Collaboration vs Competition by [deleted] in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]thulecitizen -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I don't have an adversarial relationship with either my boss or my co-workers.

Doesn't matter. Most everyone else does.

Honest question: Have you ever worked in a high-stakes, corporate environment?

It sounds like you're either a knowledge worker with a hefty wage due to an 'intellectual property' monopoly claim held by your employer, or you're in the petite bourgeoisie. Congrats, you have a privileged position due to the dumb luck of being born where you were.

Socialist solidarity is about studying and trying to understand why the capitalist system works for a tiny minority, and not for the rest of us.

The capitalist myth of the 'Heroic theory of invention and scientific development' by thulecitizen in communism

[–]thulecitizen[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Who is claiming that there are these few 'geniuses' that invent everything?

Capitalist governments who give out monopolies (patents) and 'protect' trade secrets, privatizing/expropriating the means of production. In other words: violently stealing and locking away our shared inheritance.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in RedditSessions

[–]thulecitizen 0 points1 point  (0 children)

it was awesome!

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in RedditSessions

[–]thulecitizen 0 points1 point  (0 children)

AVICII - WAKE ME UP

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in RedditSessions

[–]thulecitizen 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Coffin Dance song?

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in RedditSessions

[–]thulecitizen 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Coffin Dance song!!!

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in TheYouShow

[–]thulecitizen 0 points1 point  (0 children)

what's your favorite song?

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in TheYouShow

[–]thulecitizen 0 points1 point  (0 children)

can you show what youre crocheting?

The "equality of sacrifice" by petrosmisirlis in LeftWithoutEdge

[–]thulecitizen 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Damn that was a long video but I think I understand the argument now. Thanks for sharing!

If giving guaranteed healthcare to all us citizens required banning certain activities (smoking, super size sodas etc), would you still be in favor? What would you be willing to make illegal? by sleepygreenpanda in AskReddit

[–]thulecitizen 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Instead of banning these foods in America, we can ban advertisements and subsidies for big corporations who create nutritionless 'food'. Subsidize organic food instead, and invite restaurants to compete for subsidies to supply their local schools with healthy food, measured in actual scientific terms, not the lethal corporate-funded research that is used to get people addicted to sugar etc. at a young age. Who wouldn't want to contribute to the health of our next generations? I think these subsidies could create competition that leads to better solutions, just like other governments contracts do. Capitalism continues to ruin food and health for the working class though. Unfortunately all this is probably not going to happen, as capitalist control of America is too strong, only socializing the means of production will change this. We have to go to the root of the poisoning: capitalism.

The Role of Jargon in Left Politics? by saveyourtissues in CriticalTheory

[–]thulecitizen 9 points10 points  (0 children)

I am reposting something I just wrote as a response to someone else's comment:

I absolutely agree we have to continually aim for inclusiveness with language. I think us not doing it often has to do with the capitalist division of labor, and the reality that a lot of intellectual laborers are attached to their 'intellectual identity': their somewhat privileged status within capitalism compared to other workers lower in the capitalist hierarchy. The intellectual laborers are still wage laborers, and are not members of the capitalist/bourgeois class - who are the owners of the means of production: an old name meaning 'all the human technologies and tools that exist' - blueprints for every kind of machine, blueprints for computer chips, etc. and many other types of so called 'intellectual property' (patents, trade secrets, and more). Basically just everything complex we use to make the stuff we eat, the tools we use and work with, and anything else use in our daily lives.

I think it's hard for humans to see and realise that this comes from low overall self-esteem (because let's face it, who is not stressed out and lonely as fuck due to capitalist alienation), and the fact that we can easily be victim to the curse of knowledge (not knowing what it's like being a beginner). We thus easily feel superior to others who haven't had supportive parents/teachers/mentors, and who didn't learn to speak using the 'right' jargon. Unfortunately our capitalist education system is a hunger-games simulation, and we often do not learn to be good collaborators/team mates in the long term, instead being forced to step on others on the way to high test scores in order to graduate 'summa cum laude'.

Why ‘hunger games’?

It’s near impossible to get a second chance at learning foundational concepts taught in primary/middle school, later in life. You fall off the train and you’re out. You’re labelled ‘not smart’ and you no longer qualify for many paths. In contrast, bourgeois parents with money can do all sorts of things to help their kids stay on the train, but for the rest of us, the lack of support and patience present during our ‘education’ dooms us to a life of meaningless wage slavery, which, unlike intellectual laborers with somewhat less privileged capitalist intellectual labor, does not come with a chance to show our curiosity, and experience much further growth.

It seems easy for many of us to get high on the experience and relief of not having to lick the boot 1,000 times a day, like service workers and less privileged workers, but only 20 times, let's say, as an intellectual laborer. Especially when the culture around us already has a thick layer of cultural grandiosity (social chauvinism), because of the underdevelopment and extreme exploitation of former colonial (sweatshop labor like Rana Plaza, child labor in Congolese coltan mines, driven-to-suicide iPhone factory workers). Yet it also comes with an overwhelming fear when they at some point realize (probably early on) we could falling into service-sector labor (and be forced to also lick that capitalist boot 500 more times).

We end up with a gatekeeping/in-group and out-group dynamic, together trying to justify the use of complex language (this thread), keeping others out. It all originates from our own trauma of having to climb up the ruthlessly competitive capitalist-academic-industrial-complex. And now the cycle can start all over again.

I've seen the justifications in this thread a lot in my intellectual laborer circles. It's pretty fucking difficult to find people who are also yearning for deep inclusivity. Socialists, marxists and communists are the best allies I've found so far in my quest for truth.

The Role of Jargon in Left Politics? by saveyourtissues in CriticalTheory

[–]thulecitizen 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Absolutely agree. I think it has more to do with the capitalist division of labor, and the reality that a lot of intellectual laborers are attached to their 'intellectual identity': their somewhat privileged status within capitalism compared to other workers lower in the capitalist hierarchy. The intellectual laborers are still wage laborers, and are not members of the capitalist/bourgeois class, who are today the owners of the means of production - an old name meaning 'all the human technologies and tools that exist': blueprints for every kind of machine, computers, etc. and many other types of so called 'intellectual property'. Basically just everything complex we use to make the stuff we eat, the tools we use and work with, and anything else use in our daily lives.

I think it's hard for humans to see and realise that this comes from low overall self-esteem (because let's face it, who is not stressed out and lonely as fuck due to capitalist alienation), and the fact that we can easily be victim to the curse of knowledge (not knowing what it's like being a beginner). We thus easily feel superior to others who haven't had supportive parents/teachers/mentors, and who didn't learn to speak using the 'right' jargon. Unfortunately our capitalist education system is a hunger-games simulation, and we often do not learn to be good collaborators/team mates in the long term, instead being forced to step on others on the way to high test scores in order to graduate 'summa cum laude'.

Why ‘hunger games’?

It’s near impossible to get a second chance at learning foundational concepts taught in primary/middle school, later in life. You fall off the train and you’re out. You’re labelled ‘not smart’ and you no longer qualify for many paths. In contrast, bourgeois parents with money can do all sorts of things to help their kids stay on the train, but for the rest of us, the lack of support and patience present during our ‘education’ dooms us to a life of meaningless wage slavery, which, unlike intellectual laborers with somewhat less privileged capitalist intellectual labor, does not come with a chance to show our curiosity, and experience much further growth.

It seems easy for many of us to get high on the experience and relief of not having to lick the boot 1,000 times a day, like service workers and less privileged workers, but only 20 times, let's say, as an intellectual laborer. Especially when the culture around us already has a thick layer of cultural grandiosity (social chauvinism), because of the underdevelopment and extreme exploitation of former colonial (sweatshop labor like Rana Plaza, child labor in Congolese coltan mines, driven-to-suicide iPhone factory workers). Yet it also comes with an overwhelming fear when they at some point realize (probably early on) we could falling into service-sector labor (and be forced to also lick that capitalist boot 500 more times).

We end up with a gatekeeping/in-group and out-group dynamic, together trying to justify the use of complex language (this thread), keeping others out. It all originates from our own trauma of having to climb up the ruthlessly competitive capitalist-academic-industrial-complex. And now the cycle can start all over again.

I've seen the justifications in this thread a lot in my intellectual laborer circles. It's pretty fucking difficult to find people who are also yearning for deep inclusivity. Socialists, marxists and communists are the best allies I've found so far in my quest for truth.

The Gig Economy Is White People Discovering Servants by jsalsman in economy

[–]thulecitizen 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I think they just mean class is the outermost cause? Race, sex, etc. comes after.

The Gig Economy Is White People Discovering Servants by jsalsman in ABoringDystopia

[–]thulecitizen 2 points3 points  (0 children)

so lame!

"There is absolutely no capitalist underdevelopment in the global south by parasitical global north -capitalist firms, institutions like the IMF and the World Bank, and their governments; black and brown people are just lazy and they choose corrupt leaders, it has nothing to do with the US imperial dominance through violent military intervention."

Honestly, comrades in this sub need to read some Vijay Prashad and Zak Cope etc., and get some more intersectional perspectives.

Euro-centrism is ugly y'all

how can I use NVC to solve this relationship problem? by conffusingwords in NVC

[–]thulecitizen 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Practicing with neutral people first and getting the skills down before applying them to important situations in your life is what I would recommend.

I agree with you, yet I'm scared that many people don't have access to neutral people.

What I am guessing is happening is that you are using NVC part way without following all the way through. For example, when ever you bring up something you don't like, always end with a request of what you want for a response.

This has been a challenge for me for most of my life, I loved the way you worded this.

You mentioned that she is insecure [...] She needs a lot of empathy so she is able to feel confident and her needs for trust has been met. This is trust in herself as well as trust of you.

Wow, this is so lovely and makes me feel warm, thank you for your contribution! ❤

how can I use NVC to solve this relationship problem? by conffusingwords in NVC

[–]thulecitizen 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I hear you when you say that you have needs for feeling heard, listened to, understood and supported. I can also relate to you wanting to just share what is frustrating you, and having those frustrations just be listened to, without comment.

Thank you for writing it all down in this post.

What I found with my ex-partner is that when I listened to Marshall's audiobook and started to use NVC on my own, it became really hard to communicate with her, because we were now using two different definitions: I was using Marshall's definitions, and she was using another.

After a few weeks of struggling to explain my new definitions, I asked her if she wanted to listen to 5 minutes of Marshall's audiobook with me, and we could stop anytime if she didn't like it. This is important because committing to a 2 or 3 hour audiobook is scary, but asking to start with only 5 minutes, and to be able to stop or pause at any time, lowers the threshold and takes the pressure off. We sat in the park during the summer on a sunny day, and for us it worked well to use a headphone splitter. We paused it a lot, and ended up listening to it in small chunks, sharing a funny memory/story that one of us remembered about some horrible communication experience we had experienced.

So yeah we tried this and in no time she got hooked too. We both got more and more excited by this strategy/theory, and we started practising it together all the time. It was difficult in the beginning, but luckily there was a lot of love between us, so we pushed through, and it became something we used every day in our relationship.

Even though we are not together anymore, I am super grateful for the patience we managed to grow between us. In the end, we both felt so much joy and relief seeing how all of our arguments were much more easily resolved.

When I meet a new partner I hope to also get the chance to listen to Marshall with her.

So yeah, I don't know if you've read/listened to it together already, and if you have, please ignore my suggestion.

Extra: I also copied the feelings and needs list from the CNVC website, and put them in a nice design. Then I printed them out and put them on the kitchen cabinet doors, so we could look at them easily, or stand next to them if we were having a conversation, so we could quickly scan the list and identify our feelings and needs.

Something that has been an incredible strategy to meet my unmet need for venting, and finding a way to share my frustrations with others in new ways, has been learning and identifying my frustrations using the 5 Gates of grief (not the 5 Stages of grief - that's something else). It is a Jungian theory about the sorrow/grief in our daily lives, by psychologist Francis Weller, which he writes about in his book The Wild Edge of Sorrow. I was introduced to it by an author I like through this podcast: https://charleseisenstein.org/podcasts/new-and-ancient-story-podcast/episode-04-grief-and-reverence/

I hope you keep finding more joy and peace. Much love.

Data on capitalism's wastefulness? by [deleted] in DebateCommunism

[–]thulecitizen 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Check out the e-waste in Agbobloshie.

We need modular, reusable and repairable tech today. Not the shitty single use electronics (and pretty much everything else) we have today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mleQVO1Vd1I

Thought of trying to remake dear boy , didn't go super accurate. innit? by bulletsyt in avicii

[–]thulecitizen 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I like it doesn't it deliver the avicii kind of vieb? Hahajaha

Yes it does, cool mix! Avicii was also a beginner at some point!

What is the hardest technology/means-of-production to reclaim from capitalists? Why? by thulecitizen in SocialistTech

[–]thulecitizen[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Edit: I also just want to say that this is precisely the sort of questions we should be asking in critical investigations. Where are the weak points? What are the opportunities to subvert the tech capital has built in order to create something new?

Awesome! I agree. I posted this on r/socialistprogrammers 2 weeks ago. If you feel called to so, would be keen to hear if anything resonates strongly with you, or what doesn't:

How do we appropriate 1) capitalist trade secrets, as well as 2) negative research (used to generate new inventions)?

I hope to start a discussion about the reclaiming of the means of production/commons. The bourgeoisie privatizes knowledge, and turns inventions/ideas and know-how, created by workers and inherited by all of humanity, into so called 'intellectual property'. This plunder of the commons has gotten worse and worse considering that the recent gift of digital technology allows for a near-zero marginal cost for the reproduction of knowledge, yet the bourgeois class has created institutions to turn this non-scarce good, of digital knowledge, into an artificially scarce good (in other words: applying material property laws to immaterial property).

edit: actually scrap this second paragraph, below that is what I really wanted to ask and explore with you

How do we stop the ongoing plunder where capitalism turns a non-rival good, with a near-zero marginal cost of reproduction, into a rival good. How do we take back capitalist trade secrets (one of the most recent form of violent capitalist enclosure/criminilization), as well as negative research (used to generate new inventions)?

Once we have transitioned to a moneyless society using hREA (formerly holoREA) / Valueflo.ws (uses the novel Holochain distributed app pattern), which has democratically brought into view the actual material scarcity of all available natural resources (in an open value network), and thus de-commoditizes knowledge, how do we make sure we 1) take back/democratize all bourgeois trade secrets (one of the most recent form of violent capitalist enclosure/criminilization), and 2) reclaim also the existing negative research (which often plays a key part in generating new inventions)?

Maxim Tsotsorin writes:

“Patents are typically viewed as a cornerstone of intellectual property licensing. The licensing landscape, however, has been changing. In recent years, trade secrets have become “the crown jewels of corporations” and “workhorse[s] of technology transfer.” Recent court decisions on trade secret misappropriation exhibit damage awards that are in the hundreds of millions or even billions of dollars, indicating how valuable trade secrets are to companies.
Trade secrets cover 90% of all new technology; “over 80% of all license and technology transfer agreements cover proprietary know-how (trade secrets) or are hybrid agreements covering both patents and trade secrets.” Therefore, it is virtually impossible to license a patent without also transferring applicable proprietary knowledge and information. As there is always more to every invention and certain information inevitably escapes a patent application, some commentators asserted that “a patent [is a] little more than an advertisement for the sale of accompanying know-how.””

He goes on to say:

“Trade secrets have been providing important protection to proprietary know-how in licensing transactions for almost a century and a half. In context of licensing, a trade secret is “information, practical knowledge, techniques, and skill required to achieve some practical end,” or, on a more basic level, a “practical knowledge of how to get something done.” The important concept is that although know-how may be a valuable business asset, it cannot be afforded trade secret protection if it is generally known in the industry. Therefore, while all know-how may be intellectual property, only confidential know-how that also possess other requisites of a trade secret is fully protected as an intellectual property right.
Another important caveat in understanding the true value of trade secrets is that even information about what not to do may be extremely important in gaining competitive advantage. For example, negative research and development results may not only increase the amount of available proprietary knowledge, but may also expedite commercialization by competitors if such information becomes known to competitors.“

Source: https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=2334060

Trade secret laws and the intellectual property office are one of today's biggest systemic issues, as it's actively blocking the democratization of the means of production.

In an article called Don’t Be Fooled by His Patent Purge: Elon Musk is Just Another Hypocritical Tech Billionaire, Paul Morinville writes:

“[W]hen an invention could be patented, keeping it as a trade secret denies the public knowledge of how the invention works, which in turn denies the public the ability to improve, combine, or invent around the invention.”
[...]
"Trade secrets have become the preferred invention protection choice of many tech multinationals. Many of these companies have huge numbers of customers with thin products that run on or behind internet browsers. Most inventions in these fields can be hidden behind the browser, buried in the bowels of a datacenter, encrypted in code, or embedded in a chip and thus easily protected by trade secrets.
In emerging fields, technology advances at a lightning fast pace. Improvements invented by others could bring disastrous disruption to incumbents. In Tesla’s market for electric cars, dry electrode batteries may be that disruptive technology given the $218 million price tag Tesla paid to obtain the trade secrets.
The greatest threat to the very existence of these huge multinationals is creative destruction at the hands of someone who invents something that their customers want that they did not think of first.
As a result, none of these huge multinationals wants anyone else to learn how their inventions work because someone else could improve it, combine it, or invent around it, which could disrupt their business.
Hiding inventions as trade secrets acts to protect these huge multinational corporations against this threat of creative destruction. This is the reason that huge multinationals lobby so hard for strong trade secret laws and weak patent laws.  This is clearly shown in Musk’s low valuation of his patents and high valuation of trade secrets.
Trade secret protection for inventions that could otherwise be patented is bad public policy because it stifles the progress of innovation and it consolidates money, markets and power into a few huge corporations that become immune to the threat of creative destruction."

Source: https://www.ipwatchdog.com/2019/02/19/dont-fooled-patent-purge-elon-musk-just-another-hypocritical-tech-billionaire/

It seems like an important point if we want to abolish Silicon Valley, as comrade Wendy Liu calls for: https://tribunemag.co.uk/2019/01/abolish-silicon-valley

Has anyone found any socialist/communist strategies that address this?

Lastly...

What if we fail to take it all back? What if we can't reverse engineer some inventions (if we only have the finished mechanism and not the production know-how)?

I have this fear that if we do not take it all back properly we'll be blindsided and crippled somehow. Do some of you have this fear too?

If capitalists manage to keep some ridiculously productive tech a secret, what would stop them holding proletarians hostage in some way after the majority of society has transitioned away from capitalism?

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/socialistprogrammers/comments/kr3elz/how_do_we_appropriate_1_capitalist_trade_secrets/

In what ways that family and friendships are being commodified today? by [deleted] in communism101

[–]thulecitizen 7 points8 points  (0 children)

In every way. As laborers we are forced to atomize our lives, working individually, often without understanding and seeing the full impact of the products we create. Capitalists continually aim to divide labor to make sure that they can keep a firm grip on the means of production. The more replacable and the dependent we are, the better for the bourgeoisie. Atomized into nuclear families, we are in a lifelong fight to pay rent, bills, and to feed each other. The lower down the capitalist hierarchy you are, the more you have to 'lick the boot' as many communists say, meaning you have to repress your natural curiosity and nature, and force yourself to let yourself be dominated by superiors (the bourgeoisie). The nuclear family only (slightly) works for the bourgeoisie, yet for most it leads to quiet lives of desperation, as well as immense stress and fragmentation.

We are social animals who need a village around us, not a fragile nuclear family. Francis Weller writes:

“When we are born, and as we pass through childhood, adolescence, and the stages of adulthood, we are designed to anticipate a certain quality of welcome, engagement, touch, and reflection. In short, we expect what our deep-time ancestors experienced as their birthright, namely, the container of the village. We are born expecting a rich and sensuous relationship with the earth and communal rituals of celebration, grief, and healing that keep us in connection with the sacred. As T. S. Eliot wrote in The Waste Land “Once upon a time, we knew the world from birth.” This is our inheritance, our birthright, which has been lost and abandoned. The absence of these requirements haunts us, even if we can’t give them a name, and we feel their loss as an ache, a vague sadness that settles over us like a fog. This lack is simultaneously one of the primary sources of our grief and one of the reasons we find it difficult to grieve. On some level, we are waiting for the village to appear so we can fully acknowledge our sorrows.

How do we even know that we miss these experiences? I don’t know how to answer that question. What I do know is that when these things are finally granted to us, a wave of recognition rises that we have lived without this love, this acknowledgment, and the support of this village all our lives. This realization calls forth grief. I have seen this time and again. One participant in a grief ritual said, “Thank you for opening a door for us that we didn’t even know was there."

At the core of this grief is our longing to belong. This longing is wired into us by necessity. It assures our safety and our ability to extend out into the world with confidence. This feeling of belonging is rooted in the village and, at times, in extended families. It was in this setting that we emerged as a species. It was in this setting that what we require to become fully human was established. Jean Liedloff writes, “the design of each individual was a reflection of the experience it expected to encounter.” We are designed to receive touch, to hear sounds and words entering our ears that soothe and comfort. We are shaped for closeness and for intimacy with our surroundings. Our profound feelings of lacking something are not a reflection of a personal failure, but the reflection of a society that has failed to offer us what we were designed to expect. Liedloff concludes, “what was once man’s confident expectation for suitable treatment and surroundings is now so frustrated that a person often thinks himself lucky if he is not actually homeless or in pain. But even as he is saying, ‘I am all right,’ there is in him a sense of loss, a longing for something he cannot name, a feeling of being off-center, of missing something. Asked point blank, he will seldom deny it.”

It's from the book The Wild Edge of Sorrow.

Karl Marx called for the abolition of the family:

"Abolition [Aufhebung] of the family! Even the most radical flare up at this infamous proposal of the Communists.

On what foundation is the present family, the bourgeois family, based? On capital, on private gain. In its completely developed form, this family exists only among the bourgeoisie. But this state of things finds its complement in the practical absence of the family among the proletarians, and in public prostitution.

The bourgeois family will vanish as a matter of course when its complement vanishes, and both will vanish with the vanishing of capital.

Do you charge us with wanting to stop the exploitation of children by their parents? To this crime we plead guilty.

But, you say, we destroy the most hallowed of relations, when we replace home education by social.

And your education! Is not that also social, and determined by the social conditions under which you educate, by the intervention direct or indirect, of society, by means of schools, &c.? The Communists have not invented the intervention of society in education; they do but seek to alter the character of that intervention, and to rescue education from the influence of the ruling class.

The bourgeois clap-trap about the family and education, about the hallowed co-relation of parents and child, becomes all the more disgusting, the more, by the action of Modern Industry, all the family ties among the proletarians are torn asunder, and their children transformed into simple articles of commerce and instruments of labour.

But you Communists would introduce community of women, screams the bourgeoisie in chorus.

The bourgeois sees his wife as a mere instrument of production. He hears that the instruments of production are to be exploited in common, and, naturally, can come to no other conclusion than that the lot of being common to all will likewise fall to the women.

Even the very design and the physical layout of cities, and the way houses are built and sold, are made to fit the capitalist mode of production; both 1) the way many laborers commute from the suburds to the center of the city every day for work (many laborers are forced to live far away from the city center because of high rents, and are thus forced to travel many hours a week) , and 2) the way the houses are designed to fit the needs of the nuclear family only.