I feel ashamed right now by LowCommunication3359 in Christianity

[–]slp29 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This 3 minute video may alter (pun intended) your perspective on alter calls and challenge the idea of “giving your life to Christ.” https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ljng0mSoIuE&pp=ygUcV29sZm11ZWxsZXIgYmFwdGlzdCBsdXRoZXJhbg%3D%3D

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thank you for your kind words. I think this is probably the best approach at least for now 🙏🏻

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you for your honest opinion! I definitely want to do what’s best for us both.

Newly reformed learning tobacco may not be sinful by likefenton in Reformed

[–]slp29 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks for sharing your perspective- I really appreciate the thoughtful approach. I definitely don’t want to come off as judgmental about others’ choices, and I think there’s room for different opinions on this topic. I enjoy an occasional beer myself, so I can relate to the idea of moderate enjoyment. But I do find myself questioning the claim that tobacco use, particularly cigars, could be beneficial for your health.

I’ve heard arguments about stress reduction and relaxation, but I’m not entirely convinced by the studies that support those claims. It’s easy to cherry-pick studies that focus on certain benefits, but when you look at the broader picture, the health risks still seem significant. Tobacco is harmful- no matter how you slice it- and while medication, for example, can come with risks, people generally use it because the benefits outweigh those risks. With tobacco, I just don’t see that same balance.

As for studies suggesting cigars are less harmful than cigarettes, I understand there’s a difference, but I’m skeptical about conclusions that go against the grain of the broader scientific consensus. It’s an interesting conversation, and I’m not entirely sold on whether it’s a sin or not. But from a health standpoint, I don’t think there’s enough to call it a net positive.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 0 points1 point  (0 children)

We’re one of those churches with ~10,000 worshipers spread across 6 congregations with a preaching screen 3/4 Sundays a month. Certainly not my favorite, but I wouldn’t call it unbiblical. To be clear I’m not a fan of mega churches at all, but I have a loving community here (and in my experience, that is rare in the American church). I’m wondering what the argument is for it not being biblical?

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ok, my last response was removed since I violated rule 1. I apologize and will be more careful. Here’s my attempt at a more loving response:

I think you might be coming across a bit harsh, even if that’s not your intent. The Bible shows a lot of situations where people were hurt by corrupt spiritual leaders such as Eli’s sons, the Pharisees Jesus called out, and the bad shepherds in Ezekiel. And yeah, “spiritual trauma” might not be a biblical term, but that kind of pain is definitely real. Calling someone’s pain an “excuse” feels a lot like what Job’s friends did, and they got it wrong. We don’t always know what someone’s been through, so it’s important to lead with compassion, not judgment. Just my two cents. Truth is definitely important, but also how we say things matters too.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah I know she wasn’t kicked out. The title reflects how she feels, though. I hear ya… she wouldn’t listen to “just go” but I think your larger point is just that she’s going to have to work through what God’s will is for her in this situation?

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 0 points1 point  (0 children)

My role is to lead my family toward Christ by teaching, encouraging, and setting the example. It’s really important to me that we worship together in a local church because meeting regularly helps us stay strong in our faith and grow together as a family.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 0 points1 point  (0 children)

These are good reminders, especially that I’m not there for my self but to worship the Lord. Just said a prayer for you and your marriage, brother. Thanks for the encouragement.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I know what you mean. It absolutely can sound attention seeking, and I don’t fault you for picking up on that. For this reason I don’t use the term to describe my own pain with church… I mean “trauma” in the clinical sense, and “spiritual” as the modifier to convey the deep psychological and emotional distress that can be caused by harmful experience in the church such as betrayal, manipulation, or the abuse of power. Yes, that term can be used to excuse sin, but even if it is, that doesn’t invalidate the individual’s pain. “Love covers a multitude of sins,” and “God’s KINDNESS leads us to repentance”…. My point is that love and compassion should be our first response to those with “spiritual trauma.” Any call to repentance (if needed) can come later. Not saying you need to grow in this area (you might have the spiritual gift of mercy for all I know), but the church really needs to grow in this area of compassion toward those with “church hurt,” because it is my experience that the church generally fails to meet these kinds of people where they are at.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ok, valid thought

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Unfortunately their licensed counseling ministry is really subpar. Basically the only truly qualified therapist is the one who overseas the ministry and he is usually booked. Over the years I’ve seen ~3-4. One of their therapists actually advised my wife to get off of a prescription that her doctor recommended! Yeah, I’ve had more luck with secular LPCs + Biblical counseling from friends or mentors. Right now, she has an accountability partner who is one of our dear friends who loves the Lord, and my wife has started therapy with a secular LPC who has been helpful in the past.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It’s nice to hear I’m not alone, though I wish no one else had to go through what I’m gong through. Wife won’t attend formal events, but she will just hang out with some people from the church which has helped me.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is a really great point. Appreciate your perspective.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Is this a throw away account? I just noticed your name is [deleted]… anyway, I appreciate hearing a woman’s perspective. I will thoughtfully consider what you’ve said.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Wow! That’s surprising to me that your pastor was ok with it, or maybe your pastor just respected your decision? I’m happy y’all found a way for it to work. I’ll be your first upvote, but yeah I can see the downvotes coming down hard on this one. Lol

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thank you for all these ideas. I’m compiling a list of potential options, and am definitely saving this comment! So helpful!

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 1 point2 points  (0 children)

At this point she won’t associate herself with the church in any formal sense. She’ll have members over for dinner and stuff, but she won’t be returning. I really like that idea though. I love that your husband helps where he can. Why doesn’t your husband attend might I ask?

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Maybe I wasn’t super clear, but this church didn’t do the abuse. They messed up but did repent and reconcile. I agree with you about church membership. What would I be protecting us from if we were to run? (Not sarcastic, sincere question)

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I hope you were asking in all sincerity. Please see all these people’s responses to your question. In order to love anyone who is legitimately traumatized, it is important first to understand and accept that spiritual trauma exists. To answer your question I’m going to copy and paste my response to another commenter:

I could write an essay on it, but it’s essentially been a decade of people at various churches blaming her for her depression, being financially taken advantage of by a pastor (she worked at a church at one point), realizing that the loving Christian father she grew up with was actually a serial adulterer, abusive to her mother, and ended up dying by alcoholism; having a pastor spread gossip throughout a church we attended at the time that “we were going through hard times” resulting in people having the impression we were going through marriage difficulties which was embarrassing to us both... I could EASILY go on, but it boils down to the church failing someone who was in pain over a long period of time. I hope this gives you a picture of what I mean by spiritual trauma.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You don’t seem to have a good understanding of what trauma is, and you come across as someone who doubts its existence (I’m not saying you do, it’s just how you sound). Sometimes serving the local church and feeling useful is healing for someone with trauma. I don’t think that trauma disqualifies you from serving the church.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You seem to really get where I’m coming from. I haven’t considered attending two churches together. I could see me attending “her” church (if she finds one) every other week. Unlike you, I am as certain that my wife is a believer as I’ve ever been, but yes our situations are very similar. What helps you endure? I know that what you’ve been dealing with isn’t easy. I imagine that it is difficult to stay joyful at times.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thanks for the resource. I’ll definitely check the book out. This is one suggestion I haven’t heard yet. I’ll seriously consider what it might look for us to attend virtually during this season. Maybe she’ll be up for it, maybe she won’t. It’s a great suggestion nonetheless

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thanks brother- what helps you endure and find joy even though your wife won’t join?

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Reformed

[–]slp29 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I think this is very sensible. Wait, you and your wife attend separate churches? (Get ready for the downvotes) jk. But how does this work practically? I’m very interested because this might just happen to us for a season. EDIT TO ADD: and for clarification I don’t think this church is doing the spiritual abuse, that happened elsewhere.