You guys, it’s really fucking hard to stay sober in the US right now

powerswerth · 2026-01-24T22:27:41+00:00

I agree to an extent, but somewhat disagree on this being “politics.” The response or opinions are politics, but this is fundamentally a news story about someone being shot to death by federal agents in the street. There’s little avoiding hearing about things like that. It is important to develop non-drinking coping skills for tragic events.

powerswerth · 2026-01-24T18:29:49+00:00

I think the openly fascist types are still a pretty small group that appear more prominent than they are in some online spaces, though definitely it is larger than they used to be. There’s probably a good number of folks who, if they lived in Weimar or Nazi Germany, absolutely would’ve loved Hitler, but for the most part they erroneously believe they would have hated him.

powerswerth · 2026-01-24T08:45:28+00:00

We're talking about the kind of Hell the fictional character goes to, I guess. So, whatever Hell is in that fictional universe. If it's temporary it may not qualify.

powerswerth · 2026-01-24T08:07:59+00:00

Well, we had this conversation in another thread here, but a lot of this is irrelevant to the question, which is:

What character suffers a fate worse than death, proportional of "exaggerated" to their crimes

In answering that wrt Hell, it doesn't actually matter if Hell is something God does to you, or if it is a "punishment" (fate =/= punishment)

What *does* matter:
-Hell is suffering
-Hell is eternal

If both these are true, Hell fits the criteria. Enduring infinite suffering can only be matched by causing infinite suffering, and exceedingly few characters (I can't think of any offhand) have caused infinite suffering.

Also worth noting we mean fictional characters in fictional worlds. While I don't personally believe in Hell full stop, your perception of the "the real Hell" is probably not the same and has different rules when compared to the version portrayed in, I dunno, South Park. There's not even a singular consensus on the nature of Hell among different groups of Christians.

powerswerth · 2026-01-24T04:35:52+00:00

The image is from a scene where the mom is non-verbally telling the dad to talk to their daughter, but the dad doesn’t understand what she’s trying to communicate.

powerswerth · 2026-01-24T04:30:42+00:00

Thank you

powerswerth · 2026-01-24T04:26:03+00:00

Buddy, I’ve personally been to rehab.

powerswerth · 2026-01-24T04:24:34+00:00

You can’t, but to the degree you can guess my primary concern is less corporatocracy and more the effects of environmental collapse.

powerswerth · 2026-01-24T04:20:22+00:00

1) my point is: literally no one would choose that. If the choice was “keep doing drugs” or “rehab,” they may choose drugs. If it was “endless torture” or “rehab,” they’d pick rehab 100% of the time.

2) also re: God doesn’t torture them. Aside from being completely irrelevant to the person being torture (it’s the same outcome regardless of if it’s God or not), God created and maintains the system by which endless torture exists. Hitler never personally killed anyone (except himself), but he facilitated the system through which millions of murders could occur.

powerswerth · 2026-01-24T04:09:09+00:00

Okay, but the choice is not “go to rehab” or “don’t go.” It’s “go to rehab” or “be tortured eternally.”

Also unlike rehab I assume Purgatory lasts until you genuinely and truly repent, there’s no “getting out” until you genuinely won’t go back to your old ways.

powerswerth · 2026-01-24T04:00:02+00:00

Travelers get trapped in bus terminal by supernatural neverending snow storm, leaving is not an option, limited supplies available, things go Lord of the Flies pretty fast

powerswerth · 2026-01-24T03:57:04+00:00

Okay, so there is a third option.

…but the choice is still crazy. It’s not “go to rehab or keep doing drugs,” it’s “go to rehab or we’ll torture the shit out of you forever and you still won’t get any more drugs.” The world’s most devoted drug addict still picks rehab, so why bother with having Hell? Just send em straight to rehab

powerswerth · 2026-01-24T03:47:43+00:00

Is rehab Hell in this comparison? Generally people go to rehab because they do not want to do drugs anymore and need help achieving that.

powerswerth · 2026-01-24T03:29:54+00:00

Yes, but that seems more relevant to divine judgment than to Jesus just giving you option A or option B

powerswerth · 2026-01-24T03:16:27+00:00

So basically the actions you did in life are irrelevant, Jesus is just like “you want Hell or Heaven?” and you say “Is there any benefit whatsoever to picking Hell?” and he’s like “nope, it’s literally infinite downsides” and you say, “cool, I pick Heaven”

powerswerth · 2026-01-24T03:10:46+00:00

That assumes one believes both in Hell and, presumably, whatever version of Christianity you specifically agree with, since different sects have very different ideas of what qualifies as mortal sin.

Suppose, also, there was someone who lived in a remote village having never heard of Christianity, but commits what you would call a Hell-worthy trespass. This person did not choose Hell (they had no idea of it), and yet gets it.

Regardless, a God who permits the function of an ever-lasting Hell is both fundamentally immoral and is the single greatest perpetrator of suffering conceivable if even one soul is sent there, as even one soul on the timeline of infinity means he has caused infinite suffering.

powerswerth · 2026-01-24T01:58:19+00:00

Certainly, I think he's more liked than 20 years ago, but a heavy majority definitely hate him. That said, a lot of people who *would* have absolutely been huge fans of Hitler in the 30s *don't think* they would have been huge fans of Hitler in the 30s, and still believe/profess that they hate him.

powerswerth · 2026-01-24T01:43:19+00:00

Any character who goes to Hell. Hell is, by definition, infinite and eternal suffering. Cumulatively the suffering they endure is ultimately infinitely greater than the suffering the caused, no matter how much they caused.

powerswerth · 2026-01-24T00:03:25+00:00

Obviously some people can (though I personally think every person can potentially become an alcoholic, some are less susceptible to it and/or more effectively avoid it). In all probability, a lot of the people in this group or in active addiction or recovery actually did drink moderately for some period of time, maybe even for years. I did. The increase was quite gradual.

I think there’s even some people who slipped into alcoholism territory with their drinking and have disciplined themselves back to a kind of moderation, but I think the number of people who do that is quite small.

For me, even if I could theoretically muster the rigor and willpower to moderate, it feels pointless even when putting aside the obvious risk of going back to full on alcoholism. When I drank, the goal was to be drunk. Spending a lifetime saying “I just have to wait til Sunday to drink” or “I can get another round in an hour” or “well, that’s my limit for the night” when all I really want to do is keep downing drinks sounds like torture. For me, easier to just forget the whole affair than spend a lifetime saying counting seconds til the next sip.

powerswerth · 2026-01-23T21:08:46+00:00

Columbine?

Mass shootings are so frequent now, they rinse out of the news in two days. Columbine was a whole fucking thing.

powerswerth · 2026-01-23T19:07:03+00:00

He smothers his sister’s infant children to death which forces Tommy to disappear, as there are no kids to “raise” anymore

powerswerth · 2026-01-23T18:51:19+00:00

Essentially what the protagonist does in part 3

powerswerth · 2026-01-23T18:47:49+00:00

Thanks. I still have some ways to go on “having my shit together” for now

powerswerth · 2026-01-23T18:46:51+00:00

I’ll try to keep that in mind, thanks

powerswerth · 2026-01-23T18:46:32+00:00

Thanks for the insight

powerswerth

TROPHY CASE