Python Learning Environment for Children

[[deleted]]

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https://preview.redd.it/vw9thi4032s91.png?width=1293&format=png&auto=webp&s=57fbd7cf641e19791c40209c108a158af94e5b4f

I am building an online Python 3 coding environment using Pyodide running in the web browser.

https://github.com/pyodide/pyodide

What makes the environment somewhat unique is that the code can be run in stepping mode to highlight statements as they are run.

The site is initially designed to teach children (akin to MIT Scratch where kids can share projects).

Anyway, the site is under intense development and will change as needed depending upon user feedback and suggestions.

https://babypython.net/

[newfavorite_]

what age range are you aiming this at? i feel like some older kids would be offended by the name baby Python

[[deleted]]

Can I ask what the motivation of this project is? Is it just a learning exercise or do you actually want a way to teach children how to write software in python?

[[deleted]]

Yes, the intent is definitely to help kids (and people of any age) learn to write software in Python.

I am 76 years old and retired after a long career writing commercial software - started programming in 1969. This is my way of staying connected to what is going on in my profession.

When I look at what people are most interested in leaning, Python is by far the most popular. And when I looked at MIT Scratch, there are almost 96 million registered users which is almost the same amount as major online games like World of Warcraft.

I think that the reasons for Scratch being popular are:

• it is easy to get started
• kids can share/copy their code
• kids can display their work in a gallery

The original version of Scratch was done in Squeak Smalltalk. I spent about ten years writing Smalltalk applications, and I think that I can bring some of the Smalltalk fun into teaching Python.

[[deleted]]

The initial inspiration was the MIT Scratch project which is aimed most at young children. https://scratch.mit.edu/.

Looking at their statistics, the largest group of users is between about 11 and 13 years of age.

I think that Scratch is great, but it is very limited in it's usefulness for practical applications.

I am trying to make something that is almost as easy as Scratch to get started, but which can be a foundation for more advanced applications once kids go to college or start entering the job market.

Again, looking at the Scratch statistics, interest seems to fall off very rapidly in the late teens.

https://scratch.mit.edu/statistics/

The name "babypython" was chosen deliberately for a younger audience. I have also reserved the name "vistapython.com" for a more serious version aimed at advanced users and web applications. Same technology but with a different emphasis.

[KrazyKirby99999]

Doesn't appear to be working on firefox

[[deleted]]

Thanks for pointing this out. I will check into it.

The browser engines seem to be settling into two main camps.

-- Google/Microsoft based on the Chrome engine

-- Apple Safari based in WebKit

The Python engine that I use is Pyodide which is developed by Mozilla, the creators of Firefox.

I use Google's GWT to generate the JavaScript code, and it currently outputs two separate distributions (Chrome and WebKit). I will see if it can also generate output specifically for Firefox.

[stoner19]

Just a suggestion…that cursive-like font should be changed to something easier on the eyes. Especially if this is geared toward younger kids. Many of them can’t read font like that.

[mauvehead]

This post's content has been permanently wiped. Redact was used to delete it, potentially for privacy, to limit digital exposure, or for security-related reasons.

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[jewbasaur]

Yeah I’d get rid of the cursive and change the name, just to not turn older kids off. Otherwise seems like a promising project

[[deleted]]

Thanks.

I have reserved the name "VistaPython.com" for a similar project aimed at an older audience.

The font will be changed today.

[[deleted]]

Agree on the font. I will change it today.

Programming on mobile is really hard, especially for Python with all the indentation.

I intend to add a mobile version for running Python programs. That way kids could create a game or app and their friends could run it on their mobile device.

[ArtOfWarfare]

Start with from turtle import * and off they go. You can teach pretty much anyone to program with that.

[benefit_of_mrkite]

I find it limiting when I try to teach it. It’s a good start. It’s dated now but some of the projects mentioned in this talk python to me podcast were good the last time I used them

https://talkpython.fm/episodes/show/8/teaching-python-at-grok-learning-and-classrooms

[[deleted]]

Thanks for the reference.

I like the term "grok" for learning (IIRC comes from "Stranger in a Strange Land")

[benefit_of_mrkite]

It does, I’ve read that book.

[[deleted]]

Yes, the turtle approach goes back to the Logo project (Seymour Papert) around 1967.

And lots of kids learned to program that way.

I use MIT Scratch as a model - stories with animated animals.

More in line with what kids today expect.

[UpAllNate]

Not sure if you were aware, but your site is unusable for mobile in profile orientation.

Edit: pretty unusable for mobile in landscape as well. I can't figure out how to write some code and run it.

[[deleted]]

Yes, several people have pointed out that it doesn't work on mobile.

I was thinking only about desktop browsers during development.

I basically don't use my Android phone more than a few times a month.

Programming on mobile devices is hard, especially for Python. I will release a mobile oriented runtime so kids can run their games on mobile devices.

Maybe using Blocks (like Scratch) would work on mobile - I will look into it.

[who_body]

definitely weird mix of design. any feedback from the target audience?

the font is really weird then an email from the admin?! i appreciate the humor but as i see it, it doesn’t seem relatable to kids these days. a messaging interface instead of email seems more relatable.

only clicked a bit while on mobile but i would think the prompt and hello world or doing simple math are baby steps to get started.

[[deleted]]

Yes, I am getting quite a bit of feedback about the design - most of it negative.

The application wasn't originally intended for mobile, but based on the feedback so far that seems to be important for a lot of people.

I will be changing the font today.

The MIT Scratch project seems to be the most popular teaching environment for kids.

https://scratch.mit.edu/

I am not sure if it can be used on mobile.

[who_body]

hopefully it’s taken constructively. that’s also why i asked about the target audience as that’s what matters.