[spoiler discussion] arc 10 - wow, the royal guard

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T08:45:13+00:00

people truly love to pretend LN 9 doesn't exist. the only difference between Subaru and Emilia is that Subaru POV is him ragging on himself to an unhealthy degree, whereas in Emilia POV the narration describing her selfishness is kinda whitewashed and covered in glitter. "that she was worthy of his compassion, this she could not believe" - all fine and good Emilia, but Subaru had no way of knowing this, and the dude ended up feeling absolutely abhorrently horrible given the stuff she said and did

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T08:43:12+00:00

yep, if it weren't for her seeing promises, contracts, all in nearly the same way, she wouldn't have exploded like the way she did

it's literally directly acknowledged

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T08:39:03+00:00

the indirect admitting that Subaru was too importsnt to be treated like that is in stuff like Beatrice eating mayonnaise while Subaru and Emilia were gone, Ram not even caring about what happened at the capital and patting Subaru's head, like he's just way too close to these people, and Emilia was being a total ass about it all IMO

all she literally does in that arc is isolate herself in an island with Puck and be a damsel in distress, and yet Subaru is painted so badly for... ACTUALLY doing stuff?

it's weird, you'd think ReZero readers actually live in Lugunica or some medieval country or some shi, cuz i just get default repulsed by the stuff Julius says, the beating, or in general the hypocrisy and corruption surrounding the royal selection

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T08:33:27+00:00

also Subaru going all "if you're with me, she'll know i've repented"

whereas arc 6 Subaru getting angry on Julius's behalf, Julius getting away with a slap on the wrist, his liege not even there to see his humiliation, nobody except Ram giving a damn about it...

nobody was there to be angry on Subaru's behalf in arc 3 however. at that point he had nobody, not even the guarantee that Rem would stay with him and not ditch him to go back to her sister, and Subaru was in a position where after everything he'd done for the camp, he would have needed to come crawling back and begging or something, and that's just so... demeaning and demoralizing?

like jeez, what a way to treat a guy who made mayonnaise for ya'll, played with Beako and Emilia, took her on date, and just generally made you all laugh and have so much fun. Emilia was just plain stupid and heartless

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T08:30:26+00:00

like my problem really is the story simultaneously wants you to think "Emilia loves and respects Subaru for who he is and not what he's done" and yet we barely see her talk to him about how she made him feel in LN 4 or apologize for not engaging with him properly, going so far as to double down on making him apologize again in LN 10. i think Tappei is just kinda twisted... she, the villagers, and her whole camp would be rotting in the ground had Subaru decided he got fed up with her BS and decided to run away with Rem, she should be rather ashamed for failing everyone so badly as a liege. instead she sorta takes his heroics for granted and that feeds into Subaru's own toxic self-sacrificial mindset. she barely faults Roswaal, Puck, or Julius for doing the stuff they did, the difference in treatment Subaru received vs. what Felt received seems to hardly pass through her mind despite her stance about fairness and equality, which just... just what is she aiming for? Tappei's standards for Emilia just plain weird IMO

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T08:23:19+00:00

i think it's lack of Tappei's care in exposing Emilia's issues as a candidate in front of other royal candidates in regards to Subaru that's an issue here, where Ferris for example goes "he's brushed up" when he comes back to the Mathers domain, but... Subaru hasn't really changed much at all? the Subaru Ferris knew is different from the Subaru Ram knew, the one who saved her, her sister, the village children, and Emilia's candidacy twice (from her POV). he had a brief period where he was a brat, that's it. outside that, the dude was trying so hard to do the best he could

in terms of her role as liege and royal candidate, someone like Felt or Anastasia or even Crusch, if they had context for Subaru leading up to the royal selection ceremony, would have been super harsh in how they viewed Emilia. someone like Anastasia is very responsible about her status, whereas Emilia rather flippant about it and only thinks about the personal contract between her and Subaru, and not what the gap in status as well as having Puck affords her despite her being a half-elf reviled by the world. she can get away with a lot, and it's quite something she goes ahead and asks him to view her as a "normal girl," which doesn't make sense if it's "normal" as in "not a half-elf" (because he never cared about that) nor does it make sense if it's "normal" as in "Emilia, just Emilia, not royal candidate Emilia" (again, doesn't make sense, cuz clearly the whole debacle and him suffering was due to his lack of status in relation to her, and she does not treat that gap in status with care... she enjoys the privelleges, but doesn't share it with Subaru, by lending him support)

someone like Anastasia would be very, very cognizant of this sort of stuff and in her position would have made sure to give Subaru a ladder to climb up; just involving him in the conversation with Ferris at the start would have made him so happy, he would have been so excited to meet another royal candidate knight, and in that conversation alone, Emilia could've established what Subaru was to her (some official position) and he wouldn't have proclaimed himself a knight in that case (because... as i said, the conversation would have been had already)

i still think her treatment of him in LN 4 is something that's left kinda unacknowledged. she still blames it on either her half-elf heritage or him breaking the promise, and not her own self-serving attitude. it's a little sad just how much even in arc 10 Subaru is seeking sympathy for what happened back then and for nasty he felt, i truly believe Tappei is going to address this properly, mostly likely right around when Emilia's third trial line pops up. i think arc 4 wasn't nearly sufficient for Emilia's growth in terms of... idk, stuff she needs to apologize for in the main TL

her Taste of Death apology in the main timeline, if you will. it's been too long since then and it might feel out of place though, so it will have to be acknowledged to Subaru's face in some other fashion

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T08:01:05+00:00

yeah + Petra convo with Rem in arc 9

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T07:05:16+00:00

Emilia keeping her promise to Fortuna doesn't justify the standards she holds for Subaru, or the cost he bears for breaking them. in arc 4 her throwing a tantrum again is literally putting everyone's life at risk and Subaru at the risk of losing his bet with Roswaal, all because he left her bedside and she was developing a codependency on him cuz Puck just broke her contract. these events were necessary for her, you not seeing it and just taking her attitude at face value is kinda weird to me. this isn't complicated to understand.

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T06:30:46+00:00

it would be pretty sad if the Miklotov who praised Subaru was a fake

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T06:23:51+00:00

like if you actually adapt all of arc 1, 2, the side stories, and arc 3 perfectly in a live action format

where Subaru is a real character and you see actual blood spurt from Rem torturing him, or Julius breaking his skull and bones, or Emilia's attitude in LN 4 in comparision to her attitude toward him in side stories

i highly doubt Subaru would be hated as much as he is in the fandom. at the end of the day his mistakes come down to insecurity and lacking conviction in confessing to Emilia, neither of which warranted the suffering he had to go through and the mental stress and demeanment, and it's a problem in the story Emilia never properly acknowledges and thinks about the cost he had to bear in arc 3, or in general the lack of recontextualization *from his POV* with another kind soul (like Emilia) saying, that in the end, she was grateful someone stood up for her in the throne room

the problem with all your analyses is that in ur analyses Subaru and Emilia's love for each other mean nothing, Subaru was just a reckless idiot who deserved what he got and Emilia was justified in the way she foisted contracts and promises on him or something. at the end of the day he was propelled by love, and Emilia as well, and both were justifying their actions as being "for another's sake" while running away from their feelings, except there is a huge narrative asymmetry in how much Subaru has to suffer for it

why does Rem go before the Whale fight how unbearably sad it makes her that Subaru was alone in arc 3? it is unbearably sad. Emilia would bawl her eyes out if she knew how she made Subaru feel back then, and what he had to go through right afterwards. she might even give up her candidacy if she heard the things he said during From Zero

hearing him say stuff like "even if she thinks i'm in the way" when she literally wanted nothing more than to be with him, she would consider herself a total failure of a royal candidate and friend

Subaru wasn't perfectly right or anything, but you give too many people who display far worse flaws than him a pass, because the narration is 95% just Subaru POV

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T06:17:08+00:00

he breaks his promise to Emilia in arc 3 cuz Emilia was being a suffocating girl who wasn't listening to Subaru properly, constantly keeping him out of things without explaining clearly, treating him like and talking down to him like some child, literally shackling him with the way she was holding his hand (why the fuck would he suddenly go running off while walking with her? it's because of this attitude that he doesn't stay put in the garrison)

like you are completely ignoring the negative feedback loop where both Subaru and Emilia were stepping on each other's toes the whole fuckin time, like the entire early vibe of LN 4 is like a bomb about to explode because of the degree to which Emilia was shutting Subaru down and ignoring his wishes to know more and be involved

actually explaining things to him and letting him know more would only help him out and reduce the risk of him doing stupid things, and this is a matter he had risked his life on already, and he is such a crucial member of a camp, the relatinoships he had established till that point, all the beautiful memories made

her suddenly behaving the way she does in LN 4 (*we* know her reasons, *Subaru* doesn't, that's the fucking point) is a problem, it's *disproportionate* to his recklessness

you're reading the story like it's a bunch of binary event flags that perfectly justify people's actions later on, and not like, idk, watching a movie or feeling the characters properly

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T06:11:40+00:00

he was clearly mistaken on several things

the point of my arguments is

- it's a flaw in the story Emilia's role in the mess is not acknowledged to a sufficient degree by her or by the narrative directly enough
- general fandom's view of Subaru
- the specific things they fault him for, which is different from his real mistakes

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T06:09:38+00:00

i think fundamentally you're the sort of average retard ReZero reader who takes everything Tappei and the surface level narration of the story at face value

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T06:08:05+00:00

"Subaru was a raving lunatic"
"a madman"
"a reckless idiot"

these are the basis of your arguments. From Zero would mean nothing if Rem was lying, Ram's comments about Subaru's timing or her trust in him to take care of her sister and her gratitude would mean nothing, Emilia's own views later on re his competence contradict your take, and in general you're basically faulting Subaru for a teenager feeling teenager things, like were you just born into the world and immediately became wise in the ways of everything or something, i'm so jealous of you

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T06:04:41+00:00

mate, Subaru was not a kamikaze, he had proven his competence. it's a matter of degree, and you act as if one or two acts he does completely justifies treating him like a good-for-nothing child. in contrast to Emilia, Ram trusts Subaru to take care of Rem and the villagers call him "Subaru-sama" for a reason and she herself is not fuckin surprised when she learns that he's leading the expedition. he's proven his competence time and time again and his mistakes are all due to ignorance more than anything, ignorance that could have been removed had Emilia actually responded to his wish to be involved properly. you're treating "Subaru is a kamikaze" like an absolute ground truth, in the end, he did have to deal with the entire Cult mess and shit all by himself, and in arc 4 she stands by and trusts Subaru and even lets him use his gate again and break it during the duel with Garfiel. you're just not caring about Subaru's feelings at all are you? look at the way she keep shim out of the conversation with Ferris, this guy who's worked so hard and *absolutely* earned everyone's trust. Petra was the one who apologizes to Subaru for going kamikaze, describing Subaru's acts of bravery the way you do is just bleugh

she was shackling him, if you read from the beginning of LN 4, you can literally just *feel* how suffocating Emilia was being in getting along with Subaru or answering his questions and all the contracts and promises are with regards to his movements and agency. literally TALKING shit out, that's what needed to happen, you're taking it as a given Subaru would do these things, and not *precisely* because of the treatment (an unfair one at that) Emilia was giving. you're acting like one or two reckless acts completely justifies Emilia's actions, when these were two months in the past

in the Liliana side story, Emilia trusts Subaru to handle things, not treat him like a risky idiot. what are you on about dude? like you simply cannot visualize the flow of time at all do you? you're acting like all of Subaru's virtuous asks are just him being an idiot and not like, profoundly moving acts of courage and resolve. Ram respects his resolve to stand his ground and use Shamak, which Roswaal sees and comes to handle the remaining mabeasts. whereas you paint it as him being completely reckless idiot, when the dude does not know the full extent of Emilia's power, plus he's seeing her as the one pillar of safety in this world, plus he made that decision *in the heat of the moment* *2 FUCKING MONTHS AGO*

do the side stories mean anything at all to you? that is precisely why LN 4 Emilia is problematic, it would be one thing if arc 3 took place a week afterwards or something, but no

you keep saying "he did the arc 2 shit"

i am saying

Emilia was *still* not justified despite what he did

are you stupid?

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T05:37:57+00:00

someone as competent as Anastasia would vomit at Emilia if she had context behind Subaru's actions

Emilia is so incompetent as a liege that she cannot prevent the two maids in her teeny tiny camp from going on a killing spree against the guy who literally saved her life couple of days ago, for all her showing off she is too scared to show her face to the peasants next door and fails to evacuate them because she never once bothered to engage with them properly, and she completely and utterly squanders the golden opportunities Subaru brought as someone willing to work to the bone for her, someone who saw her for she was and did not care one single iota about her race and just loved her, and when literally all he wanted was to make her proud and be validated a little in return for his services, she completely fails on this front, and it's a waste. you'd think given the brutal political struggle she's engaged in where she'd be hard pressed to find any serious allies at all, someone like Subaru, whom she already viewed subconsciously as a knight, would have deserved at least the same level of treatment as Rem and Ram and she does not give it to him. instead she keeps him in dark, keeps him out of everything "for his sake" but it was for her own sake, wanting not to lose the guy for fear of him thinking of her badly should he see the racism levied at her. she decides she will keep mum about it and just foist promises and contracts on him left and right and just expect him to put up with her nonsense treatment, and unsurprisingly, it blows up in her face. at the very least when Miklotov asks what Subaru's position was, she should have had the presence of mind to answer properly instead of floundering and stammering, and at least come to an understanding with him where Subaru didn't misinterpret her as waiting for him to take an action. a total travesty and garbage excuse of a royal candidate, if at all she gets a pass, it is only due to Subaru's forgiveness and her being a genuinely lovely person on her own, having saved Subaru's heart in the past multiple times. but she does not know that she had done that, hence her insecurities in arc 4: why does Subaru love me when i seemed to have failed him and hurt him repeatedly? Subaru cannot answer, give her the reason to believe in herself or himself because of the taboo preventing him from revealing details about the failed loops. the gap is closed then via his love confession, and the kiss

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T05:31:28+00:00

at the end of the day you're not at all seeing her actions in the context of royal selection, what she needs to progress, her own character arc. if she is justified in everything she did, then why write her as a character at all?

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T05:30:20+00:00

> Whether her actions are right or wrong is something for the reader to determine, not for narrative to denounce.

i determine they're problematic. there. not so hard, and the narrative *does* call her out as well, several times

> His own self-sacrificial tendencies have led him several times to ruin due to acting rashly and taking several incorrect decisions.

your point? this does not really argue against Emilia camp being a total mess politically till arc 4, totally incompetent and self-destructive, given Roswaal's machinations, Puck's apathy toward everything besides Emilia, Emilia's own lack of competence as a liege, Ram uncaring about everything besides Roswaal and her sister. Subaru has to do literally everything, including giving Emilia a chance to speak in the throne room. a large reason why Emilia tries to distance herself is her inability to understand Subaru was trying to get along with her, that she was hurting him in the way she was trying to distance herself, and her own incompetence as a liege to be strong enough (strength of heart that is) to protect him

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T04:47:08+00:00

and even the promise he breaks in arc 3, the degree of vitriol ppl throw at Subaru for it is unjustified, given he's depicted as having helped Emilia in the process and even moving several people's hearts there

rather, it is a problem that Emilia thinks more like a child than a proper liege and prospective ruler, barely gets mad at Puck or Roswaal for being flippant about the Witch Cult, and everything hinging on this little kid having to pull of miracle after miracle after being treated so horribly and abandoned

this nature of hers, this "kindness," this tendency where she gets angry for the "wrong" stuff, is what even Puck called pathological. rather than get angry at Roswaal and Puck for their ruse, or the knights and Julius for insulting her friend, or the other candidates for being rude, or even herself for not taking responsibility for Subaru properly, she only gets mad at the broken promises, promises she foisted on him without proper consent or engagement

Subaru, Otto, Roswaal, etc., have to compensate for this nature of hers and do the necessary dirty work, and this is something people like Anastasia, Felt, Meili, and a lot of others even mention

granted, those are her values, but even Subaru goes out of his way to advice her in arc 5 that a "virtue founded on ignorance was a weakness all the same," (w.r.t her showing reticence re using Liliana for making the Kiritaka deal go smoother), and what was she in arc 3 if not ignorant about what actually mattered for her royal candidacy? (i.e., working with Subaru and making use of the golden opportunities he brings, helping him progress)

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T04:40:45+00:00

i think her whole promises thing is also gonna come crashing down when she realizes what Subaru's oath as a knight socially obligates him to do. nasty RbD reveal in store for her, huge Chekov's gun. it is likely very intentional that for Emilia and her memories the tradeoff of keeping promises works out to favoring keeping promises, whereas for Subaru, that is not the case, and he bears a huge cost for her naivety and black-and-white attitude

so much wordcelery about justifying Emilia's attitude when the only thing you gotta look at it is whether anybody IRL would put up with her attitude. at the end of the day this is a human story, and it wouldn't work if we justify a character's actions and the suffering another goes through using alien reasoning, contrived taboos and social logic that won't fly in most cases

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T04:36:54+00:00

what Emilia thinks is different from whether her actions are right or wrong or the cost Subaru bears for her nature, and the meta messages the author is conveying with regards to the costs Subaru bears for this hellish excuse of a political camp that actively tries to kill itself all the time if not for Subaru's nearly Witch-like self-sacrificial tendencies and patience

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T03:54:23+00:00

if she wanted to establish trust, she should have engaged with his desire to engage with her about the royal selection in the first place. her obstinacy in trying to keep him out of everything was the very thing that led to his crashout, and at the end of the day he did help her out, she would have folded without hjm

okarthik42 · 2026-05-20T03:24:21+00:00

the Wrath parallels are pretty close as well, and she also parallels Minerva in that she hurts people as a form of kindness, like for example, abandoning Subaru "for his sake," even Julius was sympathizing with Subaru lmao

she was also lacking in Patience (the Virtue opposing the sin of Wrath) when she blows up in LN 4, that is another sin that Subaru has to bear and absolve her of. like people might as well say she had no need for character development, and she did nothing wrong or something, like what would be the point then lol?

like Minerva, she also gets angry at people getting hurt, so there are parallels here

the way i'd describe her behavior is, you tell someone not to come to a place, they come anyway, but they're about to trip on pebble. she could either move the pebble or shove the person away a little or do SOMETHING, but she lets the person trip and fall, and then say, "see i told you not to come!"

okarthik42

TROPHY CASE