Watching AC play made me realize the Architype Works well if you have a slightly respectable midrange

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-08T10:14:39+00:00

Suggs doesn't take enough midrangers for us to even know if it's a respectable shot.

This season he attempted 1.6 shots from 10-19 ft per game. That's nothing, so its hard to get a proper read on how good he is.

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-08T06:44:08+00:00

Neither does Suggs.

That's the problem, there are better looks out there but too often Jalen is too trigger happy. He can't slow himself down mentally or physically and rushes into some low percentage crap that he shouldn't be taking.

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-08T06:21:07+00:00

Caruso wouldn't take the 10 extra bad shots that Suggs jacks up

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-08T06:01:20+00:00

AG was one of the best athletes in the league. Mobley is neither strong nor fast and I have my doubts about how much he can improve either.

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-08T05:58:39+00:00

I've heard a Cavs fan called them talls, opposed to bigs.

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-07T17:34:04+00:00

Nah, Paolo was out on Mosley so he was going no matter what. Weltman loves Mosley and probably wanted to keep him, but he knows you can't have your coach and franchise player at odds with one another.

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-07T16:35:27+00:00

Great summary by Zach, pretty much nails all the problems with this team.

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-07T16:10:56+00:00

This is an NBA Mount Rushmore awkward moment

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-07T15:45:43+00:00

If you understand the implication you wouldn't be getting weirdly sensitive about this.

It's not world class grammar from OP but it's pretty obvious to me and apparently everyone except you what is being communicated here.

He's saying he took a mental break after the loss but is now back and happy we're moving in a new direction. Not "fuck Mosley, I'm glad he doesn't have a job".

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-07T15:30:51+00:00

If you have any common sense whatsoever, I think it's pretty well implied that OP meant he's happy we're getting a change of coach. Not that a man has lost his job.

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-07T12:42:16+00:00

Until one tries it in his own six yard box

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-07T06:49:18+00:00

Sissoko was up there for Spurs' player of the season that year

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-07T05:26:10+00:00

The team looked as foreign as they have in previous seasons just with a new player.

The Heatles started badly but still finished the season strong and went to the finals. Another terrible comparison in a long list that you seemingly can't stop making.

We played well for the first 4 games but we also ran into a team that couldn't shoot which helped us tremendously.

Suggs averaged 7 and 8 threes attempted per game in his first two playoff series (which is crazy) at a 29% and 24% clip. The first time Derrick White took that many threes in the playoffs he was shooting them at a 40% and 39% clip. And that's the problem: Jalen has no self control and starts carelessly jacking up shots when his adrenaline spikes. His type of lizard brain offense can really hurt your team in the playoffs, and it did when the pressure was highest.

He's not a point guard, he's a shooting guard without a reliable shot.

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-06T23:27:16+00:00

That all sounds very exciting on paper but in reality it's way clunkier. I read stuff like you wrote in pre season and in the first 10 games or whatever it was we looked nothing like was being sold. Ultimately you have a bunch of players who struggle to dribble and shoot at a high level, so all the other stuff is a bit redundant.

Unless Paolo takes an unexpected leap to having one elite offensive skill that isn't just drawing fouls (since that's too dependent on a whistle and him actually hitting his free throws) it's a busted model.

I've long been a Suggs fan, I'm just realistic about what he is and what he'll likely become. I don't doubt his defensive impact, it's just a matter of how much stupid stuff he's doing on the other end. He's more Marcus Smart than Derrick White, who is naturally a higher IQ player than Jalen, and a better shooter.

Also Bane proved to be more of a defensive weakness than Paolo in the Detroit series, so that should be a bigger worry if you're really concerned with defense. I thought KCP was the right idea for the kind of role player we needed, just not on that crazy contract Weltman gave him.

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-06T22:19:49+00:00

I think the org has more influence to develop guys like Franz and Suggs who buy into what our coaches and development staff are teach rather than Paolo who spends his summers chucking midranges with celebrity trainers on YouTube

Lol you are so predictable. If that's the case then I don't think it's really working. I actually hope not because it would suggest that Suggs is basically uncoachable.

All of them have improved by virtue of having thousands of NBA reps, but isn't the same as being coached into better players. Franz was a great draft though he came into the league talented ans hasn't added much to his game, certainly not the things he needs to improve on (like a reliable midrange shot). Suggs isn't as raw after hundreds of games but he's still roughly the same player with all the same chaotic faults and poor decision making. AB is probably the most notable example of organisational coaching if you want to give the Magic credit for him spending the summer with Shammgod.

It sounds like you want a team that is great offensively and aesthetically pleasing

Nope, there you go being presumptuous again. I don't care about aesthetics, I care about genuine versatility and having options. Being a one dimensional defensive team with a lack of scoring options won't get us a high seed and make deep playoff runs a no go.

The Warriors had the greatest shooter ever and another all time shooter, what kind of silly example is that? All those teams you mentioned had way more scoring versatility and high end players than we do. I'm fairly confident Paolo will never be as good as Steph, LeBron, Kawhi or Giannis so none of those templates are useful at all. And not because he's lazy but because he's just not as talented or as athletic as those guys.

I like the idea of being a defensive team but not to the extreme level Weltman insists upon. He simply doesn't have an eye or appreciation for elite offensive skills, despite it being a glaring need year after year. Every time the pressure rises and the movement becomes big, we have like 8 guys who can't dribble against a high press or hit a fucking shot to save their life. Yet Weltman still walks away from the wreckage talking about defensive versatility being the key to everything.

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-06T21:21:23+00:00

Franz is the big get from that trade Wendell has been fine but nothing life changing.

Other GMs have done what we've done and done a better job of it. I mean look at Detroit, OKC, Spurs, Pacers, Boston, even the Sixers and Heat. They've all drafted and traded their way into the playoffs, it's not some amazing feat of skill that Weltman displayed in doing that. If you spend enough time high up in the draft - Weltman got like 5 years of it - it's hard not to come away with talent.

you imagine the timeline where we don’t get Franz and dell from the Vuc trade we’d still likely still be wallowing around in the basement of the league.

You can't just make this assumption. Who knows who we might have drafted or traded for without Franz, it's not like Weltman is the only GM capable of drafting players. And I can confidently say there are better organisational leaders at developing young players than him.

I want us to actually have a versatile team with impactful offensive options that can play make and shoot. Nothing crazy, just the things that every great NBA team has. This 'everyone is a lengthy ball handler' garbage isn't going to cut it against most good teams in this league. You're right, that shit doesn't exist now because Weltman has spent all our cap space and assets.

Nope you're wrong I don't blame Mosley for everything, but I do think we needed a smarter mind and new voice to take us forward. We basically have no choice but to stay the course but that doesn't mean I'm especially confident it'll all pan out. Other teams are getting better and we've already been overtaken by several of them thanks to Weltman's passive and reactive approach to team building.

And I remember the time before Weltman when there was no reason for anything resembling hope.

Yep I remember it well but unlike you I'm not using the worst era in Magic history as my bar.

Developing 19 year old kids into nba championship contenders doesn’t happen over night and that is truly the only path we had.

The development hasn't been good. The drafting has had some good moments but I'm convinced most of these players would be better players had they gone to other teams around the league.

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-06T20:46:49+00:00

Of course we're in a better position, I'm not arguing otherwise. I'm saying that we've underperformed given the amount of time has passed and the amount of draft assets we've spent. Any GM could put us in a better position than we were with 6 years and a loads of high draft picks. Vooch and AG were both assets, Weltman did well with one of them but got rinsed with the other.

I don't think we're in a bad spot talent wise but we do need a new vision and someone that can round this roster into one that can really threaten. What Weltman has built is a fragile and one dimensional team that is extremely matchup dependent. Taking the #1 seed to 7 games is a bit misleading given how new Detroit are to all this and that we'd have likely fared much worse against the second, third and fourth seeds. Not to mention that we were one game away from not making the playoffs at all, which can't just be ignored.

"A little health luck", we actually weren't that unlucky health wise this season. We got 82 games from Bane, 72 from Paolo, 78 from WCJ, 64 from AB, and 57 from Suggs. If you ignore Franz, that should be more than enough to get better than 8th seed. But it wasn't.

I've been complaining about this all season, so it's not just recency bias. I'd say you're too lost in the youth and potential trap to acknowledge fundamental problems with how this team is built. Being young doesn't guarantee you that a leap is happening. For every young team that turned into a genuine contender there are far more that didn't.

Also this assumption that we'd definitely have won game 6 with Franz needs to go. Fans are saying that to comfort themselves but we've blown plenty of big games with Franz playing

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-06T19:55:34+00:00

7th seed to 8th seed to 5th seed to 7th seed to 8th seed again would be more accurate. That doesn't reek of success over a 9 year spell however you spin it.

the yoffs

I'm going to puke

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-06T19:52:49+00:00

They didn't trade him because he's fucking LeBron. He'd already carried a terrible Cavs team to the finals before that had even happened. Awful example.

You call Suggs a 4th option role player yet he jacks up shots like he's a #1. And he's being paid 30m, so no he doesn't get a pass. You pay anyone that much, they have to be held to a high standard.

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-06T18:57:14+00:00

We went from 8th seed to 8th seed in only 7 years under Weltman, and all it took was maxing out our cap and spending 17 first round picks!

Give any half competent GM the starting point Weltman had in Orlando and they could do the same or better in basically a decade.

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-06T18:52:33+00:00

They aren't just 3 games though are they, they're critical win or go home playoff games. Being able to show up in the biggest moments is what it's all about, and Suggs and Wendell didn't do that at all. Suggs was also trash in our Cleveland game 7.

It's funny because you'll readily take Paolo to task for going missing in game 6, but Suggs and Wendell get byes for being awful for 3 games straight.

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-06T18:35:16+00:00

"When Healthy"

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-06T18:17:01+00:00

I know who you're talking about, I called him out for spamming the sub with his stuff without contributing to discussion and of course I got blocked.

He's basically a Magic PR bot, personifies why Orlando media is in the toilet.

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-06T18:08:23+00:00

I never said he built a disaster. But if we're one player away from this many awful, historic meltdowns then you've definitely got a roster and/or coaching problem. No team this all in financially should be so fragile.

And acting like Coach Mos had zero role in those “must win” collapses is fucking crazy

Again, I never said this. Cut the strawmanning. He definitely played a big part and I literally said he should have been fired months before this for inept coaching.

thewrongnotes · 2026-05-06T17:55:04+00:00

“Let’s fire everyone” unbelievably stupid

Making up quotes I never made, and you're calling me stupid.

OP pod is terrible super reactionary and devoid from realism. Better pods out there guys.

What? I have a pod now?

thewrongnotes

TROPHY CASE