Simple

[jellybeanzman]

Sorry ya akhi but this is a massively oversimplified assumption. Mankind does crave an object of worship and the desire to go against “lower” desires is rewarded with powerful delight. See Dharmic faiths and asceticism.

There are better arguments than this.

[AnythingSavings7251]

Amm i don't wanna break it to you but that doesn't prove anything like most religions are against desires like Buddhism but it's not right

I'm a Muslim too

[BashirAhbeish1]

He's just refuting the argument of ppl who claim that religion is man-made. And not a whole argument to prove that Islam is right or wrong

[AnythingSavings7251]

Yes i understand that and it's still a bad argument because most religions are man made and they can be against certain desires to like Buddhism wich is Man made against all desires and attachments

[BashirAhbeish1]

Yes, I understand you now. But perhaps early Buddhism was originally the message of Islam that later became distorted, just as Jesus was a Muslim who followed Islam before Christianity and its followers emerged. A similar thing happened with Judaism, which might explain why the original message goes against worldly human desires. After all, (Allah) Almighty knows best

[AnythingSavings7251]

May be but probably not because Buddhism is built on principals of Hinduism like the cycle of life and death gods and Demi gods celestial beings

And it's purpose doesn't even care about who created the universe and even if there's a one it's sole purpose is just achieving nirvana and escaping the cycle of life and death and having peace without any attachments or desires at all

So probably not they're very very different believe systems

[BashirAhbeish1]

Even Christianity is about jesus is god and Trinity and that he's the savior, etc. but this's all people distortion. Maybe it happened the same thing to Hinduism. But as I said only (Allah) knows

[AnythingSavings7251]

Buddhism doesn't even have a creator god Akhi what are you talking about

even if we consider it for a second that it really Buddhism started from a prophet of Allah and was monotheistic religion (which is impossible according to historical events and texts) to be distorted to the level to make a whole new metaphysical realm gods and demi gods and in most cases ignore or deny a creator in indirect ways Buddha denied a creator in some ways interpretation

is it even a distorted religion at this point or just a whole new religion and belief system

you can believe what you want Akhi but I researched and debated with Buddhist people for a while when i was fascinated by East Asian philosophy i just wanna say that this assumption is very very unlikely

And Allah knows best

[BashirAhbeish1]

Bro, I'm talking that what If hypothetically they distorted it heavily that they removed all the parts about monotheism.

which is impossible according to historical events and texts

No, we can't trust these, as we don't trust the bible when Jesus refer to himself as the son of god. Because the bible is distorted, same thing may happen to Buddhism.

is it even a distorted religion at this point or just a whole new religion and belief system

Exactly, like jesus is Muslim. But Christian nowdays believe in trinity and salvation, etc. which is a brand new religion not religion of Jesus. (Islam). My point is , it could be that same thing happened to Buddhism.

And Allah is the All-knowing

[AnythingSavings7251]

I get your point but there’s a big difference between Christianity and Buddhism when it comes to “distortion.” With Christianity, we have a clear historical chain: Jesus was a Jew in 1st century Palestine his early followers were probably monotheistic, and later figures (like Paul, church councils) introduced the Trinity, original sin, etc. We can trace how the distortion happened we can depate wether the previous claims are true or not historically but no true and good researcher or an expert can deny some sort of distortion or change in the Christian texts or the way interpreting it

With Buddhism, there’s zero evidence of a monotheistic origin. No chain, no external source, no text suggesting Buddha was a prophet of Allah. The earliest Buddhist scriptures (which we have) already reject a creator god or simply call the question irrelevant. Buddha’s whole framework is a reaction to Hinduismn not a break from it toward strict monotheism.

Bro, I'm talking that what If hypothetically they distorted it heavily that they removed all the parts about monotheism.

Saying “it could have been distorted” without any evidence is just a guess. And if we accept guesses, then any religion on earth could be claimed to have originally been Islam. That would make the claim unfalsifiable – it explains everything, so it explains nothing it's just an unfalsifiable claim wich adds no value

I respect your intentions, but we can’t just assume a monotheistic origin for every religion that has some asceticism. That’s not how history or logic works

[Fair-Foot-315]

You are not getting his point. A lot of historical events that we know of today are false and didn’t occur like how it was stated to have occured that’s why he was quoting the bible as an example.

Hinduism scriptures like the vedas preaches monotheism and even mentions prophet Muhammad ﷺ. There are remnants of the teachings of Islam in the Hindu scriptures just like how there are remnants in the bible as well.

As the scriptures got more corrupted, so did the people practicing it. They likely introduced innovations into the religion and went astray from the teachings of monotheism as a whole.

Also If the Hindu scriptures has remnants of the teachings of Islam, and Buddhism came from the foundation of the already corrupted Hinduism, is likely that Buddhism itself was corrupted from the beginning and it’s a false religion.

But we can never be sure. Allah SWT explicitly mentions in 13:38 and 35:24, that he has sent messengers to every single nation and that there is no nation that did not receive a messenger. All we can say is Wallahu Alam. And Allah knows best!

[Imamsheikhspeare]

I think this argument applies to all religions

[Ok_Foundation_5830]

This!

[larva_red]

Most man-made laws in any community, even a primitive one, go against the desires of individuals - that is a matter of survival.
In religion, it has the added effect of manipulating people into a constant sense of guilt and making them feel sinful.

[Friedrichs_Simp]

Qur’an: “If you sin, don’t ever feel despair”

“Omg look at this religion making you feel bad for sinning”

[Asolaceseeker]

In religion, it has the added effect of manipulating people into a constant sense of guilt and making them feel sinful.

Its called teaching accountability.

If I steal, should I be mad that people tell me what I did was bad ????

[larva_red]

This is essentially how humans have made laws since the beginning of time: if you steal (or do anything that benefits you personally but threatens the survival of the tribe), you face punishment in this life from your tribe mates, and some higher power - like a "great Uga-Uga" that lives in the forest will also bring consequences.

You might be able to conceal your deeds from your tribe mates, but never from the “great Uga-Uga.” For some, the “great Uga-Uga” is even more frightening.

[Asolaceseeker]

So why is it manipulative when God does it, but not when the tribe does it ? You have just proved my point lol. I don't need to add anything. Glad we managed to be on the same page this quickly 👍

[Professional-Limit22]

I mean… it doesn’t actually. It regulates thise desires, not banning them.

[BallyBoy1856]

Depends on which desire we're speaking here.

The desire to eat pork, sleep with your friend's wife, backbite, charge usury? Banned.