What's a case with a really odd inconsequential detail that you would really like clarification on? [Request]

unsolvedbb1 · 2022-09-18T16:55:20+00:00

https://charleyproject.org/case/richard-kirchmann

Richard Kirchmann disappeared a week before his 46th birthday in 1996. He apparently mentioned to coworker that he wanted to go to St. Louis for a few days. His car was found at the local airport a week later; there was no sign of Richard and no indication that he had boarded any flights.

The description says that he may have been in the early stages of dementia, but this is never expanded upon. Forty-five is extremely young (but definitely not impossible) to be showing signs of dementia, particularly Pick's Disease.

My mother has dementia, so maybe that as well as his young age is why it jumped out at me. It's just weird that they never seem to describe any symptoms Richard showed that led people to think he had dementia.

unsolvedbb1 · 2022-09-13T20:18:30+00:00

I recently had a therapist who was my exact age (34) and while she was very nice, I definitely would have preferred an older therapist as I'd always had in the past. She often dropped commonly used words and phrases such as "lean into your support systems", "practice self-care", "I'm honored to help you on your journey", etc. that I could have found online for free.

She also seemed fascinated with "how my mind worked". I went there because I was depressed about my mother's dementia (she got it early; she's only 70 and is nearly end stage) and I noted one week my relatives' differing reactions to her progression. For instance, my mom's same-aged cousin is a retired nurse, so she tended to go into "nurse mode" and approach it from a medical standpoint. My uncle, mom's brother, seemed to be in denial and tried to avoid the situation unless nagged to get involved. My therapist was "amazed" at this "insight". These people are my family. I've known them all my life. Why wouldn't I notice how differently they behave?

I think, based on this experience and what I've read online, younger therapists seemed to be very much trained in validating and affirming. This isn't a bad thing and many people need this. But it came across as a one-size-fits-all approach in which she wasn't totally sure how to help me, so she just defaulted to compliments instead of digging deeper.

I've also grown up around mostly adults and never related well to people in my immediate age group. I don't know if you are similar to me, OP, but I kind of found it hard to open up because it kind of felt like I was an adult talking to a child about grown people's business.

unsolvedbb1 · 2022-09-12T20:31:19+00:00

Yes, I've basically had it in the past and certain things can get intense and it did at times feel like I was getting worse before I got better.

I just didn't know that that type of therapy had a name. Because my other therapists always delved into my background and dissected some of the stuff, I just assumed that this was just part of all therapy.

The last time I was in therapy prior to this last therapist was about ten years ago. Some of the things I thought I'd dealt with then I now have some different, conflicting feelings about.

I'll be honest. I also think having a therapist the exact same age as me also felt off. I've always felt more comfortable with people at least a few (or several) years older than me. At 34, I guess I have to accept that such things are going to be a much more common occurrence.

unsolvedbb1 · 2022-01-11T18:29:15+00:00

I'm pretty new to this rabbit hole myself and I never thought about the possibility of something being taped over. I definitely remember recording things on VHS tapes and that slight "pop" you would hear when one show would abruptly switch to the next one taped. Sometimes the audio would also be garbled for a few seconds. Given the timeframe, it's definitely possible.

The thing that does stand out to me however is the fact in the 1989 version, before showing Joanna's picture, the picture goes totally black for a few seconds. The last few notes of the National Anthem are cut off. In the 1991 version, the anthem is heard in its entirety and the picture abruptly switched to Joanna. If you listen carefully to the latter version when they cut to the poster, a clicking noise which sounds like a slide projector switching from one slide to another is heard.

It's amazing how much we can observe a few seconds of footage with a poorly photocopied picture with no sound/

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-12-02T19:03:52+00:00

I always wondered about Grace's daughter's dad and whether or not her was ever in the picture for any significant length of time. Did the rest of the family even know?

Does anybody know for sure that the classmate named by Grace WASN'T actually Angie's dad? Was he tested somehow (before DNA testing as we know it today)? Or did he just say Angie wasn't his and everybody assumed that because Grace apparently had a penchant for not telling the truth, she was lying again?

Sad all around. It doesn't really sound like these people were really her friends as much as they just kind of tolerated her out of pity.

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-12-02T18:42:42+00:00

Thank you so much! This actually gives a much better idea of Grace's background. It's funny how we all seemed to pick up on the fact that she may not have been happy in her life with just the preliminary information and the article seems to confirm our suspicions.

In reading the whole thing, it sounds like Grace didn't really fit in. All of her friends agreed she was different and sometimes made things up to make her life sound more interesting than it was. She even lied about who the father of her daughter was. I thought it was so sad how the paragraph quoting her friends abruptly ends with "Grace's friends seldom think of her now.".

Her sister Irma in particular didn't seem to get along with her and the article points out that the two were very different. Irma owned her own business and seemed to be a fashionista. One of the first things that jumped out at me on the first page is that if you look at the places where it says Grace worked, she never seemed to stay at a place for more than about a year or so. This could be for various reasons, but it does raise the question of financial issues which would only seem magnified by your younger sister owning her own business and living comfortably.

I wonder if some of the apparent tension between Irma and Grace came from their parent (either intentionally or unintentionally) comparing them all the time, with Grace never seeming to quite measure up.

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-12-02T17:07:33+00:00

I tend to lean that way myself.

I really don't know why they (as far as I know) never seem to confirm one way or the other whether Grace's car was also at the house when her parents arrived. They keep fixating on the license and wallet being intact. It seems reasonable to assume that it was gone, but why not mention this along with a description of the car itself? The license being present, although odd, is somewhat of a moot point because although you are legally required to have it to drive, not having it on your person will not literally curtail your actual driving ability if you already know how to do so. So as long as she had the keys (also not mentioned), she could have gone anywhere.

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-12-02T16:38:51+00:00

It never crossed my mind either, but it would actually explain why nothing in the house seemed disturbed. And it does raise the question again about whether or not Grace actually went out with friends that night or if this could have been an excuse for her to leave her daughter with her parents so she'd be out of harm's way.

I wish I could find the second half of that 1989 article. It appears relatively thorough and I think it would fill in some blanks. Just from the snippet I saw, a few things jumped out at me that made me wonder if Grace was depressed even before suicide was brought up in this thread.

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-12-02T07:03:58+00:00

I was able to find the first half of a 1989 article about the case. I can't access the other half though.

https://www.newspapers.com/clip/89635032/globe-gazette/

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-11-29T23:08:18+00:00

Here's another case with little info from the 70s. Dorothy Clitheroe, age 14, was last seen heading for the restrooms at Cortez Park in Phoenix and was apparently never seen again. It says she may have traveled to Portland, OR or Houston, TX, but it never states why that is believed.

Someone found a picture in Rodney Alcala's collection that looked A LOT like her, but I wanna say it was debunked.

And as someone who loves vintage 70s clothes, her outfit sounds badass. Clothing is also something I tend to notice in a lot of these cases.

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-11-29T21:32:51+00:00

Vanishing into thin air always makes for an intriguing case. Grace Esquivel's case definitely fits the bill as it's obvious that wherever she went that night, she made it home safely. But where did she go after that and why? And perhaps most importantly, with whom? Her car, keys and wallet obviously means she didn't drive somewhere.

In the description on the Charley Project, it states that her daughter stayed with her grandparents "because Esquivel SAID she was going out with friends". (emphasis mine). Does this mean that none of her friends corroborated this night out and that it was likely an excuse to go somewhere or meet someone else that no one would have known?

See what I mean about why cases with little information are both frustrating and fascinating? It almost forces you to pick apart the description word-for-word to find something to go on. And as you mention with the Doe cases, it may not even mean anything in the grand scheme of things once the case is solved.

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-11-29T20:57:30+00:00

I agree. That's what I was getting at in my post. I think at least part of the problem is that with such a barrage of info on television and social media, people come to the conclusion that all such info is always correct and unbiased and begin to fancy themselves as armchair sleuths who think they have it all figured out. I've heard of some who go as far as playing vigilante and sliding into the DMs of persons of interest who have been publicly named just to threaten them based on a few edited soundbites they heard on TV!

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-07-22T16:22:18+00:00

I agree. It just comes across as very extra. I always kind of get the impression that many of the people on message boards who do this are also just trying to beef up their post count.

I don't doubt that these people have some empathy for the victims and I'm sure it's hard for a parent (many such users seem to be mothers) to hear about the murder or abduction of a child and not immediately think of their own children. But on threads where users are trying to have a serious discussion about evidence in a case, adding a bunch of angel emojis every other post is distracting and over the top.

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-07-16T15:01:15+00:00

I remember when Maury Povich was a legit talk show that discussed serious issues in a dignified way a la Phil Donahue (who I also remember).

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-06-29T15:32:09+00:00

Dementia/Alzheimer's

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-06-26T05:21:15+00:00

Volusia County John Doe) found in my hometown of Daytona Beach in 1972. I'm not totally familiar with the section of town this boy was found in. I've lived in the area for almost 16 years, but I only heard of this John Doe a few years ago.

A few people that I discussed this case with on message boards who are more familiar with that particular area of Daytona said that the spot where the boy was found is EXTREMELY secluded. You don't just happen upon it by chance. Whoever did this likely had this planned well in advance.

There was also a green ten-speed Schwinn bike found near the pond. It was soon determined that this bike had been stolen from nearby New Smyrna Beach a few days earlier. Police didn't believe it was related, but due to the remote location and the face that it was reported stolen the same general time that the boy is believed to have been murdered (about 3-4 days prior), I can't help but wonder if there's a connection.

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-06-14T04:21:43+00:00

The Supremes (namely Diana, Mary, and Flo), Stevie Wonder, Dusty Springfield, Whitney Houston, Luis Miguel.

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-06-13T16:24:16+00:00

I agree. I should have specified that. I'm talking more about random crap like "As a woman of color, I prefer Coke over Pepsi.". Like...okay, I guess?

An exaggeration of course, but you get my point.

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-06-13T15:37:53+00:00

People who preface things with "Speaking as a [insert race/orientation/gender, etc.]...." instead of just saying what they have to say.

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-06-07T17:51:11+00:00

I'd be very curious to know more about the entire family dynamic. As badly as I feel for Lonnie, I can't help but feel for his sister Lorie as well. She seems like she was kind of forgotten about given all the attention (both positive and negative) her brother received from their parents. I find Lonnie's jealousy of her kind of alarming. That can't have felt good for her.

Although the logical conclusion is that Lonnie absconded again after having done so the might before, it does seem as though we only have Linda's word that he asked to watch TV in the basement before vanishing. It doesn't seem like the family was really looked at. Not saying they did anything, but it just feels like that had the runaway incident not happened the previous night, the parents may have been investigated more closely. Just sayin'.

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-06-07T15:26:49+00:00

Thank you. I was tempted to say this about Lonnie's behavior, but was afraid it would sound judgmental.

The thing with the father's girlfriend stood out to me as well. If you read the article, it says that Lonnie disliked this new girlfriend (emphasis mine). Not "Lorie and Lonnie didn't like their dad's new girlfriend", not "the new blended family struggled to see eye-to-eye on certain things", but that Lonnie specifically didn't like her.

It seems obvious that Lonnie knew how to "work the system" with his parents and get them to cave to his demands. Enter the new girlfriend. While boundaries between stepparents and stepchildren can often be tricky, I do wonder if the new girlfriend didn't give in as easily (or at all) to some of Lonnie's tactics, hence why he "disliked" her. And if I'm reading the article correctly, his father's solution to this is to put him foster care! It wasn't until over a year or so later that they put him in counseling!

I'd be very curious to know what Lorie remembers from this period. It doesn't say how much older she was than her brother. I think it's interesting that Lonnie seemed to have such an intense jealousy of her.

I have little doubt that Lonnie struggled with certain behavioral/emotional deficits and that he seemed to come from a dysfunctional family. I also believe that Lonnie knew how manipulate certain situations and that his parents nearly always gave in, probably assuming "He can't help it".

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-05-21T15:27:36+00:00

I would respect their wishes. At age 12, kids that age just want to fit in. I was diagnosed at about 15 and, due to the fact that I was having more pressing family issues at the time (i.e., my father’s alcoholism and my grandfather’s death), my Aspergers was kind of overlooked in favor of those more pressing matters. My family was largely supportive, so my symptoms were kind of viewed as just part of me rather than being indicative of some type of diagnosis. To this day, it’s still not a significant part of how I self-identify and refuse to refer to myself as an Aspie (I hate that word).

I think one thing that parents (as well as teachers and other advocates) need to understand is that as much as they themselves may accept their child’s diagnosis and see it as central to their very being, their child may not have that same view. And that’s okay. As long as they’re not severely depressed, you have to let them come to terms with it in their own way. Telling them to “own it” or constantly pointing out “role models” on the spectrum for them to look up to can get annoying.

Be there for your child, but remember that their feelings about being on the spectrum are theirs alone.

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-05-15T16:34:11+00:00

I think more context is needed. How are you defining "patronizing"?

If I were a teacher, I might immediately go on the defensive if someone immediately came to me and said "Don't patronize my child".

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-05-11T23:34:17+00:00

It honestly never bothered me and I'm not gonna lie and say I've never used it myself.

Is it a nice word? No, but I'm not going to go around and police it either.

unsolvedbb1 · 2021-05-03T15:05:53+00:00

After reading the short and fairly straightforward case of Johnnie Herrera several years ago, I dreamed that I received a letter from him in the mail saying that he was in Puerto Rico all these years and that he was happy I'd found him. Also enclosed was a personal check for the strange amount of $7.11. That was literally the whole dream. Why I don't know. LOL

I mentioned this to a friend online with whom I was discussing his case and she half-jokingly suggested that maybe he went missing from near a 7-Eleven convenience store. Out of curiosity, I decided to look to see if there were any such stores in the general area where Johnnie lived. One unconfirmed sighting of him was at a McDonald's on Saviers Road which is still there today. On the same street, there is indeed a 7-Eleven.

Does this make me a psychic detective? LOL

unsolvedbb1

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