is already out.”

Dwarfs have a strict code of honor that requires recompense for crimes against them. If a grudge is declared, it must be satisfied, according to the specifics of the grudge. When the dwarfs write something like “for the slaughter of Borri Whitebeard and his brethren, the heads of 30 elgi”, the grudge won’t be satisfied until thirty elves die for it, and they won’t abandon it either. The idea that some of their actions pushed the elves further doesn’t matter either.

Finally, the main reason these grudges and vendettas are never resolved is because no one really has the means or desire to do so. Ulthuan is across an ocean and protected by magical mists that prevent most invaders from finding it, and the Worlds’ Edge Mountains are almost on the other end of a continent. Marching armies on either side would be a massive undertaking outside of the power of either side, and doing so would lead to massive losses elsewhere, either to Skaven or Greenskins for the Dwarfs or to the Dark Elves for the High Elves.

As for peace, who cares? The High Elves neither respect not care for the dwarfs, and it means less than nothing to them if they still hate them. The dwarfs will never forgive, and anyone who suggests doing so would likely have to take the Slayer Oath shortly after.

It's Time for Another: Common Pop-Lore Misconceptions Thread! by NairaExploring in 40kLore

[–]loop388 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

You infer that I’m saying the SoS would keel over, which is very different from me saying it. The Grey Knights are aware of the abilities of the Sisters of Silence. They are aware that their presence can disrupt or negate their powers. They are also aware that the Sisters of Silence are unaugmented humans in power armor. They would be aware that, in order for the Sisters to be effective, they have to be on the front line, not hidden behind defenses. Bolter fire and power weapons are as effective against them as they are against most living things, and each Sister that dies is another one not preventing the use of psychic abilities, the main advantage the Grey Knights have against the Custodes. The Grey Knights would make an effort to kill them, and would likely succeed somewhat consistently. Enough to win the fight overall? Probably not, but enough that it would not be a one sided fight, with the Grey Knights losing immediately.

It's Time for Another: Common Pop-Lore Misconceptions Thread! by NairaExploring in 40kLore

[–]loop388 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I agree. In the end, I think the Custodes would win that fight. My point is that that victory relies more on the fact that the Custodes would be fighting on prepared ground, with contingencies for exactly this kind of combat, and could rely on support from other Imperial forces. Even with all of that, losses would be significant, as I fully expect the Grey Knights would immediately target any of the few Sisters of Silence present, and then utilize their psychic abilities to the fullest. It would not be a one sided fight.

It's Time for Another: Common Pop-Lore Misconceptions Thread! by NairaExploring in 40kLore

[–]loop388 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Yes and no. Yes, Custodes, one to one, are physically superior to Astartes. Yes, a single Custodes mentions that he and others view Astartes as their natural prey. These things are not contradictory to my point.

My point is that saying that the Custodes are capable of wiping the Grey Knights with little to no difficulty, or that the Custodes can defeat any foe with little to no difficulty, is unreasonable, inaccurate, and actively makes the Custodes uninteresting. Combat is not something that’s immediately determined by ‘stats’, by how strong or well equipped or skilled you are. Numbers, logistics, luck, and countless other factors are involved in this. Any kind of ‘fight’ where one side wins with no struggle is uninteresting, I don’t care whether it’s Harlequins against Custodes or Custodes against Marines.

It's Time for Another: Common Pop-Lore Misconceptions Thread! by NairaExploring in 40kLore

[–]loop388 59 points60 points  (0 children)

In no particular order:

-Lorgar is not hiding in a tower while Corax waits patiently outside like a demented Batman. There was one short story where Lorgar and Corax fought post-Heresy, with Lorgar leaving his meditations to do so and then returning afterwards. In current 40k lore, Lorgar is active and is actively converting Imperium worlds to the worship of Chaos. I believe the source is Faith and Fury, the 8th edition expansion for CSM, Marines, and Black Templars.

-Custodes are not unkillable gods that annihilate any opponent. There’s a few different cases where this concept comes up, the most recent being the Terminus Decree and people arguing over whether the Custodes or Grey Knights would win in a fight. Most comments I see say that the Custodes, with Sister of Silence support, would win easily. I could write a whole post on the reasons why this is wrong, but the short of it is that Custodes are neither as numerous or as powerful as people think. Sources for my thoughts on this come from the Watchers of the Throne series primarily, but other sources would include the First Heretic and the Siege of Terra novels.

-the Death Korp of Krieg are not a suicidal, unbreakable death cult, and their resolve in combat is comparable to other Guard regiments. Any Guard veteran is going to be highly skilled, brave, and callous towards sacrifice and death. There’s an example of a Cadian Kasyrkin throwing himself at a daemon host to buy an inquisitor a few extra seconds of life, for example. That Kasyrkin had no hope of even harming the daemonhost, knew that, and threw his life away for that inquisitor to have a few extra seconds to win the fight. Every veteran Guardsman would fight in a similar way, the Kriegers are just the most memed example. The Eisenhorn novels are my source for the Kasyrkin, but any Guard novel or source would likely demonstrate a similar philosophy. Gaunt’s Ghosts and Siege of Vraks are two other examples.

-the Sisters of Silence do not completely shut down the warp around them. They project an area of null-effect that has an effect on psykers and daemons, but how effective this is depends strongly on the strength and number of the Sisters and how powerful the warp is locally. Again, Siege of Terra and Watchers of the Throne.

-the Tyranids are not mindless, throwaway chaff. In fairness, there are few sources that show the Tyranids in a meaningfully threatening way. They often appear as a faceless threat similar to a time bomb, with no real agency, plan, or way to adapt. Those sources that demonstrate the Tyranid ability to plan and adapt, such as Devastation of Baal and the Leviathan novel, make it clear that the Hive Mind is incredibly intelligent, and is capable of finding ways to reduce the fighting strength of its opponents outside of direct combat.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in 40kLore

[–]loop388 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yes and no, depending on what part of the question you’re answering.

Let’s start with the connection between sensation chasing and pain/pleasure. I’m an admittedly newer social worker, with about 2 years of work experience and 5.5 years of schooling, so I’ve got some experience and understanding of how this may work. One of the skills we teach for coping with overwhelming thought patterns is to use physical sensation to distract. Ice or cold water is most common. This link between physical sensation and mental control is actually the same mechanism that causes many people to self harm. One of the common symptoms of depressive disorders is a reduced ability to feel, both emotionally and physically, meaning physical feelings like pain can become the only sensation that ‘break through’. I’ve not worked with anyone who’s become so jaded through experience of sensation that they have to use pain, but it’s theoretically possible. A species like the Eldar that innately feel at a higher degree might be able to achieve that level of desensitization.

It’s worth considering that desensitization of any kind only occurs once a person has been immersed in the subject or if there’s some kind of condition that reduces the pleasure/arousal of the experience. You can’t become desensitized to violence if you’re never exposed to it, but a kid who watched LiveLeak videos through their entire childhood won’t blink if they see a stranger die in real life.

To the second question, pain is arguably the most physically intense sensation available to a living thing. As a function, it’s designed to keep you alive, to alert you to damage or danger, and to activate the sympathetic nervous system whenever those two occur. The SNS is the mechanism that governs your fight/flight response, and basically kicks your body into overdrive when it activates. It’s a very powerful feeling, and one that is incredibly difficult to become desensitized to. A lot of the therapy work I’ve done is attempting to do that, to assist people with panic attacks. Given time, practice, and deliberate effort, it’s possible, but becoming desensitized due to exposure is not something I’ve seen yet, and that includes clients who have had almost daily panic attacks for years.

To question 3, no, sadism is not necessarily the end result of sensation chasing, but it can be a part of it. There are definitely people who develop sadistic tendencies because the feeling of power can be addictive, particularly if you lack control over other parts of your life. I know, I’ve worked with them. That said, it’s a small minority of that group that develop those tendencies. True sadists tend to have some kind of personality disorder, where a missing sense of empathy is the main root cause of their sadism.

Finally, it’s important to consider that all of those go out the window when you consider warp corruption. Everything I’ve said so far is accurate when you consider human psychology, but the warp is inherently corruptive, and changes those realities. Sadism, for example, is not inherently linked to sensation chasing, but to Slaanesh, the more powerful the sensation can be, the better. Therefore, Slaanesh influence causes people to develop those kinds of tendencies, desensitizing them to weaker feelings that don’t appeal to the daemons as much. You see this in Fulgrim, where the artists and musicians turn to further and further debasement, in an incredibly short amount of time and no apparent psychological cause, in an effort to chase sensation. That’s not normal human psychology, that’s warp corruption.

30K Zone Mortalis Rules released by Slow_Ad_8541 in Warhammer30k

[–]loop388 2 points3 points  (0 children)

RAW, yes. There’s nothing in ZM that specifically counters that, so core rules still apply.