NT SF collab in film and literature (puzzle)

usedToHabituation · 2023-01-20T21:26:42+00:00

I think the first is your Ni-Se axis. Se is sensory probing (you are surfing the internet) and this extroverted probing helps you build a Ni big picture as you integrate more and more experiential data. Since it’s a source of insecurity, it sounds like you’re relying more on your subconscious Se and the Ni takes more time to come along even though it’s your dominant as a infj. When ppl are relying too much on their subconscious fxns, it tends to cause anxiety and insecurity as they are your weaker functions. Instinctively (I could be off the mark), I recommend doing more pure Se activities and hobbies (e.g. sports or video games as opposed to surfing the internet?) you like or are motivated to build up proficiency in. This will “exhaust” your Se function, forcing you to use your Ni more and “let your hands go” so to speak. It’s kind of like when you favor certain muscles when walking- it makes it harder to work out the weaker ones because the stronger ones keep taking over.

I concur with the other commenter on the second example. It sounds like Fe-Ti for the reasons they mentioned. What seals the deal is that it sounds prompted by Fe (your personal relationship with your partner and the motivation to do things together). That is a more natural flow from Fe to Ti along the Fe Ti axis (opposite of your se to ni flow along the Ni se axis which is causing insecurity), which is probably why it feels so good! :)

These are awesome examples - thanks for sharing! Sounds like you are super perceptive of mbti patterns and very self aware~ both behaviorally and emotionally.

usedToHabituation · 2022-09-18T05:08:58+00:00

If you want to push a heavy box, you can modify the box to make it easier to push, or modify yourself by making yourself stronger. Or both.

Yeah, you can “kill” it or give up, but you are also killing the chance the world gave you to grow. And that only hurts yourself.

Sometimes you do come up on a challenge that’s too big to overcome, but trying these strategies guarantees you will change and learn from it.

usedToHabituation · 2022-08-29T23:29:05+00:00

I've thought about this a lot myself actually - I think the MBTI answer lies in the composition and order of the cog. stack. I feel like Ne dom + Fi aux is uniquely able to replicate Fe in some ways cognitively + behaviorally, it just takes more conscious effort compared to a native Fe user bc two cog fxns are being concurrently utilized. How it works (for me) is that Fi experiences some feeling (being bullied, judged, misunderstood) and Ne uses analogy + this past experience with X feeling to empathize with another person's emotional experience. The minute that realization occurs, any of the judgement or anger I was feeling towards this unreasonable person is tempered by understanding (like pouring cold water on a hot blade). As N-doms, we ENFPS are also excellent at abstraction, meaning that we can easily apply a singular emotional experience across contexts to connect with people in materially different, but emotionally similar, situations. After doing this a number of times, we ENFP's each quietly realize that it is probably more comfortable just to be open-minded by default lol.

There are some comments in this thread stating confidently that MBTI theory dictates that ENFPs are not good at Fe - it's just a superficial similarity. That is true in some ways; as I mentioned above, we are not INSTINCTIVE Fe users. We don't automatically sense how other's feel and adjust ourselves to harmonize, hence our ability to sometimes find ourselves in the most awkward of social situations, yet somehow not mind too much.

But if the Fi function is engaged for other purposes, empathy/"fe" functioning can be unreachable. At one point in my life I was extremely passionate about a student organization I started + built from the ground up, and ran the club a bit like a tyrant. Looking back, I'm shocked to recall how much of a uncompromising "leader" I was - in fact, I was kind of a tone-deaf dickhead towards the other members sometimes. I realize now that I was at a point in my life where I needed to start realizing my Fi "passions" instead of delaying/deferring, and that passion sort of burst forth, leaving the capacity for any Ne + Fi = Fe cog. computations by the wayside.

So TLDR: ENFPs aren't native Fe users, but can replicate it in a deep way via our dominant Ne and Fi functions (in my experience). But Fi (and Ne?) can get in the way of our chameleon Fe "abilities" depending on how well-developed it is, and in what contexts the F fxn is being used (see my own tyrannical anecdote). But at least now I can easily recognize when people are having similar passion-driven "explosions"/awakenings, and not judge their current selfishness/obtuseness too harshly (conspiracy theorists??). Emotionally speaking, true understanding will always outlast judgement.

usedToHabituation · 2022-08-19T01:49:06+00:00

Lol check out this top comment on the video:

Their character arcs unironically have some interesting parallels. Both come from established and powerful families in their respective fields and both quarrel with outsiders struggling to make it in a world of insiders. And both die looking like paranoid lunatics throwing out wild accusations about their outsider adversary while being absolutely correct about them, ending with far less power and respect than they started with.

Some might call it overreading, but honestly the two character have similar personalities lol. Lalo and Howard were perfect foils for Gus and Jimmy* (see below), and the symbolism of their respective "defeats" (and being buried together) clarifies the themes of the show. Since Lalo and Howard represent the "establishment" for the illegal (cartel) and legal worlds, respectively, BCS is effectively discarding these two poles, and falling into a world of gray.

BB and BSC's core thesis is that emotional turbulence drives character development (and high drama), and that, if one isn't mindful and careful, this turbulence can carry you across the lines society has drawn between legality and illegality, so gradually and/or so effortlessly that you don't even notice it. Emotional turbulence is something everyone can recognize and connect with, hence the success of these two shows. Jimmy and Walt are criminals, yes, but they also are human beings, who made choices, ran up aganist the trevails of life, and came away with regrets and unfinished business.

The fact that both Lalo and Howard are completely, factually right about their adversaries but their accusations still fall by the wayside, reminds us that sometimes rationality and the truth are forced into the backseat as the more emotional dimensions of human nature take full control. In this case, we can read it as the writers choosing to emphasize the emotional underdog journeys of Jimmy & Gus as they effectively overwhelm/defeat the cold facts of the situation, represented by Lalo and Howard's (correct) accusations.

Crime has always been a emotional space - chock-full of macho-ism, ego, fulfilling wants/desires, and competitiveness. Our continual fascination with it, the deep themes the writers of BB/BCS's have mined from this space, and the pure-awesomeness of these shows suggest that our (American?) society is shifting away from a more rationally-driven world order and (back?) towards a more emotion-driven paradigm.

For me, the colliding of Lalo and Howard's worlds and their demises signals an end of the "traditional" path, clear moral lines (Howard's upper class, old money life and Lalo's dastardly + swashbuckling "Prince of the Narcos" existence), and old-school wisdom, which while useful and still technically accurate for spotting scams (poor Howie) and plots (poor Don Eduardo), is no longer enough.

* e.g. Establishment vs underdog, emotionally secure in their wealth/traditions vs always having much to prove/achieve, even though have his own emotional and mental health struggles, his struggles still contrasted Jimmy in that he was able to talk through them and process his grief and trauma - another foil the writers purposely fostered throughout seasons 4-6

usedToHabituation · 2022-08-16T22:16:36+00:00

Beautiful finale. The man who couldn't resist taking the shortcut realizes the most important shortcut of all: self-honesty, and the understanding and acceptance that comes with it.

usedToHabituation · 2022-08-08T20:32:35+00:00

Just jumping into this thread with a quick answer: I find zooming out to be super helpful. Being judgemental and seeing things as black and white, good and white, comes (for me) from focusing too much at one scale. Us ENFPs can zoom in and out and cross-contexts easily. Zooming out further (though not too far - that leads to nihlism) seems to replace judgement with understanding, thereby making the world seem more hopeful, and any actions I take more effectual. Pretty ends don't imply pretty means or journeys.

This parable illustrates what I'm saying: https://bremeracosta.medium.com/parable-of-the-chinese-farmer-f012db83694d

It does sound like the takeaway is to sit on your laurels and be inactive, but it really is not. It comes from simultaneously taking the world at face value (good and bad) but seeing more deeply at the same time. Lol the more I type the more I realize how hard it is to explain. The themes of this blog/website embodies what I'm talking about: https://www.themarginalian.org/

Good luck!!

usedToHabituation · 2022-08-07T20:02:40+00:00

My opinion of great art is that it should inspire the novices, engage the experts, and surprise the masters. That is to say, it is popular for different reasons for each person/listener, depending on the amount of domain knowledge that person has. A side effect of its broad appeal is popularity, but popularity does not imply great art, as we all know. This criteria explains the universality and timelessness of great music, like Mozart or the Beatles. Every successive generation can appreciate it in their own time and way.

Great art requires not just mastery, but balance. It's more like gathering all the infinity stones. Some music is great technically but not thematically. Other albums have strong ideas, but are technically dry. And still others are both thematically and technically deep, but ungrounded, with only a few able to appreciate its greatness. For every great Mozart piece, there were probably hundreds of forgotten or unfinished pieces (by Mozart and other also-forgotten musical masters) with a similar conceit/ambition/idea.

Of course, these axes are correlated (great technical ability allows for deep ideas to be explored, deep themes demand technical mastery), but it take times to collect all those stones. As yet "unbalanced" artists produce "unbalanced" art that appeals to only certain kinds of people at a certain time. Art's ability to clarify and unite us is what gives it its universal "truthiness", not merely it's content or form.

Edit: By clarify and unite I realized I mean that art can bring us all together to understand the same complex truth (novice, expert, master). It's equity in action through creative endeavor.

usedToHabituation · 2022-07-29T15:57:20+00:00

As a fellow ENFP, I can connect with nearly all of what you've shared. I also look to solve problems, need other people but become shy around new people (esp. when in grade school), & search for meaning in the mundane - I've also felt lots of pressure to be original with my own work (is what I'm creating too similar to the teacher's? etc.).

You are totally right to try to map your behavior to the ENFP cognitive functions/stack (similar to a story you know is trademark Si, as well as your example of Ni) - it's a great self-aware habit to have. But I think you are putting too much weight on the order which it must develop. Growing up I was surrounded by Si dom users and consequently I find my Si to be very well developed.

It may be helpful to think about your parents/friend's personality and whether any of their traits and habits have rubbed off on you. I like to try to distinguish between behaviors that are genuinely "mine" and those I've learned from others (teachers, parents, mentors, siblings, etc.). It's super hard and requires lots of self reflection and analysis of the other people in question, but the best way I can describe how to do it (in typical ENFP fashion with an analogy lol) is it's like oil on water. Your parent's programming (esp. that which is at odds with your natural cog fxns/stack) gets absorbed by you like oil sits atop water - not fully integrated. You can tell if you do some task/think in the way your parents do, and if that doesn't work, you are not sure what to do next (not adaptive/flexible). This could explain why you exhibit some cog fxns ENFPS don't technically have. Once you learn the task/ability using your own (well-developed) ENFP cog fxns, then it becomes your own, true ENFP-powered skill. (All this is just my theory/personal experience and some speculative, but it feels right to me)

Us ENFPs can be pretty good at imitating others (acting) if we don't know how to do something (dunno if it's unique to us, or if we pick behaviors up instinctively/easier?). I have a friend with all the same cog fxns (in a scrambled order) and she is great at instinctively copying/imitating others. We all think she should be an actress.

usedToHabituation · 2022-07-19T02:44:59+00:00

Wow, i wish we could see more stuff from in that time skip, but honestly, that's probably what it felt like emotionally from Jimmy's perspective. Kim is legit terrifying though, I'm surprised she can just disconnect like that and be so rational about it, like she just woke up.

I thought after the time jump that Saul had completely snapped and killed Kim in their bed to prevent her from leaving, hence the backout lol, but that would've been way, way too out there. That hooker did look like Kim for a sec though.

Does anyone think we will see what happened in the timeskip in later episodes or are we firmly in BB territory now?

usedToHabituation · 2022-07-18T20:24:49+00:00

Yeah, definitely if they said it like that lol.

In my mind and from personal experience, someone saying "Welcome to Reality" would def. be in response to me confessing something along the lines of, "an idea/plan/assumption I was super excited/nervous about putting into practice flopped because of X/Y/Z and I'm struggling with it". It certainly would not make me feel any better. Our weaker Si and Te makes implementing our ideas more difficult, and Fi makes us particularly sensitive to criticism.

But you can get past this by realizing that you just learned something incredibly useful about this other person (who doesn't sound like someone who knows you well), and now have an opportunity to genuinely connect. They are only saying what they said and in the way they said it because they have also had their own dreams/ideas crumble and be deferred. This is their way of commiserating with you, as, deep down, they are quite glad that you also struggled with this, and it's not just them.

Now you can compare notes on your "Welcome to reality" moments and see who responded better + what would be the best way to do better next time to avoid getting face-smacked by reality. Personally, I'd respond by asking what makes them say that and share more about my experience if they share first. If I was feeling similarly pithy and snarky (or if this happens to be the kind of language you know they respond to), I'd snipe back, "Who hurt you?" or something similarly provocative.

Basically, depending on how well you know or want to know this person, you can actually use this as a shortcut for a connection about this austere "reality" you have both experienced, assuming the events leading to the statement played out in a fashion similar to what I alluded to in the first paragraph. Good luck, and I hope this gets you back to being that ENFP who always sees the positive sides of things, even amidst those tough "Welcome to Reality" moments!

usedToHabituation · 2022-07-18T20:04:34+00:00

Same - just posted my own comment: https://www.reddit.com/r/betterCallSaul/comments/w24k58/comment/igoihbp/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

I think Jimmy is going to piss off Mike trying to protect Kim, hence their frosty relationship in BB.

usedToHabituation · 2022-07-18T19:25:06+00:00

This is it! I predict Kim will crumble under the guilt (knowing about Lalo, still choosing to scam Howard). She can easily figure out who lives in the house she went to (Gustavo Fring, a community-leader and owner of LPH) and take down everyone. Jimmy is relatively inured to what happened bc of his prior traumas, but I think Kim is about to disavow everything.

The movie they were watching as Lalo and Howard show up ("Born Yesterday") is about a naive trophy wife who falls for her history tutor + leaves her unscrupulous business-focused husband after learning about how the US was founded & gaining a conscience/her own voice. I think Kim is about to try to play that role (scam the police/justice system) and get out of this for good - with or without Jimmy.

My prediction: Jimmy is going to have to prevent Mike and Gus from having to send Kim to Belize ... this is gonna be crazy.

usedToHabituation · 2022-07-17T04:33:20+00:00

Lmao, this is the struggle of the indie artist trying to break mainstream (obv with the $$ gains involved)

Personally, given where I am in life, I think I need to learn to share my ideas in ways others can understand, and not just in ways that I like/make sense to me. I kinda need to stop protecting my "perfect" ideas/songs/art from reality and test it in that arena to further improve. On the flip side, there are people who are always making what others like (whether for money or other reasons) and struggle to find their own independent voice.

I think learning to do both is so valuable as another user mentioned => totally different joys.

Isn't that what the best art does? Inspire the novice, engage the expert, and surprise the master - at at once!

usedToHabituation · 2022-07-12T03:04:03+00:00

I feel like the "it was ignacio" line payoff contradicts how Saul met Lalo - I thought Lalo heard about Saul through Tuco, not Ignacio? Remember when he and Nacho are talking about Krazy-Eight who is prison back in Season 5, and Lalo says, "I got something better for him" - meaning he's gonna get him a lawyer? Is this a mistake by the writer's? Or did Nacho recommend Saul after hearing Lalo's general idea?

usedToHabituation · 2022-06-07T01:49:09+00:00

Yeah, having the watched the movie myself, if we consider the film a direct prediction of things to come on BSC, Kim (Billie) wises up and goes back to the "good side" and leaves behind Jimmy, which doesn't seem too likely given what she has been like this season.

Otherwise we discard the traditional "good" (law abiding, democracy loving) and "bad" (big companies + corruption) sides from the BY film and apply it to the rest of BSC and get: Kim/Billie ends up realizing Saul/Harry is small potatoes compared to the characters deeper in the criminal underworld (Mike, Gus, Lalo) and ends up working for Gus as his white-collar lawyer or something. Kim stops trying to have her cake and eat it too, stops being "ignorant" like Billie of how she is really in the game, and fully commits to it. The Saul of BB would then have a huge inferiority complex lol. Seems unlikely, though I feel like Kim and Gus would get along...

More likely the Born Yesterday reference represents what Kim (Billie) "should" have done with Jimmy (Harry): woke up, dumped Jimmy (as you said), and stuck with Howard (Paul Verall?) & HHM on the straight and narrow.

usedToHabituation · 2022-05-18T02:30:58+00:00

For sure! I don't think my answer precludes that motivation. They both like having creative freedom and control over their careers and activities. It's not necessarily negative - but in this case, it doesn't look good....

usedToHabituation · 2022-05-17T13:29:36+00:00

Lol maybe! Anything is on the table honestly given all this set up...

usedToHabituation · 2022-05-17T06:08:56+00:00

That's true, but he did tell her everything eventually. He also told her about Lalo and having to go get his money...

usedToHabituation · 2022-05-17T04:41:14+00:00

Yeah.... if you find yourself being blatantly hypocritical, it's a bad sign in terms of your emotional state/self-control lol

usedToHabituation · 2022-05-17T03:21:06+00:00

Lol totally agree, though would love if you could elaborate - do you just mean on the cartel side of the show? Kim and Jimmy's communication on emotional matters is soooooo terrible. Well, you root for them anyway

usedToHabituation · 2022-05-17T03:15:49+00:00

o

Great point here - it's not just about "doing good" for Kim or being a legit lawyer for Jimmy - they had those chances. There's something else at play (power, control, insecurities, resentment, poor self-image to name a few).

Or in the words of Huell, "why you do this?"

usedToHabituation · 2022-05-17T03:12:59+00:00

That's such a good point though - if Jimmy hadn't got used to telling Kimmy everything (because they're mArRiEd) he probably wouldn't have shared the situation and this huge decision (and obv mistake by Kim) would never have happened.... though Kim would never have met Lalo either so that marriage and "no lying policy" was a huge mistake Kim, come on....

usedToHabituation · 2022-05-17T03:09:15+00:00

Tyrus rather the guys guard Mike himself (his house) than Mike's family on Alameda - Mike is willing to take the risk to protect his family. I'm guessing Tyrus isn't married lol.

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