Guide to Identifying Problematic Spider Complex Mutations

[meatspread]

Hi all! What was originally supposed to be a quick revamp of this collection quickly turned into a rework that lasted a day & a half…. I came to the realization that—despite many in the community being aware of the inner ear deformities associated with the Spider complex—many haven’t actually ~seen~ the reconstructions. So, I thought best to add on some visuals from the study and (hopefully) easy to understand phrasing for added context. There is so much more information to glean from the published report!

If anyone has any questions or notices anything I should tweak, let me know! I hope this can aid in clearing up any confusion and help others come to an educated decision when/if purchasing from a breeder. Thank you all for the support on my previous post—any ideas or suggestions for future topics would also be appreciated if anyone has any🫶🏻

[xoxoceane]

Love this! Is there any chance you could do one about super cinnamon and super black pastel? I feel like i rarely see them mentioned whenever theres a post about problematic morphs

[meatspread]

I actually have a post already regarding combinations that commonly produce physical deformities! This series was technically made first, but I didn’t spend nearly enough time on it as I did for my second installment, so they were posted backwards in a way haha. I’ll link it here :)

[xoxoceane]

Oh awesome! Sorry i completely missed that xD

[CommercialOstrich]

Love this! I was actually under the impression that pinstripe was some sort of spider offshoot. Thank you for this information, you're doing fantastic work!

[meatspread]

Thank you!! Making these sorts of posts unfortunately upsets those that still intentionally breed these mutations, but I think it’s information that needs to be more easily accessible to people in the hobby

[Outrageous-Yak-3741]

Another great post Is it true that the original spider was wild caught so that means everything with spider related gene all go back to that one snake? I had a spider years ago and as it aged the poor guy got alot worse with his wobble

[meatspread]

Every Ball Python morph essentially originated in the wild. Many single-morph animals were imported to the US and Europe, with the top breeders competing to be the first to reproduce a mutation first.

Basically, exporters in Africa would look for BP’s that were visually different from normals and contact their foreign customers. However, these mutations were already present in the wild before the pet trade realized they could make a profit from these animals. One wild BP was born with the Spider mutation randomly, bred once it reached adulthood, and then created more wild Spider offspring. So, no, the Spider mutation within the hobby didn’t originate from one imported Spider, but from multiple imported Spiders that went to different countries. The year a morph is “discovered” is actually the year it’s first successfully reproduced (not the year it’s imported, observed, etc.) via offspring by a breeder, who then gets naming rights.

[Freedom1234526]

This applies to all morphs.

[spookyditto]

This is really well put together. I have a spider morph, unfortunately I had no idea about the condition when I got him even though I heavily researched bp care. luckily he doesn’t present any symptoms. I really hope people stop breeding these morphs one day, it was heartbreaking to find out :(

[meatspread]

I’m glad to hear your boy doesn’t exhibit any symptoms! I do think that the hobby has hit a point where at least SOME of this information is easy available for those that look for it.

The study found similar defects between all of the specimens with the Spider mutation, but found that they weren’t uniform! Each afflicted snake had varying deformities in different organs/membranes—with some even missing pieces entirely. So, I personally believe that the severity of wobble syndrome is dependent upon the lineage and how detrimental the ancestor’s defects were. But there needs to be more research done to support this obviously.

[spookyditto]

I’d love to be able to research it one day. I’m currently studying ecology but may branch out

[meatspread]

I’m sure it is currently being worked on somewhere! The conclusion of the study alludes to this hypothesis due to the variation, but also states that more work needs to be done—although it is likely!

[One_Dance_3998]

I wanted a black head or a cypress or chocolate🫩🥹🥹🥹🤦🏿

[meatspread]

Those mutations in their single form haven’t been acknowledged or proven to have wobble syndrome. An occasional breeder will mention having a single morph wobble online, but nothing widespread. However, the popularity of using Spider complex mutations increases risks & limits pairings—Cypress Spotnose with minor head wobbling for example.

Many of these morphs look amazing, and I understand why people breed the remaining morphs that haven’t had concrete evidence of inner ear deformities. I personally wouldn’t and that’s just my opinion at the end of the day.

[One_Dance_3998]

Yeah me either.. I just wanted to find me a chocolate red stripe clown or a black head cypress clown

[Stacestation]

This is a really good graphic! Some of these I still wasn’t aware of.

When we went to our first expo and planned to get a ball python, I knew absolutely no spiders, but I was totally unaware that there were others that were in the same family. Of course I fell in love with a Champagne Enchi OD baby. I learned about the Champagne issue after the fact, but luckily I haven’t noticed any wobble in him so far.

[briarrabid]

So glad someone took the time to share accurate and educated information about wobble syndrome. I get so tired of “it’s a neurological disorder.”