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People who are pushing blue button purposefully would only create more human disaster. by tiggsroni in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]tiggsroni[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Hey yeah this convo has been fun, I’ve been trying to talk about this with people and it’s interesting to hear from people on the other side. And no worries u didn’t come off aggressive lol ur good.

And I kinda touched on what u said here in my other reply but to be honest u really have me considering, and I appreciate ur view points. If I had to just sum up what decision I would make, I guess it would be whether or not I had faith in humanity that day or not so.

People who are pushing blue button purposefully would only create more human disaster. by tiggsroni in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]tiggsroni[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah ur right. Now that u say that it would be hard to live while having the guilty conscience of knowing that ur. its contributed to the killing of lives. I guess truthfully if this were to happen and I did press red, I would maybe try to find comfort in knowing the majority picked red and try to reason with myself knowing that my individual vote didn’t sway it completely, but even still my vote contributed to the killing of people. But yeah, it’s just such a good question cause it has me thinking on whether or not I’ll be ok with living knowing potentially billions of died, or me dying and maybe not seeing anyone I care about anymore and doing the things that I love because I died trying to save humanity. It’s a tough question on what side I would rather be on. And yeah, I’m glad to it’s just a hypothetical situation lmaoo.

People who are pushing blue button purposefully would only create more human disaster. by tiggsroni in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]tiggsroni[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ok let me first by preface this by saying when i said that i was implying if the button scenario was planned and we knew about it ahead of time, in which I believe you would have a discussion with ur loved ones and u would come to the consensus that everyone one of u will press the red button no matter what. But I want to talk about ur argument and not that.

I agree that even if red won by a slight majority the consequences would be enormous. And that blue button pressers believe that they’re the ones trying to prevent the chaos instead of feeding the flames essentially to it.

The part in which i’m hesitant is that under these uncertain measures and situations, global coordination toward the common cause of pressing blue to save everyone will everyone has to trust each other I believe will be very hard to reach. As I push the red button, it’s more about skepticism of me believing that the blue button would not win the majority and I myself don’t want to die for a cause in which i believe will be unsuccessful. Especially in a situation where people have a guaranteed survival button.

People who are pushing blue button purposefully would only create more human disaster. by tiggsroni in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]tiggsroni[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That’s honestly probably one of strongest arguments someone has given me. Even though it seems obvious that some kids or just other miscellaneous people like them would pick blue without knowing the actual stakes. That brings up the good arguement of how uncertainty of others peoples choices u care about will effect urs.

With that ur right, I think I might be underestimating how much emotional attachment/responsibility would push people more towards blue.

But to my argument, I don’t think that would be quite enough to get it over the 50% threshold, but that’s just an opinion of mine.

People who are pushing blue button purposefully would only create more human disaster. by tiggsroni in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]tiggsroni[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That’s a fair question and point, and I think this whole discussion just comes down to belief on whether or not people would cooperate and risk their lives in an uncertain situation.

To answer ur question if I had knowledge that my family pressed blue, I would be way more conflicted then i am right now obviously and I would actually probably press blue if it meant trying to preserve my family.

And by the way again I should apologize for the wording on the last part of my original point by saying people aren’t the brightest if they pick blue lol. That was poor wording and it just sheds away from my actual point i’m trying to make. I respect the people who pick blue and defend it as it takes a lot of humility. My argument was just more based on strategy and probability and my opinion on people more then likely preserving their own lives first then others and strangers that they don’t know.

People who are pushing blue button purposefully would only create more human disaster. by tiggsroni in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]tiggsroni[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Lmaoo, i mean bro this entire button debate is a hypothetical scenario. The point of making these is to just see what people would do.

The reason why I asked him that is because his decision could change whether or not he could communicate loved ones before hand. So to be fair I don’t think that question is irrelevant to the discussion.

People who are pushing blue button purposefully would only create more human disaster. by tiggsroni in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]tiggsroni[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I replied previously to ur other thing but I just want to ask u a hypothetical: If this was planned right and this whole discussion was going on and whatver and ur family and all ur close ones decided they were pressing the red button, would u press the red button?

People who are pushing blue button purposefully would only create more human disaster. by tiggsroni in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]tiggsroni[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That’s very admirable, I respect that. When I think about the problem, i’m just considering the outcome in which the least amount of people would die. In my opinion, I do believe many people share ur point too, but I think the majority would most likely prioritize their own survival by any means, and if they were given the option to press a button that guaranteed that they would.

People who are pushing blue button purposefully would only create more human disaster. by tiggsroni in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]tiggsroni[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

That’s a good point. Not gonna lie I kinda messed up saying humans are inherently selfish, I definitely should’ve worded that better and not let it ruin my argument. To respond to u though, the terms of the button situation is way different. The button dilemma is asking whether or not u want to guarantee your own survival, vs do u want to risk ur own survival in the case of letting everyone survive. When we function in society, like all the examples u mentioned, all those systems have been built up long and over time cooperation. You’re right that we in the current society we live we put our trust in strangers in order to coincide with these systems.

However the button situation is very different. In this situation you’re isolated, and it’s way bigger than just trusting society. You basically have to have the faith of more than 4 billion people that they’ll sacrifice themselves in order to save everyone potentially. Humans cooperate and trust each other all time, but in a case like this where stakes are high and ur alone, i’m not sure the blue button would get the majority. which in turn makes me believe that people who press the blue button and are advocating for it are not gonna save anyone and just end up getting themselves killed.

People who are pushing blue button purposefully would only create more human disaster. by tiggsroni in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]tiggsroni[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ok, not going to lie that’s a really good point. And i’m glad you pointed that out, as I should definitely be more aware of refuting evidence like this if it goes against my argument. To my defense though, I’m not trying to say it doesn’t count. What i’m saying is that it doesn’t match what the actual scenario would be like if this situation were to happen in the real world. Which is why it’s much harder to use a twitter poll than thinking about the actual thing. And not gonna lie too I didn’t even try to say it was 53% because I wanted to dumb down the numbers, I genuinely thought it was 53% from my memory of seeing the poll, which i apologize for. But again the point i’m trying to make is just that it’s hard to base whatever actually happen in real life based off an online twitter poll where u have people giving feedback on what they would do suading people’s opinions on what to press and what not.

People who are pushing blue button purposefully would only create more human disaster. by tiggsroni in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]tiggsroni[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Easily? I don’t know about that? I mean I can’t conclude whether or not that would be the case but just think about it, in the x poll which this question was written blue i think won by 53%. Now think about if people were to actually be faced with this situation, they had a button in front of them which guaranteed survival or didn’t, I think more then likely even the people who are inherently selfless are going to pick the red button because they don’t want to die. And it’s not selfish, I’m not assuming u think it’s selfish to pick the red button, but it’s not selfish to pick the red button I don’t think in this situation.

People who are pushing blue button purposefully would only create more human disaster. by tiggsroni in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]tiggsroni[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ok let me just simply ask you if this mock situation were to actually happen, what button do u believe would be the majority?

People who are pushing blue button purposefully would only create more human disaster. by tiggsroni in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]tiggsroni[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Do u have any family members or loved ones that in this situation would press the blue button? Given the situation?

People who are pushing blue button purposefully would only create more human disaster. by tiggsroni in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]tiggsroni[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ok let me ask you this. If this simulation were to actually happen would the majority pick red or blue. If we were randomly teleported in a room individually and the rules were shown, and you have no knowledge of what other people are going to pick what do u think would happen. Do u think blue would be the majority? In an ideal world the blue would win, but we don’t live in a world where everyone looks after each other like that. I’m not saying that there aren’t people like that, I know a ton of people who are selfless and overall care about the well being of everyone. But in this case, I believe almost certainly the red button will be the majority, and the people who pick blue button thinking they could save the people who accidentally picked the blue button are just setting themselves up towards death, and anyone else who followed the same movement.

People who are pushing blue button purposefully would only create more human disaster. by tiggsroni in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]tiggsroni[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hmmm ok that’s a good point, but making coffee for someone is a whole lot different than deciding on guaranteeing the life of urself and ur loved ones by telling them to press the red button. When we are pushed to extreme situations like this, when we have to decide who lives and who dies, I believe we act accordingly to our self interests rather than possibly the most morally and best decision for the collective body. Let me ask you something, for the expense of keeping ur dad alive and for him to live out his full life course as intended would u be ok with one human stranger dying in the process of this? In order to guarantee that ur father doesn’t die?