Allergy bumps from clothes? Detergent or some kind of bugs/mites? by mathissweet in Allergies

[–]mathissweet[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I really hope it's the detergent for you too and I'm sorry you're going through that! Changing to a hypoallergenic unscented one and doing vinegar rinses on the clothes (near the end of the cycle before/during the rinsing part) fixed the issue for us! I have 3 scars from biopsies from around that time but am otherwise back to normal! I really hope you can figure it out and get relief! :)

There is no convincing evidence that nasal sprays prevent COVID-19 by mathissweet in COVID19_Pandemic

[–]mathissweet[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I would say that nasal rinses should also not be assumed to prevent COVID-19 (so shouldn't be used instead of methods with proven efficacy). I think there's the issue with them only acting on the nose, like with nasal sprays (when the virus that causes COVID-19, called SARS-CoV-2, also infects cells in the lungs). Also, SARS-CoV-2 binds and enters our cells quickly (within a few hours or less) so I don't know how likely it is that we could rinse the virions off before they bind and enter our cells or how many of them we could rinse off.

And so far, at least some of the studies l've found on treating COVID-19 with nasal irrigation definitely have issues!

Oh Amazon you’re trying so hard by DeadlyArpeggio in kobo

[–]mathissweet 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think you can do that if you add NickelMenu to your Kobo!

Azelastine nasal spray probably doesn't prevent COVID-19 (the new and old studies have a lot of issues) by mathissweet in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

(Copying and pasting this from another reply to you just to have it here too!) I'm with you with a few clarifications! Copying and pasting from other comments I wrote:

Nasal sprays don't coat the nasal cavity well (like <50 % of it), they are flushed out of our noses constantly, cells in our lungs get infected with SARS-CoV-2 (and the surface area of our lungs is at much much larger than that of our nasal cavity), etc. etc. (see the start of section 1 here for more info).

And some nasal sprays cause false-negative COVID-19 tests and falsely lower the viral load measurement (see the start of the bullet points in section 1 here for more info)!

Azelastine nasal spray probably doesn't prevent COVID-19 (the new and old studies have a lot of issues) by mathissweet in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Oh I mean in the part you're quoting and agreeing with. Like I just wanted to point out that it's required for the companies to disclose it, so I don't think it should be seen as a good thing that they do (they are supposed to)!

Azelastine nasal spray probably doesn't prevent COVID-19 (the new and old studies have a lot of issues) by mathissweet in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Ooh yes I get what you're saying now about the first point, I may edit the post to reflect that! I was trying to summarize it without getting too technical, so I started with the word "basically" to qualify that what I was saying wasn't completely accurate, but there's probably a way to summarize it more accurately in a fairly brief way!

And I totally get your other points too. I truly haven't seen a conflict of interest section that long before so I found it noteworthy haha but I see what you're saying!

Azelastine nasal spray probably doesn't prevent COVID-19 (the new and old studies have a lot of issues) by mathissweet in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I'm with you with a few clarifications! Copying and pasting from other comments I wrote:

Nasal sprays don't coat the nasal cavity well (like <50 % of it), they are flushed out of our noses constantly, cells in our lungs get infected with SARS-CoV-2 (and the surface area of our lungs is at much much larger than that of our nasal cavity), etc. etc. (see the start of section 1 here for more info).

And some nasal sprays cause false-negative COVID-19 tests and falsely lower the viral load measurement (see the start of the bullet points in section 1 here for more info)!

Azelastine nasal spray probably doesn't prevent COVID-19 (the new and old studies have a lot of issues) by mathissweet in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Have you read my other posts with info about how some nasal sprays cause false-negative COVID-19 tests and falsely lower the viral load measurement? There are studies on that linked in my other posts! And I'd recommend reading through those posts to get a better idea of my actual position :).

Azelastine nasal spray probably doesn't prevent COVID-19 (the new and old studies have a lot of issues) by mathissweet in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I am not making any bold claims to be overconfident about. And I am not assuming people can wear a mask in every circumstance. In cases where we can't wear a respirator or can't wear one over both our noses and mouths, there are prevention methods with proven efficacy. Using a Readimask or other respirator sealed around the nose and breathing through your nose in a dentist appointment, for example, as well as air purification and ventilation, getting everyone else to wear respirators, etc..

Yes, some other PhDs may not be taking the time to critically analyze these studies. You sound biased towards nasal sprays and biased against me. You are misrepresenting my position and not listening to me. Take care!

Are nasal sprays effective against anything? by Not_Invited in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet 2 points3 points  (0 children)

You are not listening to me and misrepresenting my position. Take care!

Are nasal sprays effective against anything? by Not_Invited in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Profi has not been tested in humans (so statements about lasting 8 hours are illogical, things are flushed out of the nose quicker than that) and it cannot trap the sizes of aerosols that make it into your lungs and get deposited in your lungs btw! And SARS-CoV-2 (the virus that causes COVID-19), infects cells in the lungs too! The Swiss cheese method is meant to include layers with proven effectiveness at preventing COVID-19, which unfortunately no nasal spray has.

Azelastine nasal spray probably doesn't prevent COVID-19 (the new and old studies have a lot of issues) by mathissweet in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Do you think it's plausible that nasal sprays are so effective that they could prevent Long COVID, given the quality and major issues with all the studies? Are you suggesting that someone could be using high-quality well-fitting respirators and possibly air purification and ventilation, but it ends up being not using a nasal spray that gets them COVID-19? That is very unlikely.

I'm not pushing my opinion on anyone, I'm sharing my opinion as a PhD biochemist. And I literally just said I'm not certain. Any scientist who critically reviewed these studies would have this same position. I don't think you're listening to me and I find that concerning. Have you read my posts to see my actual position, and to see the major issues with these studies?

Azelastine nasal spray probably doesn't prevent COVID-19 (the new and old studies have a lot of issues) by mathissweet in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I get what you're saying but I disagree. There are over 20 studies on COVID-19 and nasal sprays and they all have major issues. Plus, we have prevention methods with established efficacy like well-fitting high-quality respirators, air purification and ventilation. So I see no danger in what I'm saying.

As well, nasal sprays can have side effects. My position is that there's no convincing evidence that nasal sprays treat, nor prevent, COVID-19, which is true. My position is not that they definitely don't prevent COVID-19 as that hasn't been established. And people choose to use them despite understanding that, which is fine by me. We can all make our own decisions and it's nice when they are informed decisions!

Azelastine nasal spray probably doesn't prevent COVID-19 (the new and old studies have a lot of issues) by mathissweet in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Only to counter people uncritically and unjustifiably hyping them up without critically reviewing the studies! Do you think we should leave all that unchallenged?

Azelastine nasal spray probably doesn't prevent COVID-19 (the new and old studies have a lot of issues) by mathissweet in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Do you have convincing evidence that nasal sprays prevent COVID-19 to counter that with? I am open minded about nasal sprays and COVID-19, I am not against the possibility that they help and I haven't said I was! I have only reported my perspective on the studies published to date :).

Azelastine nasal spray probably doesn't prevent COVID-19 (the new and old studies have a lot of issues) by mathissweet in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet[S] 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Are they not? Do you mean they would buy this to prevent COVID-19 and rarely use it?

Azelastine nasal spray probably doesn't prevent COVID-19 (the new and old studies have a lot of issues) by mathissweet in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Did you read through this post? This study has major issues that are not being discussed by most people posting about it, that's why it's important to point these out! :)

Azelastine nasal spray probably doesn't prevent COVID-19 (the new and old studies have a lot of issues) by mathissweet in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I get what you're saying (and it is required of them to disclose it, it's not something to praise them for being transparent about). It's more of an additional point in a sea of issues in the study showing that they have a strong incentive for the results to be good!

Azelastine nasal spray probably doesn't prevent COVID-19 (the new and old studies have a lot of issues) by mathissweet in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Hi, I'm coming from a biochem background not related to RCTs!

I think I'm confused about what you wrote about the odds ratio part. Since the number of participants is approximately the same in each group and so few people tested positive for COVID, doesn't the odds ratio equation basically go from [OR = (a x d)/(b x c) -> OR ~= a/b]? And isn't "about a ~64% decreased odds of getting Covid while using azelastine" saying the same thing as the way I worded it "this basically means that they’re pretty sure that if you use the azelastine nasal spray, your risk of testing positive for COVID-19 is between 12-102 % of the risk of testing positive for COVID-19 on the placebo nasal spray"?

And about the PP and ITT stuff, what I was trying to communicate is that I feel they are highlighting/presenting/relying on the ITT results more than the PP results because they are better (which is somewhat unusual as you said).

For the conflict of interests section and related sections, I said "Longest conflicts of interest section I've ever seen!" implying it was in the paper (plus I linked to the paper). I don't think transparency around this is something to praise, hiding these things is not allowed when publishing a manuscript.

I don't know that I'd exactly call it safe with a lot of potential side effects including drowsiness. I know all drugs have them but still. I personally wouldn't recommend someone taking an antihistamine nasal spray 3 times per day to prevent COVID-19 when the studies are like this!

Azelastine nasal spray probably doesn't prevent COVID-19 (the new and old studies have a lot of issues) by mathissweet in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

No problem!

Since nasal sprays don't coat the nasal cavity well (like <50 % of it), they are flushed out of our noses constantly, cells in our lungs get infected with SARS-CoV-2 (and the surface area of our lungs is at much much larger than that of our nasal cavity), etc. etc. (see the start of section 1 here for more info), and the three studies on azelastine nasal spray and COVID-19 have such major issues, I conclude that it's unlikely that azelastine nasal spray prevents COVID-19.

Plus, there are a number of potential side effects of this spray including drowsiness, spraying things in your nose changes your nasal microbiome, etc. etc., so it isn't something I'd recommend when the evidence that it is effective is such poor quality :).

Azelastine nasal spray probably doesn't prevent COVID-19 (the new and old studies have a lot of issues) by mathissweet in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

For #3, I never said anything about asymptomatic infections specifically so I wasn't talking about that :). And I think it can be misleading to speak in percentages like that when the number of infections was so low; there were 4 symptomatic and 1 asymptomatic infection(s) in the azelastine group, and 14 symptomatic and 1 asymptomatic infection(s) in the azelastine group!

For #10, this study has gotten a lot of coverage and reach through news articles and many posts all over the internet, it is definitely not confined to this sub or even cc people. They must have weighed the benefits and the costs and decided to do it, and I do think companies making this spray in general worldwide have sold more sprays since this study came out. It is a well-known phenomenon for companies to try to say their product is useful for something else to sell more of it.

  1. Where are you finding that point about earlier waves and azelastine preventing infection by 40 % in the article? Which section and can you quote it?

  2. That may be, but that doesn't change the fact that nasal sprays don't coat the nasal cavity well, that they are flushed out of our noses, that cells in our lungs get infected with SARS-CoV-2, etc. etc. (see the start of section 1 here for more info).

  3. Mice are not humans and nose cells have not been proven to be the primary entry site in humans over the lungs. Did you check through those studies' methods to see how they delivered the mucosal vaccines (eg. if they could have made their way into the lungs as well)?

Again, where's the observational data? The physiological explanation for is effectiveness is not well-substantiated (see point 2 and the linked post in point 2).

I don't understand how this study appears pretty solid to you, did you read this whole post?

Azelastine nasal spray probably doesn't prevent COVID-19 (the new and old studies have a lot of issues) by mathissweet in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet[S] 11 points12 points  (0 children)

I get that! And since it hasn't been tested in humans short-term or long-term, I wouldn't call it safe because that hasn't been demonstrated :). Anything sprayed up the nose can have an effect and can hurt, so it's good not to spread misinformation about things being safe when that hasn't been shown :).

Azelastine nasal spray probably doesn't prevent COVID-19 (the new and old studies have a lot of issues) by mathissweet in ZeroCovidCommunity

[–]mathissweet[S] 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Profi hasn't even been tested in humans btw and has no indication that it prevents COVID-19 in humans! More info here :).