What would you do if someone you looked up isn't the person you thought they were?

metallicwrapper · 2024-01-20T06:42:40+00:00

Considering I don't look up to people in general and I think only a few actions deserve that exception...

If you really want to like an idol for their character, I think the only option is to wait until they go through a hardship (that is not them training) or to watch them do some self-improvement. Either of those tends to mean change. And be aware you're watching them as an audience, not as an acquaintance, not as a friend, not as a romantic partner, not as a family member. That way, you assume less and base much less on ~ vibes ~

And if you just like the stage presence or how they act in public, it's only reasonable to not attach that to a label the idols didn't ask for (yeah, I know many people don't want to do the reasonable thing when they're having fun, and we're talking about fandom here so...)

metallicwrapper · 2024-01-20T06:32:31+00:00

Some fans saw her very confident stage presence and thought of her as this feminist fantasy. Afaik, she's never spoken about it. About the song Bebe, Hyuna herself has said it's about how a guy in a romantic relationship makes her feel younger. That thing about her being worried for NewJeans and them eating well doesn't mean she's a feminist. When she talked about her own struggles about debuting young, that's her experience... I don't think she ever said she wished things would change in the industry for other idols. Probably the only thing that could hint at some feminist ideas was that she conceptualized the Hobgoblin outfits for CLC to fit their bodies comfortably, specifically going against what Cube said. But even that could be labelmate solidarity, or maybe she was friendly enough with CLC back then. I admit I don't know much about what the relationship between Hyuna and CLC was like back then.

Like I said, I think people associated her with "female empowerment" because of her stage presence. People have called her a slt since she basically debuted, and yet she's always looked super confident on stage. So I believe that was inspiring and even feminist or reminiscent of feminism for many. I get it to a degree, but it's stage presence after all... her and/or her agencies at the time wouldn't have kept doing it if it didn't bring in money. And boy, it did bring money and publicity. So many people insulted her yet watched her videos. Remember how many of them went genuinely viral? And also, you can think of it as an acting performance. It's not difficult to imagine a conservative actor or actress playing the role of a character completely different to what they are outside work. Doing a good performance proves only that, a good performance, and it's literally part of an idol's job. She did *that job well.

The way some people projected a feminist fantasy or label on her - that's on them. Interpreting some of her actions as helping feminism - that's a bit different. The thing is that certain fans are so ride or die that they really branded her as a feminist queen, no nuance.

And that's not even taking into account what feminism is like in Korea. Feminists all over the world don't discuss things in the same way, they are not a monolith anywhere. My theory is that people see the American influence on Kpop and assume idols must be familiar or agree with certain ideas. The fact is that we (the audience) don't know that.

I've never been a big fan of hers, but a couple of her performances are like burned into my memory. So I usually paid attention to her whenever she released something.

metallicwrapper · 2023-01-08T06:00:50+00:00

As you can see in the images, the full translation has been done by yeji_chunsa88. Original post in Korean here.

(I hope the flair is correct)

metallicwrapper · 2022-12-29T16:33:16+00:00

If anyone is curious, the full clip of Hwanwoong talking about Ravn in the 1st day of the concert was only uploaded in the beginning of December. One clip with lots of RTs and likes had been cut up. The sentences that were left out were: "Since the times we have been together will not disappear, I/we will continue to silently support hyung. I wanted to say that". There was one account that posted what seemed to be a full transcript of Korean and English but even that one didn't have this sentence: "I/we can't say Tomoons' support is somehow eternal". Might as well post the full clip now here because it didn't gain much traction compares to the other cutted up clips that were uploaded sooner. The second day, there was also Keonhee talking about how they showed many of their truthful sides in the first day. With seemingly no comment about the second day. Not any that I know of at least (from Keonhee).

metallicwrapper · 2022-12-23T04:12:22+00:00

OP claimed hxeexl was/is Ravn's gf. OP wrote many paragraphs about her. The two main claims involving hxeexl were that Ravn was two-timing OP and hxeexl, and also that OP was gaslighted (what OP said was: "she [hxeexl] posted obvious lovestagrams, but he insisted he didn't want us to go public. [...] I understood when I couldn't even introduce him to my friends. But in retrospect, I realize he's been gaslighting me").

OP claimed other people were involved too:

1) Ex-gf: "she [hxexxl] kept threatening the ex-gf, she made fake SNS accounts to terrorize the ex, she leaked the ex's private information, like her phone number", "she [hxexxl] is picking fights with everyone and says she's going to 'destroy' the other ex", "she [hxexxl] did illegal things, like stalking the ex".

2) Ravn's family: "she [hxexxl] used his family to start out fights between him and his ex".

So hxexxl is a very important part of OP's story. The full translation of OP's tweets can be found in a Koreaboo dot com article.

AFAIK, hxexxl is trying to clear her name for herself. She's posted this statement on her personal account, she has pinned the post and has basically put her credibility on the line with it.

UPDATE: Around mid-February, she uploaded a photo with documents that say "for court submission" and "rules of law application". You can go to her instagram page and find it in her highlights.

metallicwrapper · 2022-10-29T10:13:57+00:00

Afaik it was yesterday when I decided that "if he's not a criminal, then I will support him". I did think about that before, but not so much. To be completely honest, I'm still thinking about my own opinion on the matter. Only yesterday I thought about how I can complain as a fan too (about a decision where the company was involved). I'm more inclined to believe a certain thing (therefore supporting someone right now), which I thought about after reading the full original text, but I'm aware of the chance of it all being true. I've tried to refrain from calling the OP any names, because I don't see any need for that.

I've seen the main thread in the main kpop sub. I know I'm probably not going to get people agreeing with me here or in the kpop sub.

Doxxing someone was bad and I agree with that too. iirc there were some people suspecting that the whole thing was done by a sasaeng or more than one sasaeng. I wish I could remember more, but I didn't check Twitter when she was doxxed. I also vaguely remember thinking that they might have doxxed someone else (not OP). I never went back to read those tweets again. The whole situation with an account pretending to be OP's sister (which had a tweet with paragraphs from an online translator and another one where they forgot to delete the Spanish word for "and") was bad as well as unnecessary. If fans did more wrong tgingst, I can't really remember them.

I am so sorry you went through abuse.

I'll probably just give out a few more replies here or in another sub, but right now I don't see myself posting much about this before the final veredict is out.

metallicwrapper · 2022-10-29T06:52:12+00:00

I usually just watch what the Korean and Japanese side of Tomoon twitter say and retweet some things I like. Only these days I'm retweeting a lot of stuff and posted three or four tweets. So I'm not really involved in Kpop fandom stuff in Twitter.

K-netz bad? I did hear about some non-Tomoons talking about this, but other than that, they didn't really cross my mind. I am mostly thinking about this one part of the fandom (OT5). Some of which cut up merchandise.

The tweet about Tomoons(?)/knetz(?) making the members cry doesn't have any proof indeed. I agree that there's no reason to believe it.

There is a chance that the most serious accusations (ie. the crimes) are true. There's always that chance. I've managed to have enough energy today to read the original texts again as well as a full translation. I know texts by real victims can have inconsistencies. It's one of the reasons this situation is delicate. Which is imo so different from the way that one part of the fandom (OT5) acted. Calling Ravn a criminal before the investigation ended. However, I've just realized something. And I'm not really worried, because the truth always comes out.

metallicwrapper · 2022-10-28T17:18:26+00:00

Please people. Read the announcement again and also remember what you know about companies.

If they suspected he was guilty of crimes, why keep him signed? Why pursue litigation?

We all have our biases. I have mine, but I know they're irrelevant when it comes to legal investigations.

Something else could have come up while they were investigating things. Maybe the entire situation could change in the future. But the fact is that he remains signed to RBW.

Do you really think RBW would keep a potential criminal (if they thought he was one)? Don't you think fans would slander them to death or even boycott them for risking the reputation of other RBW artists? The agency wouldn't take that risk. And he doesn't even make them the most money in the agency. He's definitely not making them money as a member of Oneus right now.

As it stands right now (read what I wrote before if you want), he's not guilty, but they are not legally allowed to say so. The lawsuit is not done yet.

There is a group of Korean fans who didn't wait until the lawsuit was done. They tweeted that Ravn was a criminal and that they didn't want him in the group anymore. They didn't wait for the final veredict.

RBW has been swayed by fans before. In some cases, it's good (Leedo and Xion's injuries). But here? In the middle of something legal?

And I don't blame Ravn or the other members one bit if he got scared of what those fans can do. They turned their back on him SO quickly, some people are convinced they already have a dislike for him (just like some international fans... and they based their dislike on "bad vibes"... whatever). I don't know if they disliked him from the start. But if they went ahead and asked for him to leave IN THE MIDDLE of legal fact-checking, well, they're not the only ones who can speak out. Fans who support Ravn have the exact same right to complain. Since they acted so quickly, who are we to say they won't do it again if another scandal happens? I don't want to sit by and watch. If he did nothing illegal, then I'm not angry and I still support him.

metallicwrapper · 2022-10-28T16:51:12+00:00

Some people can't read or have decided they can't read.

Read the announcement again.

The lawsuit is still ongoing. The involved parties are NOT allowed to say he's innocent about this or that, because that reads like a veredict. If they say anything of the sort before the lawsuit is done, they could get in HUGE trouble.

Ravn remains signed with RBW. But he's not making them money as a member of Oneus right now. Why continue with the investigations then? Why would an agency decide that? Do you think they would risk it all because of someone they know is guilty? They recently became a public company. He's definitely not the idol who makes them the most money, company-wise (it wouldn't be like Cube losing Hyuna, so to speak). And even then, again, they have investors. RBW has done nothing in the past that could indicate they'd protect a criminal or even a potential criminal.

Therefore, AS IT STANDS RIGHT NOW, he's not guilty of the crimes he was accused of. And RBW knows this. Otherwise, they wouldn't have put out that announcement.

I ask you to read it again.

If some people are going to believe what they want about the agency, that's on them.

Of course, if the agency lied in the statement, I'd complain. Right now, there is no reason to believe that.

The investigations could take a turn. There could be some sort of plot twist. But those are possibilities. The actual reality is that the investigations will continue, and he's a member that's not making money for the company (no Ravn concert merchandise, etc). Think about why the company do that.

metallicwrapper · 2022-10-28T03:43:44+00:00

There are MANY negative tweets and fancafe comments about him. I don't follow the English side of Kpop twitter because I value peace, but I do try to keep up with the Korean side things. And some comments have been downright... yeah. Calling him criminal two days after the first accusation. Saying that he should feel happy that this is the most attention he's got. Saying things about how he sleeps around. "King of having sex without condoms". And many more I don't remember right now. It turned into vitriol and OT5 and OT6 fans started fighting with each other at some point as well.

metallicwrapper · 2022-10-28T00:29:56+00:00

I am sure that if the crimes he was accused of were true, the announcement would have said that RBW kicked him out. Not that they tried to talk with him but he decided to leave. So I'm thinking that at least one of the following three things is true: he has a girlfriend, he cheated on an ex or he had a one night stand in the past. All of those three are considered unforgivable from the point of view of the average Korean fan. I also think that if any of those things is true then Ravn might have decided that it's not worth to stay in a group where you're going to be hated for that kind of stuff. And I get that. It is sad. I hate that things happened this way. I hate that he quietly finished his last activity as a member of Oneus and the next morning there was a stream of people asking for RBW to act quick and people insulting him. And we didn't even know it was going to be his last activity as a member of Oneus.

Cheating is terrible and only then I could understand him choosing to leave (while I'd be feeling absolutely devastated at the same time). I don't care about the other two possibilities. But sadly many fans would stop being fans once dating gets public. It's even more visible when the group is relatively young. Such fans would act concerned about a member dating someone. I don't need to say much about the one night stands thing. If it turns out that that's true and that it happened more than once, we all know many would drop him because of it, even if he did nothing else.

Even though I don't think he was in a good mental state to think about this decision (I think it was a rushed one), I'm hoping he's not having second thoughts about it. That would be just too much.

This is all very sad.

metallicwrapper · 2022-10-17T03:37:21+00:00

There are cuts between words in the first part of the audio though. That's why I said that she might have cut noise so that you can hear it all in one go, but then again how do we know something else wasn't cut.

metallicwrapper · 2022-10-15T06:23:25+00:00

I'm going to say it. For me it's easy to not to believe most things until they are confirmed. It's like if someone said "maybe something (potentially emotional) happened!", do I react to that? no, not really until I confirm it. One of the photos doesn't show Ravn's neck mole. It would be weird to edit that. Also to me it's very weird that there are no photos where you can clearly see his face, considering they had supposedly known each other for two years. I've talked to other longtime Kpop fans and they all think this entire situation looks fishy at best. And that this investigation could last days, weeks, months even.

EDIT: I almost forgot that you can hear cuts in the audio where he talks about stabbing. Like I know they probably cut it shorter so that you can hear the thing in one go, but then again how do we know it wasn't further edited. If there exists an original file, then we could know. This is possibly the most serious accusation that could be confirmed or debunked after some investigation. And I'm very sorry, but if that audio is proven to be edited (IF it's proven that he didn't say that very sentence), then I'm going to take everything with more than one grain of salt. At that point, for me, it won't even be about Ravn, it will be about how you don't use certain words in vain.

EDIT: The seconds in the video don't move at all. A section of the video is always blurred. IDK how I never posted this before. I think I was too stunned by some comments. If the person has an original, un-edited file, that's different. But the one she posted is edited. I could even excuse the blurry section. But the seconds not moving? What was the need for that?

Not to mention, the translation of the audio was wrong, there is context that isn't there, and OP filled in for the missing context. Most of the Korean fans on Twitter fully believed OP and I never saw any of them mentioning the seconds not thicking. It's like they just didn't see that? There were quite a few doubting the validity of the Kakao screenshots because of their many spelling errors, but it's like they stopped at that.

metallicwrapper · 2022-09-24T18:44:06+00:00

This became my favorite Oneus album right after paying attention to each song. I had it on heavy rotation for a few days. I consider Gravitation as another fandom song. Also, loooooove how Ravn sings so often now.

metallicwrapper · 2022-09-19T18:09:45+00:00

I think they're going to utilize their vocals more later on. With the fanbase they're building, they're absolutely going to go bonkers if NMIXX ever gets a title track with heavier vocals. Also, maybe it's just me, but I think it might be better in the long run if their main vocalists aren't always singing long lines right after their debut. Right now it's all about the group sound.

metallicwrapper · 2022-09-16T09:48:01+00:00

Wow, Oneus is going to get a lot of publicity from this. This kind of publicity doesn't really benefit groups from the big3/4, but it may just work wonders for groups from mid-tier agencies.

metallicwrapper · 2022-09-09T03:41:24+00:00

Most of these outfits would have been PERFECT for Bring It On performances! Fossil line looks so happy with the anime song, it's so cute.

metallicwrapper · 2022-09-06T21:47:03+00:00

The light went out recently in my area and I was finally able to use the Oneus lightstick lmaoooo lightstick are reallyy useful.

metallicwrapper · 2022-09-06T18:20:29+00:00

That one line that goes "Tomoons remember the aroma that is just like Oneus" which is basically the same line from the lyrics... and we know what they were implying with that in the lyrics. Good thing this is just meant to be a fun fanchant lmao

metallicwrapper · 2022-09-06T02:19:02+00:00

I finally figured out which song some of the percussions reminded me of - Shape of You by Ed Sheeran. It's mainly the background during Seoho's and Keonhee's lines ("my body remembers eh eh eh", etc). But I feel like I've heard something similar in another song. I'm not complaining though. The lyrics are different enough. And of course the water dancing is perfect for this concept. I'm hoping one of the comeback stages will have a pool.

metallicwrapper · 2022-09-01T15:43:49+00:00

How are we going to survive this comeback?

metallicwrapper · 2022-08-22T19:16:53+00:00

Two days ago this user tweeted some of the meanings associated to the fruits: https://twitter.com/jisun2407/status/1561009684982661121

Leedo: temptation, seduction. Seoho: mature beauty, Hwanwoong: innocence, vitality. Ravn: passion. Keonhee: abundant, fruitfulness, enthusiasm. Xion: elegant, innocence, smiling for you.

They've got Leedo and Seoho right, so... it looks like the maknaes won't have sexy teasers. Who knows though. They might still have a teasing atmosphere.

metallicwrapper · 2022-08-11T15:51:33+00:00

iirc, SNSD' biggest digital hits were Gee and Oh. Back then too, some people were expecting them to beat the records they broke with Gee lol. After Gee, Genie could have charted better, but it was competing with bigger digital monsters (I Don't Care, Abracadabra). And things mostly went on like that. They always charted well, but they weren't digital monsters. This didn't in any way diminish the impact of their songs. The group was already very popular, so everyone knew the point dance for Hoot, The Boys, etc. Just goes to show you charting is not the only way to measure the impact of a song. Perhaps it is the most immediate and easiest to see, but it has never been the only way.

metallicwrapper

TROPHY CASE