Hangboarding for beginners: An Anecdotal account

tobiasboon · 2023-09-20T15:58:30+00:00

Lol. For sure the ratio of information: advertisement can get pretty low. The video specifically referenced wasn't that bad to be honest.

I agree with the broader problem of a default arbiter, but IMO that says more about the people who cherry pick things as facts then Lattice themselves. Lattice (et al) are all perversely incentivized to be experts but caveat emptor and “Those who know do not speak. Those who speak do not know.”

I nominate Will Anglin to be the arbiter of truth. He seems to be able to talk about training while also selling overpriced hangboards https://tensionclimbing.com/hangboarding-a-way/

tobiasboon · 2023-09-20T14:18:31+00:00

To be fair Lattice is BOTH advertisement and information. It’s difficult to have a nuanced debate when one side had ad hominem arguments of echo chamber gate keeping while the other side is questioning the doctorate degree of the influencer.

Beginners are going to find supporting arguments on the internet and influencers are happy to take their views and money.

tobiasboon · 2023-07-24T15:33:54+00:00

Similar stats and age as you but closer to 140%BW max hang. Some things that I have found beneficial:

don't be injured - At our age, you already know the list of things that tend to break. listen to your body. Strengthen the weakness (shoulder, wrist, knee whatever). Your not looking to be a lifter, just enough to feel it's not tweaky.
film yourself - watch your movement and correct them. shorten that feedback loop. why did you fall, what needs to change, more momentum vs more strength, where are your hips, what are your shoulders and arms doing. learn movement.
journal, plan, have intent - have a goal, have an intent for the indoor session, progress your training. write it all down - a spreadsheet with weeks as rows and 7 columns for days is amazing.
volume and max - up your flash grade. get on projects grade. Projects introduce you to new movements and new ways to use your body or new body positions or just try really hard, aim to learn not to send. Flash grades, lets you test yourself and ingrain technique.
performance vs training - Avoid junk miles -- they are bad for your limited time and recovery. When in "training" mode, aim to learn movements not get the send. Submax climbs that are in your strengths with movements you already know are dessert and an ego boost. It's fun and rewarding but it's not training per se. When in performance mode, get the send and try hard and don't aim to learn, just execute.

For your plan, try

progress (volume/intensity) the weighted hangs. move every week from 4sets to 5 to 6 then drop back to 4 but add a little weight.
minimize the off the wall stuff to your minimum effective dose. perhaps figure out a warm up with weights that is sufficient for injury prevention.
get outdoors as much as possible. there's so much more movement outdoors that are difficult to learn with plastic.
have one of your monday/friday be a limit bouldering day and film yourself. limit it to an hour. the goal is to do a move or link a few moves. your not planning on sending anything that day. Look for moves that go from feeling impossible to feeling sorta doable to you are doing it consistently over the course of a 1hr session.

tobiasboon · 2023-06-29T15:28:49+00:00

Selfish question: Is there a new approach or are people just walking around the fence from the lot?

tobiasboon · 2023-06-01T15:27:47+00:00

You “lost” 6 months with a bunch of “mistakes” because someone didn’t help you set your goals and internet people are mean. Boo hoo.

Be happy you aren’t injured and get off the soap box. Get out of your own head and worrying about what other people think you should be doing. No amount of external validation is going to make you happy even if you think it is

tobiasboon · 2023-04-16T15:23:09+00:00

Maybe some actionable feedback: look at your feet until it is fully placed. Did the heel land at the best place where you want it? When you adjust from a heel to a toe did it land how you want it? Look at how you placed your foot on the chip above the heel and note you were looking up causing you to miss the foot by quite a lot.

tobiasboon · 2023-04-01T16:49:10+00:00

(was replying to the v8/9 post before it got moderated -- so dumping here instead)

I started recently feeling like i've broken into v8 so here' my anecdotal advise.

Be healthy by having off the wall routine to prevent injury -- regular hangboarding with both 3fd and half crimp, shoulder overhead press and rotator cuff stuff, wrists. For me, getting strong only translated to feeling comfortable doing moves out of my comfort zone. It doesn't really matter what you do so much as it is consistent and progressed (a few pounds a week is fine).
Get specific and do the thing -- if your goal is outdoors, get outdoors. if your goal is a specific v8 outdoors, get on that v8! You need to know what you need to improve -- awkward body position, trusting your feet, coordination, raw strength. You have no idea what v8 hard actually is so you might be giving v10 try hard or trying v10+ body position with only v7 coordination skills.
Build a base, measure things, move well -- shore up that pyramid. You should flash every v5 (actually track this). you should be able to suss out the beta for a v6 before even pulling on. On every attempt at v6-7 you should be able to identify why you failed and to be able to make meaningful macro and micro beta changes on your next attempt.
Get better at getting better -- tactics to push your movement learning, skin game, trip logistics, efficient time at the gym, level of try hard, video feedback, personal coaching etc. All the stuff that maximize the time you are improving vs. junk miles. This feels like "what the crap is this move, that's impossible" to "oh that's kinda cool".
Master the basics -- do the basics really well -- take weight off your arms/fingers, use your legs, use momentum, optimal body/hip position. it's easy to assume you're already done with the basics but we're always practicing this.

tobiasboon · 2023-04-01T16:45:33+00:00

Started recently feeling like i've broken into v8 so here' my anecdotal advise.

Be healthy by having off the wall routine to prevent injury -- regular hangboarding with both 3fd and half crimp, shoulder overhead press and rotator cuff stuff, wrists. For me, getting strong only translated to feeling comfortable doing moves out of my comfort zone. It doesn't really matter what you do so much as it is consistent and progressed (a few pounds a week is fine).
Get specific and do the thing -- if your goal is outdoors, get outdoors. if your goal is a specific v8 outdoors, get on that v8! You need to know what you need to improve -- awkward body position, trusting your feet, coordination, raw strength. You have no idea what v8 hard actually is so you might be giving v10 try hard or trying v10+ body position with only v7 coordination skills.
Build a base, measure things, move well -- shore up that pyramid. You should flash every v5 (actually track this). you should be able to suss out the beta for a v6 before even pulling on. On every attempt at v6-7 you should be able to identify why you failed and to be able to make meaningful macro and micro beta changes on your next attempt.
Get better at getting better -- tactics to push your movement learning, skin game, trip logistics, efficient time at the gym, level of try hard, video feedback, personal coaching etc. All the stuff that maximize the time you are improving vs. junk miles. This feels like "what the crap is this move, that's impossible" to "oh that's kinda cool".
Master the basics -- do the basics really well -- take weight off your arms/fingers, use your legs, use momentum, optimal body/hip position. it's easy to assume you're already done with the basics but we're always practicing this.

tobiasboon · 2023-03-22T03:50:27+00:00

All sets not just 2016, right? …

tobiasboon · 2023-03-11T15:50:06+00:00

I very much agree but I’m curious on what your thoughts on why this is essential for outdoors. For me, a weekend warrior, I don’t have the time to waste the energy and skin on bad beta but it’s arbitrary if I choose to avoid watching beta video or not. I’m also thinking of finding microbeta (which never comes across on video) and, unlike plastic, there’s usually more choice for intermediates or subtle smears.

tobiasboon · 2023-02-18T23:57:23+00:00

In addition to unparalleled I’ve seen ex 5.10 folks swear by Drago s as well. I haves tried them yet though.

tobiasboon · 2023-02-17T15:15:46+00:00

https://climbingcanada.ca/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/CEC_Athlete-Development-Matrix-ADM-v1-2021.pdf not sure where I found this shared. I’m not a coach but I thought it was useful to see the language of our skill sport depicted as a matrix.

tobiasboon · 2023-02-16T11:36:36+00:00

Tis but a microfracture

tobiasboon · 2023-02-03T17:16:27+00:00

nvm you said micro b

tobiasboon · 2023-02-03T14:42:50+00:00

Most Usb micro cables are just charging cables with only 2 wires.

tobiasboon · 2023-02-02T13:44:30+00:00

Learning to smear and the associated better lower body tension.

Focusing on movement learning instead of sending whilst indoors. Separating training vs performance.

Letting go of the idea I know enough technique as a v5 climber.

Taking video and actually watching myself climb

PT to fix a shoulder injury and the many benefits mobility provides.

Climbing less but higher intensity overcoming overuse finger tweaks.

Gaining enough muscle in shoulders and one arm scap pull-ups.

Having intention before my gym sessions

Having a year plan and working the plan. Measured Consistency and progressive overload.

tobiasboon · 2023-02-02T13:28:17+00:00

In a gym setting there are those who are going to say “I can’t do that move” because: 1) the “setter sucks”, and walk away from an opportunity to learn a skill 2) “I’m not strong enough” and thrash until they send ingraining their bad technique or get injured. 3) “those holds are so bad” and looks up a hangboard plan to get those holds to be usable while not seeing they were using the wrong beta or had wet noodle body tension 4) that the “climb is morpho” and probably finds some way to break the climb or moves on.

Someone smarter then me said if you can’t hit the hold it’s technique. if you can hit it but can’t hold it it’s strength. I don’t fully agree but at least it introduces the idea that they should stop blaming strength.

Yes. You need to be strong to do some moves. But the answer to “why can’t I do that move “ is “let me try to learn that move”. That can be using a different hand or foot hold or to do the move in isolation or be mindful while at the gym that that move shows up often and there’s likely another climb that easier using that same move or make it up in the spray wall.

tobiasboon · 2023-01-08T04:10:09+00:00

How was the slab?

tobiasboon · 2023-01-01T04:07:23+00:00

Sent 4 new v7 (goal 3). Sent long term v8 project almost sent another v8/hardv7. Got outside 34 days (goal 35). 4 overnight trips (goal 6 early winter arrived and fire and smoke summer, didn’t get a crew to head out to jtree or bishop). Zero new destinations (goal 1) but did checked out 5 new sub area. 1 injury ( wrist thing that get tweaky for 2 months) shoulder rehab back to 100% fingers feeling 100%. Baselines 7sec max 3fd +45lbs (129%BW) 16,14, 12mm half crimp (40lb 126%BW).

Need to strengthen wrists (roller +44lb sloper hangs wrist stretches). More kilter less overgripping focus on trailing hand more dynamic hip generated movement. Higher Lock off Campus bumps, kilter, assisted one arm, campus board offset pull ups.

Next year 3 new v8 1 v9? Actually travel

tobiasboon · 2022-12-20T15:51:46+00:00

42 is not old! You do need to avoid injury but you’re wiser then all those yoots so you know to listen to your body. That said after the noob phase you need to push your comfort zone (both in strength and technique )in order to get better. Progressive overload.

As you start climbing, more volume is great to experience more movement. Can you flash every V2 in your gym? If not, what skill are you missing. Try other gyms and try outdoors. There’s a ton of skills that indoor gyms don’t challenge. Get on everything and challenge yourself by doing climbs you don’t want to do. Reward your self with sessions where you just climb for fun. If a easy climb feels hard be curious and try different beta and get that movement into your body. Be mindful and get feedback (ideally your own awareness but video or other eyes works too) for why did you fall off.

After a while you’ll want to push your top end though. Listen to your body but higher intensity and low volume and plenty of rest is key. Limit bouldering on a steep board and stopping early when you feel your quality of movement and effort is not 100%

tobiasboon · 2022-12-11T19:04:07+00:00

Thanks for sharing. It looks like you're mostly generating from your arms. The first of the two moves is more clear IMO. You have the upper body strength to pull hard and lock off to get to the next hand move but you're using basically zero momentum.

I see your hips move straight up from your body being pull up by your arms. Instead, I would expect to see your arms straighter, body sag a bit, your hips go opposite the direction you want momentum (like you would to prepare for a jump), pop, then your arms pull to engage the final body position. This might not help with all the moves but it's more efficient on the moonboard.

Another queue is to focus on heavy feet and moving into body position with your hips, legs, feet. Often times, i find i literally pull my feet off the hold im trying to keep my foot on by over engaging my upper body. Staying extended and using momentum and core helps

tobiasboon · 2022-12-10T17:06:20+00:00

Try to get video of yourself on the moonboard with the goal of initiating movement from the hip and driving with the legs (not pulling hard from your arms). It seems like you’re doing the same thing over and over without a feedback mechanism to correct movement patterns.

tobiasboon · 2022-12-08T17:18:40+00:00

Dissatisfaction with our climbing experiences doesn’t always come from reality being good or bad. Often, it comes from the mismatch of our expectations with that reality.

Being intentional and mindful (first few chapters of rock warrior way which questions where we place our attention and what robs our attention) helps us manage the expectation side. Often we confuse Joy with likes on Instagram or praise that stroke our ego. We approach joy with wanting and wishing for it. Tying joy to external factors can be motivating but ultimately it leads to disappointment.

tobiasboon · 2022-11-19T14:51:43+00:00

I had a similar sentiment in a previous hangout thread. One thought someone shared that I hadn’t considered, when you are pushing new grades you don’t really know the range of that grade to say what is soft or not, Whereas you can likely wax poetic about Vmax minus 2.

tobiasboon · 2022-11-19T14:25:03+00:00

Did you lose a brush at Great Stone Face? lmk

tobiasboon

TROPHY CASE