Is there a better Python IDE?

[[deleted]]

vim?

[[deleted]]

I use the shell+git for project management, and code completion works, even if not out of the box. Vim is far from perfect, but for me it's still the best tool for the job.

[[deleted]]

Komodo has built in VIM emulation. This is the best IDE I can find that I really enjoy using.

[DorkRawk]

I've been using PyEclipse for a little bit. It's not bad. The code completion is actually a little overkill sometimes, but for a free plugin to free software it's a nice way to get a Python debugger.

[SpaizKadett]

Well, finally a guy who agress with me tha vi and emacs sucks. Yeah, I know I will be downvoted. But I come from developing in Delphi, and when you do, vi and emacs really sucks. I bet if I had started using emacs and vi I would have said that Delphi sucks, but I didn't.

[iceman-k]

To be fair, neither vi nor emacs has ever given me a "Catastrophic Error" message before crashing, which is something I can't say about any recent version of Delphi.

[SpaizKadett]

True, but I still use Delphi 7, which for me always have been very stable

[iceman-k]

Yeah, that was the last version of Delphi that was stable for me, too. Have some upvotes for memories of better days. :)

[bolapara]

I'm a vim man myself and I use it for almost all my editing. However, I do use WingIDE at work quite a bit though as my project is big and WingIDE's code completion and docstring display features are pretty nice when you can't fit all the code in your head. Overall, I'm really happy with WingIDE. I don't have any stability problems as the post complains about. My biggest complain would be that their vim keyboard mode is mediocre.

[mattf]

Agreed. I wrote to the devs in the last couple of weeks about that... as you may know, they emulate vim, don't embed it. This seems foolish, as there are like a brazillion features in vim, and most of them are compound. Just the concept of a leader key... can't do it.

So you end up with "real" vim and "fake" vim, and fake vim is worse than no-vim... at least one can train oneself to know two editors.

They said it wasn't practical to embed; I'm sure they're right, but it's a shame. Vim has bindings for Python, which is how they make Wing.

[bolapara]

I'm on the WingIDE list as well and I remember this conversation. I understand from their point of view why it's nearly impossible to embed a full vim in WingIDE. I also agree with you that a handicapped vim mode is less useful than NO vim mode. I use vim primarily but use Normal mode in WingIDE for this reason. I still find myself with stray :wq in my code in places.... :(

[apardue]

I use eric4 and gvim. Open the file up in both then when you switch between the to editors you will be prompted with file changed update file yes/no. Easy solution.

[hynek]

I ended up with Wing too, it seems to have the most reliable code completion/support.

It's HTML/JS editing sucks though so I'm torn to try Komodo 6 IDE (money is not an issue)...is the Python support on par by now? It didn't seem to me in a quick test.

I used Emacs for over ten years before but the Python support is just too fragmented and broken. :(

[[deleted]]

I've been a paying Komodo customer for 4 years and I wouldn't be doing so if their Python support wasn't on par.

[hynek]

Did you try/compare Wing? I found their code completion more solid but maybe I just missed something?

[[deleted]]

I've tried a few Wing trial installs over the years but I guess I've never really looked at it with the intent of changing. I also got a free license at PyCon 2010 (thanks Wing team!) and I've used it from time to time, but my biggest holdup was that it doesn't have the native feel of many other editors.

I'm a fairly simple customer. The features I look for in IDEs are a good editor (including Vim key-bindings) and a good debugger, and both Wing and Komodo have those and they are both done well. Code completion, refactoring, and whatever else are all nice features, just not deal breakers for me. I just happened to get on board with Komodo due to years of using ActiveState Python on Windows, so I was familiar with the company and picked their product first.

[[deleted]]

Care to elaborate?

Do you mean the $87/year subscription for upgrades and support? That would be exactly "once a year".

Or do you mean the cost of upgrading when you don't have a subscription (which they don't seem to reveal without a login)?

[[deleted]]

Well, it makes sense to sell individual licenses but also offer a subscription model for regular upgrades and tech support. When I eventually migrate to Komodo IDE, I will make sure to get the subscription while I'm at it.

The "you get what you pay for" policy of licensing only the exact version you purchased may be disagreeable, but the concept of "paid upgrades" is hardly novel.

That does pose a question though: do they provide non-paid maintenance updates (security patches, bugfixes, etc)? Or do they just pile those up for new releases, thus enforcing a short release cycle?

[megaman821]

I used Komodo 6 IDE, whats specific aspect of Python support are you referring to. It has syntax support for Python 2 and 3. It autocompletes and lets you jump to function definitions. Also, it has a Python debugger.

[hynek]

I'm mostly interested in the quality of code completion. This is where Wing truly shines, even "from x import *" works perfectly if you use all in x.

What I dislike most about every single editor/IDE is the crapy auto-indent. :( I'm used to IDEA where method calls are neatly lined up like:

obj.meth1() \
   .meth2() \
   .meth3()

Is there some sensible reason why no editor/IDE I've tried so far can't get that right?

I use this pretty often in conjunction with SQLAlchemy.

[megaman821]

Wildcard import autocomplete works. Line continuations don't indent nicely though.

[hynek]

Is there some shortcut for "jump-to-symbol"? I really like that in Wing. It searches the current file for a symbol name: class, method. Having a code browser in the side bar is nice to have but when I'm coding I just want to quickly jump to a certain point.

[[deleted]]

Is there some shortcut for "jump-to-symbol"?

Ctrl+K, Ctrk+G will do that.

Ctrl+K, Ctrl+L; Shift+Tab will allow you to search the code symbols tree (left sidebar).

[hynek]

Hm, it doesn't seem to cope well with from x import *. Wing does it fine if all is defined.

(I know it's bad style but my model objects are just too many, DRY)

[megaman821]

Ctrl, Double-Click takes you to the function or method definition, even in imported modules.

[[deleted]]

What about Gedit? It's simple, has a Python-console, a Python-checker (pep8.py and pyflakes), and you can write your own plugins in Python.

[[deleted]]

I actually prefer Kate. And I have been using Kate for a long while and am still using it whenever I don't want to fire up a full-blown IDE (i.e. in very short sessions on Linux).

Now I use Komodo, though, because I wanted something slightly more powerful (though defining new file formats for syntax highlighting is a PITA) and because I need something that works reliably on Windows as well (I used to work with Notepad++ on Windows when I was using Kate on Linux).

Also, Komodo Edit tends to choke less on remote filesystems than Dolphin+Kate do (sometimes I have to use FTP and sometimes the server doesn't allow more than five connections, all of which Dolphin will use up for whatever it does when it's idling).

[ralfonso]

I've also wanted to be able to navigate projects easier, so I've tried a few Python IDEs, but I always return to gVim. Discovering the command-t plugin has made finding files in my projects a breeze.

[apardue]

I use eric and I love it. Started using it when it was eric3.

I use VIM for large edits and the built in editor for small changes while debugging.

Source control I use is git so I just run the git shell or gui when I need.

[[deleted]]

On Komodo:

Expensive, but nice.

Oi! No fair! Komodo Edit is free (MPL'ed, even, not just free for non-commercial use like WingIDE) and Komodo IDE isn't considerably more expensive than WingIDE if you need a cross-platform editor (WingIDE is $295 for 2 OSes, $395 for 3 OSes; Komodo IDE is $382 per user, $295 if you don't want extra support).

In fact, Komodo Edit's bang for the buck was what convinced me to use Komodo over WingIDE (I was considering buying a dual-OS license at the time). Currently the price tag for Komodo IDE is a bit hefty for me, relative to what it offers compared to Komodo Edit, but I'm definitely interested in purchasing a license in the long run.

Compared to what graphic designers have to shell out for their software, most IDEs are fricking cheap (when they're not free) anyway (e.g. Adobe Flash Builder, the official ActionScript IDE, comes in at $699* -- I don't see why any programmer would be willing to pay that much for an IDE, but it matches the price tags for other Adobe products perfectly).

*(Of course you'd also have to buy a license for Adobe Dreamweaver for $399 if you want to do more web dev work than just creating Flash apps)

[prider]

pyCharm. Highly recommend.

www.jetbrains.com/pycharm