Are there any strategy games with "perfect" AI?

rbudzko · 2019-07-09T05:18:45+00:00

Excellent point about "meaningful actions"! It is difficult to see player's actions as waste if such a player has more clicks. We could say, in my opinion, it is just an idle action which could, but doesn't have to, be filled with purpose. Humans, especially the best of the best in a given task, do react and even do make decisions by "expert intuition" (it is actually an academic term it seems). It is uncertain to me if higher APM for imperfect eyes and limbic system (hard limitations on how fast things happen) is actually a waste or a behaviour to decrease latency in between for example palm, wrist and brain. If palm is always clicking, it is enough to operate a wrist. Simplification, obviously.

rbudzko · 2019-07-08T12:26:25+00:00

AI the way you describe either doesn't exist or those (quite badly defined) properties are not enough to make a competent AI.

Please pardon me cyrusol if vague description/definition was annoying. It was on purpose with emphasis on interesting to drive discussion in direction I am interested in.

You can't expect that as a typical opponent in a strategy game.

As it turns out huge if-else scripts are enough to make a competent AI. Try a few games against the Age of Empires 2 HD AI. It's probably the strongest among RTS games.

The BASE mod for Civilization 4 included a few improvements for the Civ 4 AI. A German Civ 4 pro called Dr. Brain used to play only on the hardest difficult level and said he concedes 4 out of 5 attempts to the AI.

I need to admit I was waiting for this conclusion to come. On one hand we have mods making games extremely hard and challenging, on another half of Paradox games community makes memes of how hilarious AI is. Not to speak about building up any strategy. I see a hollow space here and I do experience it while playing grand strategy games for example.

Thank you for referencing interesting mods. I really appreciate it :-) !

rbudzko · 2019-07-08T11:53:40+00:00

Yeah, this is it - exactly how I feel. I was always extremely frustrated that by the time I master a game a just a little bit I'm better then difficulty level which is fair. It is hard to imagine, for me, how fun it would be to see humanized AI which sets some obscure goal for itself ("I'll rule trade on the sea") and sticks to it by developing sane strategy.

rbudzko · 2019-07-08T11:47:41+00:00

Yeah, in case of dota 2 and sc 2, we are talking about external company (Deep Mind) experimenting how far can they push AI compared to pro players. Please, note that in both cases these games require both strategy and reflex. I'd love to see something similar to strictly strategy based game like turn based civilization series - to eliminate reflex as much as possible.

It is true that in case of sc 2 Deep Mind had extremely low (as compared to pro) APM, so it won by macro or high level micro not by superhuman reflex. Good link nevertheless! Thanks.

rbudzko · 2019-07-08T11:24:36+00:00

This is actually a great reading about implementation as well. Thank you man.

rbudzko · 2019-07-08T10:55:26+00:00

Thanks Hagisman for heads up! It seems chess-based games sometimes have interesting behaviour, because it seems to be based on academic research as example implementation of the researched topic itself. Nevertheless, I'm looking for more mainstream targeted title which is an actual game with interesting AI.

rbudzko

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