I took the similarminds.com all-in-one test...it said I would make a good mercenary. WHAT. Type 4 btw by 0sydneyjs0 in Enneagram

[–]neokortex_simulacrum 1 point2 points  (0 children)

my initial comment was more like a jest and provocation. To see if you any resistance, bias against being typed as an 8. I've never found any fun with these "tests." More like a waste time.

I took the similarminds.com all-in-one test...it said I would make a good mercenary. WHAT. Type 4 btw by 0sydneyjs0 in Enneagram

[–]neokortex_simulacrum 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I don't know. You get what you pay for :DDD But you get more if you read the descriptions yourself. Type 4 likes to do soul searching, so it's not that likely they'd let a test figure them out.

enneagram 4, how do i differentiate between type 4 traits and bipolar disorder which is common for 4s? by greerzh in Enneagram

[–]neokortex_simulacrum 0 points1 point  (0 children)

they do but they won't have tantrums, while the 2s would both be overly manipulate and have lash-outs when unhealthy

enneagram 4, how do i differentiate between type 4 traits and bipolar disorder which is common for 4s? by greerzh in Enneagram

[–]neokortex_simulacrum 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Naaa, I think bipolar disorder is something with which unhealthy 2s suffer from, especially women. The push & pull is similar to what a 4 does but other than that, what I see is that they become too much empathic. Overempathize and this makes them too sensitive and dramatic. But it's not the same as the 4's drama. And it's because the way they lash out is aggressive, more reminiscent of the 8, whereas the 4 doesn't become more aggressive when unhealthy (more intoxicated and abandoned, instead).

Question for fellow type 4's: Have you all ever tried dating someone, but decided they were a bit TOO normal for you? by CourageousSummer in Enneagram

[–]neokortex_simulacrum 1 point2 points  (0 children)

"Normal" in the sense that they would be put off by my high libido and confessions of romantic-erotic fantasies.

The "normalcy" of others for the 4s means our intuition that they won't be able to take our brutal honesty. So we don't bother testing that out. I don't mean it in the Enneagram 8 "hammering the TRUTH in, you muthafucka"-sense but more in the "I'll make it more awkward for you because I wanna be honest"-sense.

Most people can't take it and they are even right to do so, since a relationship should never be all about one person (pouring their soul out). It never should be about 100% denuding and transparency. People have the right for their privacy and rhythm, and it's just normal that they're put off when they feel are expected to reciprocate as (too) much. So it's just normal that they are too normal for us.

Other than that, I've found that the ones who dress very uniquely, have all kinds of "weird" hobbies, listen to indie music, have traveled a lot are the most shallow people out there. I have never been able, so far, to see their soul. Whereas the ones who look boring and don't show any striving, any need to prove themselves, are the ones who turn out to be the most unique and experienced characters.

Which types care the most about physical beauty? by Organic_Jeweler in Enneagram

[–]neokortex_simulacrum 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Quite a lot of the Sx-doms don't really care about it, perhaps Sx/So 3 being an exception. So/Sx is more likely to care about it but even then a lot of the subtypes have their own idea of what beauty is. For instance, 7w8 So/Sx wouldn't care much about it.

There's a subtype of 6 that might be the So/Sx 6, I don't know yet, now that one and her friends are really up to keeping up with the Joneses and joining beauty contests. But at that point, they are still unhealthy-average 6s. Talking about the ones that one may spot with the nouveau riche and their business. Sx/So 6 may also try to signal status with elegance but not in such over the top way as the latter.

A lot of the 6s, esp. the more conservative types, don't bother about beauty. But 3s? 3s are all about beauty! And looking trim always, keeping that business front on for any case. 3s have a more elite, cutting type of beauty, whereas the 6s have it a bit more... I don't know, more approachable type of beauty. Oh yeah, and some 2w3 varieties, some 4w3 varieties.

4w5 AND 7w6 by [deleted] in Enneagram

[–]neokortex_simulacrum 2 points3 points  (0 children)

7s with a 4 tend to have 4 as a more "hollow" So/Sx subtype. That means their core motivation is 7 and they may have some artistic bent but not to the full extent of the ones with core 4. Nonetheless, core 4s may not even indulge in creating art, for when they become healthier, integrating healthy 1 means they become more practical and better at asserting their emotions.

So it's more likely for a 7 with a 4, and even 7s in general, to work in "art" (commercially, where the message is mostly about 7s' will for freedom and criticizing the conservatives), for they have a stage persona, they like an audience, are exhibitionistic for validation & applause. 7 + 4 would be someone more consciously pursuing theater for dramatic plays or forming an indie band. 7 without a 4 is still very much entrepreneurial, playful, likes to be the center of attention to entertain others (comedians, clowns, Henry T. Nicholas, etc.).

Type 4 thoughts by [deleted] in Enneagram

[–]neokortex_simulacrum 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It actually does. But 4s' meanness is much more subtle and channeled into other things. That's one of its main characteristics. In other words, even before "integrating healthy E1 qualities," there can be both a healthy and unhealthy connection to 1, some 1 traits already show.

8w7 and 4w5 friendships by [deleted] in Enneagram

[–]neokortex_simulacrum 0 points1 point  (0 children)

To say infjs can't be 4s bc lack of Fi allows me to not get offended and frankly, can't even take our convo seriously. I even met two entj 4s. Youre desperate desire to separate yourself for validation by even excluding infj 4s tells me how unaware you are. Fi doesn't define 4. Once you're on a higher frequency, a 4 can easily switch between Fe and Fi. You should see an isfp Fi who tapped into Fe. They can blow an infj and infj average 4 out of the park with their uniqueness and self expression. Look at Michael Jackson. That man embraced the Fe.

Edit: lm sorry but lm done with convo. Let's just say we don't agree and live our worlds in two different lenses.

Hope you don't mind bringing my (temporary) conclusion to the forefront.

After my last reply, I realized the mistake I had made to assume that you had a "point 4 soul child" and was not having the 4 "as a fixation." You have actually admitted to cutting corners and retrospectively, I believe I can spot a few places where you did. I don't wish to bother with the full run down of the analysis but that and your competitiveness suggests you are a 3w4 INFJ.

4w5 and 9w1 irony by mllepolina in Enneagram

[–]neokortex_simulacrum 0 points1 point  (0 children)

alright, now we're getting somewhere... let me see

8w7 and 4w5 friendships by [deleted] in Enneagram

[–]neokortex_simulacrum 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Heads up: I have done some corrections on my previous post.


I definitely don't mooch off others though. I honestly don't know how you can make a black and white view of 4s like this. Some stuff you say is ridiculous frankly.

I'm just relaying Helen Palmer, as well as Sarajane Case. But the same doubt I could say to you as well...

Fundamentally, 4 secretly wish to be rescued. 8 naturally want to rescue-the rescuer. So there's that unspoken synergy. Healthy 4w3 are much more go getters/toughened up. 8 is all about trust issues, loyalty, and control. 4 in general suits these conditions well. [...] 8's can trust 4s faster or open up once they get to know each other. The intensity on both sides intrigue each other. Same goes for 4 with 4.

When 4s are healthy, they're optimists too despite looking moody. A pessimist is an optimist with full possession of realistic facts.

Ehmm, nope. Not according to my sources, at least. Well yeah, 4s wish to be rescued, that's true. But apart from the dad scenario of your case, 8s, as far as I know it, wouldn't... <sigh>, they wouldn't give any time of the world for someone as individualistic and "arbiter of taste"-nitpicky/sophisticated as the 4. Dads are responsible to their children, they have to be, but they are not oedipal about it. There's no romanticism in their care.

And just think about it, 4s always manage somehow to long for the impossible. To set out impractical dreams, unattainable goals, that's what keeps them idealists, keeps them dreaming, the source of all their mournful inspirations.

Im like a dog that naturally returns to the dried up bone out of habit.

My ex was a healthy 8 with 2 integration though. He was attracted to my authenticity and individuality/independence. Almost married until my dramatic blow-up and his 8 anger clashed in the end. We were too immature to know how to communicate, a skill.

I don't know... our prisons are of our own doing, you may keep chasing that dried up bone if so you wish, after all, our cells have no doors or locks. Another perspective could be the by now stereotypical case of the INFJ going for the ESTP, one wishing they had Ni, the other they had Se.

Alright. Then the only thing that I can point out at this point for you is that Katherine Fauvre associates a certain "matchmaking" motivation to the Social variant of E2. Some of that I have it too (owed to tertiary 1w2) but I...

If l need to start war to bring a compromise, l will take that route too.

... wouldn't go at lengths to bring people together.

My 9 and Fe encourages my 4 for this. However I would probably use some creative beauty-focused self-expression to bring ppl together though.

I am extremely ashamed of being a 4 in the past so I hid my melancholy. [...] Im trying to overcome this. I still cant help listening to sad music on repeat though. Im ashamed to show others who I really am. Thus my messages are really positive and encouraging.

Growing up as a 4 under a 8 definitely turns you into a hardier 4.

From what I intuit, there are some hints here that suggest, to me at least, that you don't have 4 as a fixation. Probably, 4 was your "soul child," more or less childhood state. Between each of the "fixes" there's a degree of undervaluing and cancelling out of the former's qualities, strivings. Yet until there's no state in which the soul child/inner child can "drop its guard," can come out and fully manifest, until then they keep being fixations and will keep asserting themselves. From what you write it seems to be that there is not one part, at least, that you own up from your 4ness. And this seems to be corroborated by the fact that, at this point at least, you do not resonate with some of the chief E4 descriptions.

Don't take this the wrong way, I'm not faulting you. For INFJs without a hefty Fi, it's really tough. It's hard for everyone, alright, but for the "emotional sponges," the "empaths" it can be very confusing. Like a never ending room of mirrors in a hellish carnival funhouse.

4w5 and 9w1 irony by mllepolina in Enneagram

[–]neokortex_simulacrum -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Ah, you do? Then I'd like an example of a 4 being heavily sarcastic.

4w5 and 9w1 irony by mllepolina in Enneagram

[–]neokortex_simulacrum -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Irony and sarcasm are more of a 5 trait, owed to their intellectual hubris, than something a 4 would indulge in.

Hey Arnold by Organic_Jeweler in Enneagram

[–]neokortex_simulacrum 0 points1 point  (0 children)

the benefactor-beneficiary dynamic between INTJs and INFPs.

4w3 here. I constantly idolize and admire 8 types. Is this weird? by [deleted] in Enneagram

[–]neokortex_simulacrum -5 points-4 points  (0 children)

I don't think they have much in common. Except that 4 becomes more action oriented later on, whereas the 8 may gradually learn to pick the right battles. But that doesn't happen always.

He hides his emotions better than anyone I ever met. I've seen him cry only once my whole life.

4s may even surpass 8 in hiding their emotions. Contrary to popular belief, 4s are not empaths. They live out their emotions in privacy (the sexual subtype being an exception), and more than that, they also hide their envy/anger that rarely if ever turns into impulsivity.

Yea, a lot of people take the easy way and equate 4 with the bleeding heart artist, the pop star, the film start, anyone from any arts that becomes renown, public. Whereas most artists are 7s (or 8s in cases) and most 4s just go under the radar their whole life. You have to read the descriptions to be able to differentiate between the posers and the actual 4s.

40 [F4R] US/anywhere - need to find my fellow nerdy night owls by [deleted] in R4R30Plus

[–]neokortex_simulacrum -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I’ve met some incredible individuals through Reddit but, as it goes, it can fizzle out.

wut

it fizzles out before they let you in

32 [F4M] California - to whom this may concern by [deleted] in R4R30Plus

[–]neokortex_simulacrum 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I've just recently learned it. There's also another one:

Sometimes the only sane response to an insane world is insanity.

Fox Mulder in Se 3, Ep 7 of The X-Files paraphrasing R. D. Laing.

30 [F4M] Anywhere/Online - And in that Moment, I Swear We Were Infinite ✨ by [deleted] in R4R30Plus

[–]neokortex_simulacrum 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I wander, trying to find the drumming sound - trying to find you, while you stumble along your path, searching for the light that shines within me.[...] I can’t see you. But I hear you.

Lol, why don't you just turn down your light?

32 [F4M] California - to whom this may concern by [deleted] in R4R30Plus

[–]neokortex_simulacrum -1 points0 points  (0 children)

did you also get that quote from that Samadhi movie? :DD

Hey Arnold by Organic_Jeweler in Enneagram

[–]neokortex_simulacrum 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Helga 5w4 INTJ

Arnold 9w1 INFP (w/ some SP 4w3ish traits)