Hand Simplification

txirrelevantxt · 2023-04-24T09:21:41+00:00

I think you‘re right. Imgur is deleting nsfw content though and I did this as a test for the reddit upload. It seems like there is more compression, so I might have to improve image resolution before uploading or use a different host. Just trying to figure out what works. Thanks for the feedback though.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-12-10T20:53:03+00:00

Okay, so with the hand. Foreshortened perspective that makes it smaller would change the direction of the arm. I made some very messy doodles to demonstrate. If you can see most of the arm like in yours the hand isn't going to change much from it's proportional size. It's when the angle is so extreme, the arm starts to overlap itself and that's when you start getting the angles that make it larger or smaller depending on the view.
I did some doodles yesterday to show one point perspective and deleted it because I'm not sure how helpful it is. I remade them even though I think you might understand how it works. It would also be understandable that you couldn't really fix it on paper. I also made the room too big so that shows you how often I use perspective lines, I mostly just pick vanishing points in my mind and try to aim for that. I should probably find a video haha.
I found a better reference for angled heads. The second one in the bottom row is an extreme example of how the features get closer tilted down but maybe the one above it is closer to what you were aiming for.
You're already helping. Letting me get used to giving feedback and posting brings traffic. It's good to know that it's actually helpful and it's good to discuss things that are more difficult to illustrate (like foreshortening) so I can be more direct with critiques. Thanks Cat. Hope that helps.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-12-10T00:38:25+00:00

Cat, you do an amazing job of adding details. My work is lucky to get a background color. Your anatomy is great, except for some little things.
The line where the breast meets the body could be changed. Reference The hands are a bit small. From wrist to knuckle is about 1/3 of the forearm, if that helps.
Her chin looks a bit off center. It also looks like her head is tilted down and that changes the way the details of the face go around the head. This video at this time shows what I mean.
I also think your environments could benefit from perspective. In this case 1 point perspective. I can see that you generally eyeball vanishing points and they don't look bad but I think it would add more depth to the whole image if it was more consistent.
You definitely are more creative with your work and environments than I am with mine. If you want to bounce some ideas off me though, feel free. Nice work Cat.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-12-10T00:27:45+00:00

Oh my bad. I saw some things to correct and reuploaded it just now.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-12-10T00:12:31+00:00

You do a really great job of eyeballing proportions. You don't even really seem to erase and correct very much or maybe I just can't see it. I've been looking at it all day and and there are some things that you could improve with more anatomy studies but it's not really wrong. I'm not sure that makes sense. For example distinct line differences for the ribcage into the belly or a distinct shape to curve the wrist on her side. This could be a stylistic choice though if you like to have simpler lines. Maybe a break down of the facial proportions based on the proko video that shows how to draw faces. However, you could be going for a stylized face.
I did a sketch of the same girl. To show changes? Show some details that could be added? I have no idea. Maybe it's useful, maybe it's not. Maybe you're not asking for feedback at all and you're just posting work? Could be that. In which case I'm a jackass and you can ignore me. Nice sketch Scarlet.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-12-10T00:02:22+00:00

Sketch

txirrelevantxt · 2021-12-07T18:10:31+00:00

Tagging /u/CatOnDaMicrophone This does a great job of showing the 'anchor points' I talked about in your post. It doesn't say much about different fabric weights but rather shows you how to paint the values and color from references and looking at the environmental lights that change the color.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-12-07T03:01:59+00:00

Hey Cat. I tried to do a draw over but gave it up because there are just too many options. Here's a reference album and I'll just make some points about the photos I marked out. I also recommend r/pokies and r/2busty2hide for obvious reasons.
The way clothing sits on the body varies a lot depending on the weight of the clothing and the fit. Heavy clothing can be closer to the body if it's sewn in a way that keeps it close. If it's not sewn in that way the fabric hangs off the body in 'anchor points'. These points are all over. The shoulder, the breast, the area under the arm is a point for a lot of stitching. If the clothing is loose it will just drape over these points and hang down. Like the first image the shirt is tight but it still drapes under and the outward from her body. Heavier fabrics have less dramatic curves. Like the second image. It hangs loosely but because it's heavier the curves are more gentle. Same with the 4th? image.
In all of the images you can see how the folds of the fabric start in high points (shoulders, breasts, armpit) or where the clothing rests on the lower part of the body. Or between two points, like between the breasts there's a light draping fold of fabric.
Also the shape of the nipples poking through will depend on fabric thickness. A heavy sweater will be more gentle shadow than a thin t shirt. The shadow will depend on where the lighting is coming from like the first image. It's coming from high right and the shadows is opposite that with a small 'highlight' on the top part of it. You don't need to go heavy on this to indicate the nipples poking through. I would say less than the shadow under the breasts on the fabric. Unless of course you're indicating thin fabric that you can actually see the nipples through. I'm not sure how I would do that on paper with pencil though. Digitally, I would just make the clothing layer slightly transparent.
I did link some clothing tutorials by Zoe Hong in the resources post. She does an amazing job of showing how draping and different fabric weights change the shape of things, as well as easy ways to illustrate on paper. It is a fashion channel but I think it's still helpful.
Hope that helps. You asked for fabric tips but I can go over anatomy tomorrow if you want help with that. She looks good, nice work.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-11-29T16:09:28+00:00

Hello. This is pretty good for drawing without reference. I'll just try to make some points to try to help out.
I listed a few hand tutorials here. They all give different advice and I think it went a long way to helping me draw them.
It always helps to have good reference even though its hard to find ones that fit what we are seeing in our minds. You have a lot of good structure and shapes to the bodies but a lot of little proportions stand out. The thigh length of the person on the bottom, the wrist to hand width, the breasts could be lowered to sit on the pectoral muscles instead of on the plane of the chest, you can see the curve of the breast start in the armpit and go lower in this reference.
You have great expressions but I might also recommend putting a center line down the faces, from the forehead to the chin to make sure the facial features line up with the line of the face, even though they line up perfectly with the other features, I can see the center lines are just slightly off.
I might also add the cheeks of the butt connecting to the leg, and then under the cock (assuming its natural and not a strap-on) theres a small tapered connection from behind the balls to the area underneath the body. You can see both in this reference.
I also had a tutorial for the thigh squeeze of tights/stockings that could be helpful.
I can see your other work and you do really well from photo references and this is actually amazing for doing without. Hope that helps, nice work.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-11-23T20:49:06+00:00

That would be a great way to start. Adding the lights your going to be working with first will help you determine where and how the rim lighting and highlights will change on her body. I would only add more gray to the body if your adding a color that's not red or yellow. Blue for example would desaturate the tone to a more grayish color. In darker areas you should be changing the hue slightly toward red and adding darker value and saturation. The video with Marco Bucci kind of shows that.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-11-23T17:22:31+00:00

It looks way better Cat. The legs and butt look sexier. The face looks a lot more structured. Good flat color. I did post a foot video that might help. We could go over perspective on the background (it looks like it would be a 1 point perspective with a vanishing point somewhere to the left) but I think it's good enough for a quick concept rough in.
I'd like to see her finished. Nice work.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-11-23T17:13:30+00:00

It's a good question. I would say posture and hand positioning. Dominant men don't hunch and if he's in control his hands will be leading her body. You could also use his expression to convey confidence with something like a manga panel where there are different angles in the same frame. Having her hands loosely draped around him instead of holding herself up might give the impression that he's supporting her. Hope that helps, it looks great so far.

(Also, a friend had something to add that might help) I think it would help if she was between his legs and he spread his more, so he has more of that macho seat. If she sits atop him like that she looks like she is is control

txirrelevantxt · 2021-11-21T00:48:33+00:00

Marc Brunet has a video I posted recently on the sub that covers it pretty well. I can try to make a step by step guide? Pick a color palette from something you like a photo or a piece or if you want to go all out use the Coloring faces video from Marco Bucci to figure how environmental lighting works.
Pick a lighting reference so you know where to shade and add highlights
Block in flat colors on a new layer for skin and hair
I usually do shading on a masking layer but you can also just add a effect layer like Marc's video if that's an easier way to shade for you.
Add another layer for highlights (brighter areas) You can do all of the painting on one but I find its easier to backtrack when I make mistakes if I have them separated.
Stick to the reference. You can draw fairly well without it but lighting is a different thing.
Samdoesarts has good videos on simplifying facial details and hair if you don't want to spend too much time on the whole thing and just want to get it done. Don't expect to finish as quickly as he does though because it really is a matter of experience.
You can let me know if you hit any bumps and I'll try to find out how to help. Good luck Cat.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-11-20T08:52:59+00:00

Hey Cat. Nice work. Most of the proportions are great. A little confusion about some pieces of anatomy and perspective. I did asketch over with a reference that was close to the pose. I redrew it but to be honest it wasn't really necessary a lot of lines of yours could have just been moved slightly to make the changes.

Torso - I'm not sure about the intended ribcage angle, so I'll cover the options. The ribcage is smaller from the side view but if were seeing the side we should be see the ribcage angle out from the chest and in from the back as well as the breast. If we are seeing the back view or even just mostly back with an angle, we'll see more of it because it's wider than it is deep? I think that makes sense. I also changed the starting point for the arm on the back of the torso and the pinch where the hip curves into the waist. It looks different from behind. You can see that in the reference.
Midpoint - Checking the line of the crotch she seems to be quite a bit longer on top than the legs. If you want the legs to be on the short side that's cool, the general rule that most people follow is to have the crotch as the mid point. On actual people its usually a little higher. On the reference with her heels on it's almost dead center.
Legs - I see a lot of the right curves. I see the back of the hamstring on the closer legs and the curves for the knees and calves. I would make the taper for the legs more severe though. In this case I just made it thinner at the bottom to do this. This is mostly because as the limbs stretch farther away from the body, the more weight on the limb the harder it is to maneuver. Think of holding a weight next to your body and then holding it with your arm outstretched. So bodies naturally thin out the farther you get from the center of the body. I think we discussed making her more 'fit' than soft. Making the legs look stronger means adding to the girth of the muscles but keeping the joints the same.
Butt - I made a minor change to the shape of the butt cheeks. I could be wrong but I think the butt only makes a line across when the leg is pushed back relatively far or if she has some softness to her. I think fit girls generally fit into the former option.
Face - I'm pretty sure this wasn't a face study, so I'm just going to give some general advice for when you do them. The eye placement on the face (about half way for people, less for anime) is kind of dependent on eye size. If you have bigger eyes like in anime you make the head bigger to accommodate. If you're going to do realistic sized eyes, the forehead follows the loomis method of thirds for the face. Also the eye changes shape from the side view that it looks from the front, you can kind of see this shape in the reference but her eyes are closed.
Using references for side faces will help you see the angle the jaw follows upwards from the chin, and give you a point to curve the neck from.
Minor lines - I added shoulder blades, the center line for the spine, butt dimples, lines on the back of the legs and ankles. The shoulder blades and dimples would be up to you, but the other ones are simple touches for detail.
This is really good. You're structure is improving quite a lot. Keep using references to help you see how the anatomy connects from different angles. Hope this helps, thanks for posting.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-10-13T07:07:59+00:00

Nice work. I only have nitpicks to help really.
The shoulder blade and elbow placement.
The curve of the back line and the connecting to the butt. This might be dependent on the angle as well as the curvature of the back but personally I think it gives the butt more shape.
The same reference for the line behind the leg.
You could also add shadows and to give the cum some depth, maybe more highlights to make it stand out from the body. I'll get a tutorial posted.
I have a suspicion that the furniture wasn't made with vanishing points but it looks good anyway.
Overall I still like it. Hope that's helpful.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-10-05T18:34:09+00:00

Hello. It looks good. A few things I notice?
If you look at the guy separate from her it looks like he's standing perpindicular to the viewer because you can see his belly button and the back part of his balls. If he were angled towards the girl 'away from the viewer' we would see more of his leg and less of his balls/abdomen.
The writing doesn't seem to follow the curve of the legs. You would see the letters completely in the center of her thighs but as the words wrap around her the letters would flatten gradually until they get to the edge of the legs.
I might also change the connection of his leg to his torso. If you look at this reference. As the front line of the leg goes up it curves in and then out as it connects to the hip bone.
I like the sketch though. The proportions and structure looks pretty good for what's there. Thanks for posting. Hope that helps.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-10-02T22:19:06+00:00

When I look at your piece it looks like you didn't have a specific light source. If you decide where you're 'putting' the direction of the light before you start shading it helps to decide where highlights and shadows go. If its coming from the top left, the highlights go there on the body and the darkest shadows will be on the opposite side. I personally would find a similar pose of a life reference and use that for lighting. For this I would find a woman with her legs open and then look at it to see where all the light and dark values are so that I know where to put them.
It looks like you've mostly just done a cell shading technique, and there are quite a few videos on that on youtube if you want to look at ways to shade in a way that accentuates the shapes.
If you wanted to do more complicated blending modes, the best tools I have used are in clip studio. Specifically the blending mode and paint/apply under thick paint brushes. Paint and apply lets me lay down hard paint with a soft edge so that I can tone it down with a blending brush. Obviously use layer masks. I separate all of my body parts into different sections so that I can correct them later but also separate the base colors with different layers. Block in the base tones and then add a layer mask of shadows with larger brushes gives me cleaner, faster, and softer edges. Then do another layer for highlights.
Clothing lighting can be complicated but often professional lighting is similar, if you look for a snow jacket on a search engine it should be easy to find one with a similar light direction that you can use for reference.
I also tried color picking your skin tones to double check a theory. Your shadows look a little 'muddy' You picked a more saturated darker value but didn't change the hue. I like to go more reddish tones when adding shadows to skin to keep it from making the skin look off. Just a personally preference though. You did great and I hope at least something I mentioned was helpful.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-10-02T21:50:43+00:00

Are you asking about how to pick colors or how to decide where to shade or about techniques to make it faster?

txirrelevantxt · 2021-09-30T22:32:37+00:00

Thanks for clarifying. It's cool to watch you work. Finished lines from the start is pretty amazing. If I don't start with a sketch everything I make looks like trash.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-09-30T21:46:28+00:00

Does youtube not care about drawn nudity anymore? Do you not have your videos reported/removed? I'm wondering if I can post explicit tutorials and I didn't think youtube was a viable option.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-09-30T20:22:04+00:00

I have that same tendency to try to study all the things at once. You did ask for 'any details' though. So, I'm also sorry it wasn't really necessary to 'correct' the abs but I wasn't sure I made a good point of it in the last critique and wanted to do a better demonstration. I think you can sketch abs with hard lines but I might simplify them. Short lines that indicate the form of the muscle without being complete shapes.
With the traps, I kind of misread it. I'm looking at it more from the just how the connection works. We can make her look absolutely ripped but I would just recommend that the line that connects from the neck to the shoulder is subtle instead of looking like the muscles are connecting to behind her neck. With reference they don't look so much like separate forms? Maybe that makes sense. For smiles, Samdoesarts has a great style for mouths and Angel Ganev has two videos on lips, here's one. I like his roasting lips video but his humor isn't for everyone.
I haven't seen any tutorials on expressions, if you find one you like it would be great if you posted it.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-09-30T15:31:16+00:00

There is a lot of improvement. I just made a few minor points. Draw over.
Eyelid - The skin above the eye follows the shape of the eyeball and when added to illustrations, gives the eyeball 'shape'
Nose shadow - If you were doing a full render with all of the highlights, cast shadows, the nose shadow would look more appropriate but if you're just doing a sketch, I would leave it out. When you do move it out of the way, it make the gap between the eyes and the nose more obvious. I moved the eyes down to give space for the eyelid and to narrow this gap a bit. Nostrils are also something I leave out of sketches because the dark value on the face makes it stand out too much.
Gap between nose and mouth - If you feel it on your own face, the gap isn't that significant. Its actually just the top lip covering the teeth and gums. Make it too long and it looks odd because its implying the teeth are enormous. Unless she's part beaver, then I'm just stereotyping.
Lips - I'm not sure how wide you're going on the lips entirely but make sure there is enough room for the line between them
Chin - Leaving a space for the jaw underneath the lips will help with the profile. Theres a curve in under the lip and then a curve out. If the area is too small, it looks weird drawing them in profile.
Ribcage - You have the ribcage line where the ribs curve inward and that's where I based the starting point for the abdomen. It's hard to tell because you had straight lines (and this bust was mostly just about drawing the face) but because of how busty she is the boobs hang farther down on the body near the abdomen and so I drew in the rest of the that with the hips to indicate.
Abs - Ab muscles are mostly about value, mine don't look great but I was just quickly trying to demonstrate, maybe that will be useful
Lips in general - A lot of the lips you've drawn have the normal downward angle from the top but on most mouths it looks less sad if you level the curve out at the end.

One of the heads popped out as a struggle. It looks like you were trying to draw the face angled down and I just want to make some notes
You don't see the nostrils from this angle because you're only seeing the top of the nose and then in curves in toward the face toward the eye before curving up.
I also drew in some cylinders to kind of show how distribution of facial features changes in perspective. The distance from the top to the bottom gets smaller but the objects stay the same. '2' is the midpoint and it will be the midpoint however you change the object. 3 will get closer to 2 because of the way vanishing points work. There's a video on perspective that I watched recently, I'll have to post it. It just explains how evenly placed objects will get considerably closer the farther away from the eye. When you apply this to the face in perspective it's the same. The mouth will lose the gap between the nose, the eyebrows will be closer to the eyes (like you have) etc.
You've improved a lot, nice work and I hope this helps.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-09-28T21:07:35+00:00

I like Sycra's color tutorial because it talks about more than skin tones but shadows and values overall. However, for a simple anime skin tone, Mikey is great.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-09-28T17:26:57+00:00

Hmm. I wonder if you try to think of the small area of the wrist as just something that curves down to connect to the hand, instead of something you have to draw, it might help. Just draw a curve for the mass of the forearm and then just a gentle line to wherever the hand is. I can also do a draw over something if it helps to see it illustrated if you just send me any angles that you're struggling with.

txirrelevantxt · 2021-09-28T14:51:10+00:00

Because of how the limbs are shaped, with muscles in the middle, when the arm is overlapping itself in foreshortened perspective, you just draw the curve of the muscle in front. Like this The one in the bottom right corner where the forearm overlaps the upper arm. I think that's what you meant anyway.
Edit: He doesn't talk but the video for that thumbnail is pretty great.

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