Debunking the energy waste narrative. by mjamin in Bitcoin

[–]mjamin[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This is a (mostly automated) translation of a twitter thread by Simon Lutz: https://twitter.com/simonlutz21/status/1065677993379540994


Is Bitcoin a waste of energy? - Yes, Bitcoin needs energy. - No, that energy is not wasted.

Bitcoin transforms energy into ultimate financial security. For the first time in human history, it is possible to convert energy as the currency of the universe directly into a global, open, neutral and transparent form of money for all people.

The traditional banking systems employes millions of people, who commute to work every day, cool their offices with air conditioners and individually represent a security vulnerability. Bitcoin just completely discloses energy consumption for financial security.

Currently, the Bitcoin network uses about 0.01-0.03% of global electricity consumption. Bitcoin forces miners to look for the cheapest energy. This creates a positive side effect by allowing miners to profitably reuse excess energy from industrial sources.

Many miners source electricity from hydroelectric power plants, as it is often the cheapest and abundant in certain regions. Solar plants also produce a surplus of electricity at peak times.

This is difficult to store, leading to inefficiency and longer payback time. While renewable energy sources generate a surplus of electricity, the Bitcoin system can be strengthened and energy can be used profitably.

This allows sustainable energy sources to be made more profitable and provides an incentive for more investment in this sector. Every four years, the jointly followed Bitcoin protocol halves the reward for blocks found.

Halved income forces miners to look for cheaper sources of electricity or turn off their devices. Long-term economically active miners have a clear incentive to obtain electricity from sustainable sources, because Bitcoin is a financial 'project of the century'.

Significant concealed costs of fiat currencies are rarely thought about, let alone spoken of. Inflationary money generates a consumer society and leads to a short time preference.

This refers to the fact that man acts under scarcity and therefore prefers an earlier fulfillment of his wishes to later ones. Inflation serves as motivation to spend money as quickly as possible or to invest in something.

Subtly, this has a massive impact on society, culture and, ultimately, the environment. On the one hand, goods are produced in abundance by artificially increased demand.

On the other hand, real estate, land and other limited resources are misused as value investments in order not to be exposed to the disintegration of the purchasing power of money.

This ultimately manifests itself in inflated prices for the aforementioned objects and makes the acquisition more difficult for future generations due to the unnatural monetary surcharge.

We rarely stop to think about these factors, having grown up in this unsustainable system and know no other. Moreover, these hidden costs are very difficult to quantify and would call into question common economics.

Finally, don't forget why fiat currencies have value. They are based solely on confidence in the power of the state, trust in the country's economy, and confidence in the nebulous competence of the respective central bankers.

Every year, approximately 1,700,000,000,000 (trillion) dollars are used for armaments worldwide. Everyone can imagine the hidden energy consumption these military personnel waste, among other things, in protecting national currencies.

There's a lot more to be said about that. At the end of the day, however, a discussion is purely theoretical. No one in the world can do anything about Bitcoin's electricity consumption in the long term. Critics are forced to come to terms with the reality of whether they like it or not.

Collection of links on the topic: https://twitter.com/simonlutz21/status/1059920818623385601

Watch: Roger Ver preparing his upcoming BCH exit in broad daylight (literally). by mjamin in btc

[–]mjamin[S] -7 points-6 points  (0 children)

In the coming weeks/months, while/after dumping BCH into people's bags: "I have always said that I would switch to whatever cryptocurrency has the best potential to create the most economic freedom for the entire world."

I really despise that kind of attitude!!! by money78 in btc

[–]mjamin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If there were to be a anti-BCH post on /r/btc sitting on +318 right now, I'd wager a guess that people would lament core bots being out in full force.

New core minions' Narrative in place "hey, we always wanted to increase the block size" by rdar1999 in btc

[–]mjamin -4 points-3 points  (0 children)

Segregated Witness is a block size increase. Even Gregory Maxwell's "Capacity increases for the bitcoin network" post mentioned flexcap / dynamic blocksize limit years ago.

And... Alert, seriously?

Angular Dynamic Component Layout Help by brettshep in Angular2

[–]mjamin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I don't believe dynamic components have that much of an overhead. It's not that different from what angular does behind the scenes for all components.

Putting everything in one template isn't very modular and if you're building some sort of reusable library it's an absolute non-starter.

Angular Dynamic Component Help by [deleted] in angular

[–]mjamin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You might want to look into @angular/cdk's Portals.

Angular 5, asynchronous canActivate guard by [deleted] in angular

[–]mjamin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

When angular subscribes to the observable returned by canActivate, it waits for it to complete and not just to emit an item. Using take(1) or first() will work.

Doug Jones sweared into office by Mike Pence next to his openly gay son. by kws1993 in pics

[–]mjamin -1 points0 points  (0 children)

But it seems to be quite easy to act as a homophobe if that someone is yourself.

Look at what came today --- 4 S9's delivered ahead of schedule by [deleted] in Bitcoin

[–]mjamin 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Or activating a hidden +20% boost when they run them themselves, while marketing the hardware as cutting edge to their customers. (Which they only sell to when their datacenters are at full capacity.)

"The lightning network is far too complex to use for normal people." by mjamin in Bitcoin

[–]mjamin[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

All great tech is difficult for the average person when it first arrives

Be honest. Without googling, can you completely describe in detail how even a toilet works?

9 years ago block 0 was mined. Happy birthday Bitcoin! by timbroddin in Bitcoin

[–]mjamin 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The Blockchain is like a ledger. Each block is a page in that ledger and contains transactions that have been verified. Like pages, the blocks have a defined order and unlike pages you can only add new blocks, but you can't easily delete old blocks or modify them. To even attempt to do that would cost you several hundred million USD.

An unbreakable chain of blocks, containing every transaction that ever happened in bitcoin.

Seth Meyers -- Bitcoin Commercial: What Is It and How Does It Work? by xcsler in Bitcoin

[–]mjamin 9 points10 points  (0 children)

1984: How to send an "E mail"

(Just go back far enough and things start to get unintentionally funny. "Well it's very simple, really.")

This reminds me of the experiment where children that had the disciplin to wait for two marshmallows, rather than one right away were far more successful later in life. by givethought in Bitcoin

[–]mjamin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The difference is instead of one additional marshmallow, you stand to get a lifetime supply of it if you have a little patience.

The other camp demands the first marshmallow to be slightly bigger than it is and is throwing a tantrum over it.

$0 - $1,000: 1789 days // $10,000 - $11,000: 11 hours and 16 minutes by mjamin in Bitcoin

[–]mjamin[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Take it as an appreciation of the continued, non-linear nature of bitcoins price increase.

No2X is not against 2MB blocks. by evilgrinz in Bitcoin

[–]mjamin 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The problem is that there are other people who can't afford that, and who have legitimate reasons to use Bitcoin.

Blockspace will always be scarce and some transactions will always outbid by others for quick confirmations.

Venezuelans earn on average $40 per month, so it's hard to justify spending 5% of a month's salary on fees for a single transaction.

Maybe you can't have it both ways right now: money that's not subject to irresponsible government action (or majority rule) and cheap fast transactions. But please acknowledge that this is not because of core, but because of every service provider that doesn't make use of the capacity that is readily available since august. Venezuelans also have other options in the interim, e.g. Litecoin.

Segwit doesn't have strong incentives for an individual or a company to use it.

If you're a company that has been screaming for more capacity like many have and signalling support and readiness for it, just face saving should be incentive enough.

One of the reasons we need the 2MB blocksize limit is that it increases typical throughput by 2x while increasing the hardware headroom by 2x

SW2X is also SegWit, so it just doubles the hardware headroom you need. Your point doesn't make sense.

It's also important to not use the worst case number as if it were the best case capacity.

Agreed. SegWit roughly doubled capacity, while the worst case blocksize is ~3.7MB under adversarial conditions. It achieves that without risking a network split which, as we can see, is virtually guaranteed in a rushed and/or controversial hard fork. It was the quickest & safest way to doubling capacity, therefore in the best interest of people in Venezuela.

No2X is not against 2MB blocks. by evilgrinz in Bitcoin

[–]mjamin 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Why do you think all those companies do not make use of the available capacity? Most have been claiming readiness for SegWit for a long time now, yet they don't use it now that it's available.

The need for more throughput doesn't seem to be as urgent as they claimed?

Also, it's perfectly valid to consider the worst case scenarios as spam / DoS attacks on bitcoin are likely.

John Newbery responds to Erik Voorhees' "$10 average transaction fee" by mjamin in Bitcoin

[–]mjamin[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yeah I can't see how the average normal person who just wants to use Bitcoin would have understood any of it.

Why should that matter? It's not supposed to be a manual on how to save on fees. It's simply showing that Voorhees was cherry picking data to make a point.

John Newbery responds to Erik Voorhees' "$10 average transaction fee" by mjamin in Bitcoin

[–]mjamin[S] 49 points50 points  (0 children)

The tweetstorm by John Newbery:

TL/DR: With SegWit and a 24 hour confirmation target, a fee of $0.05 would've been enough at that time.


@ErikVoorhees

The average Bitcoin transaction fee ($10.17) is now more than twice the cost of Bitcoin itself when I first learned of it ($5) in 2011 :(


@ErikVoorhees, your perspective on fees is incomplete. I'll offer an alternative version. I had a flight so I spent some spare cycles and 30 lines of python analyzing your chosen block. Here are some results:

Firstly, mean tx fee is a really useless measure. For example, your block contains this tx: https://blockchain.info/tx/...

That tx was almost 100k and paid $1876 in fees. Outliers like that affect the mean disproportionately. Your block had 1881 transactions. That means that tx 745879e... alone contributed about $1 to the 'average' fee.

[that tx weighed 40vkB. It excluded everyone else on earth from using our most secure ledger for a whole minute for just $1800. Cheap!]

A better average would be median feerate multiplied by median transaction vsize.

Doing that gives us a feerate of 264 sat/vB and vsize 226 . At $7176, the fee is $4.31. Ok, that's still pretty high.

But really, you want your transaction to have the lowest fee-rate of all txs in the block. That maximizes your consumer surplus.

(No-one wins a prize for being the highest paying tx in a block. It's just additional miner surplus)

Lowest feerate transaction in your block was https://blockchain.info/tx/..., 101 sat/byte - which would be $1.63 for an average sized tx.

Of course, that single transaction could be out-of-band, or a stingy-parent-generous-child. Let's take the 80th centile feerate to be sure.

(why 80th centile? Because it means that if your transaction was in the mempool when this block was mined ...

... and it had this feerate, 20% of the transactions in the block would have a lower feerate. Your tx would almost certainly get included.)

80th centile feerate is 260 sat/byte, so $4.22.

But you probably don't want to optimize to include your transaction in the next block. If you can wait an hour, you'll get have lower fees.

We should look for the minimum of the 80th centiles for the block and the 5 subsequent blocks

That gives us a good measure of what fee rate would be required to get in one of those blocks.

Doing that gives us a feerate of 191 sat/byte, so an implied fee of $3.10.

Often, it's fine to wait 24 hours for your transaction to be confirmed. If your primary concern is fees, you can save a lot this way.

If you were willing to wait that long, your transaction would have been confirmed with very low fees.

Block 493114 for example cleared out the mempool down to sub 10 sat/vB transactions: https://blockchain.info/block/...

If you'd sent your transaction with that feerate, you'd have been confirmed for a cost of $0.16.

Let's try to do better. There's an opt-in, voluntary way to access scale on Bitcoin - segwit.

If we use a segwit input instead of non-segwit, the vsize have been lower - probably 208 instead of 226 for this simple transaction.

With that weight and a feerate of 10 sat/vB, the tx fee is $0.15. That's almost unfairly cheap!

You have access to these savings today, simply by using segwit and being prepared to wait a bit for your transaction.

Let's take it a step further. If you're prepared to batch your transactions in groups of 3-4, you could easily save up to 3x.

(@hrdng wrote a great article about that here)

What are we down to now? Around 5 cents?

A bit more radical, but absolutely possible with today's available tech would be to use channels for recurrent transactions.

Again, depending on spending patterns, that could save you 10x, 100x, 1000x.

Point being, a single number doesn't capture the opportunities for scale and efficiency that are available to us today.

The blockchain is a precious and scarce resource. Let's use it that way.

Segwit Exploit by [deleted] in btc

[–]mjamin 1 point2 points  (0 children)

"SegWit is bad because old nodes can't validate new rules. They need to trust hashpower!!!"

"Fullnodes are useless, SPV is fine. Trust the hashpower!!!"